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-   -   Rifled slugs in the smooth bore? (https://www.huntingnet.com/forum/whitetail-deer-hunting/256887-rifled-slugs-smooth-bore.html)

Dozen Arrows 08-09-2008 08:19 PM

Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
I bought an 870 combo it comes with both the rifled barrel has twists in it and a smooth bore barrel for turkeys and small game. I am new in the world of shotguns.

My question is I bought some Remington slugger rifled slugs thinking that I should use them for my rifled barrel with twists in it. However, when I read the box on the slugs it tells me NOT to use them in a demascus or rifle twisted barrel.

Should I keep these and just use and use them in the smooth bore barrel that was desinged for small game?

I really do NOT want to have to spend $12 for a box of 5 rounds compared to the $4 that I paid for these.


bugs11 08-09-2008 08:33 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
Guy at work has an 1100 with a rifled slug barrel. He shoots the cheap rifled slugs out of it and he says the accuracy is acceptable. He might only run 10 roundsthrough the 1100 tops a season. Healso cleans the barrel real well at the end of the season.

Bugs.

Dozen Arrows 08-09-2008 08:45 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
That won't wreck the rifled barrel? The warning on the box was very animate about it?????

dog killer 08-09-2008 09:58 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
DON'T USE RIFLED SLUGS IN A RIFLED BARREL,USE SABOTED SLUGS

USE THE RIFLED SLUGS IN A SMOOTHBORE, CAN BE USED WITH A MODIFIEDCHOKE OR IMPROVED CYLINDER CHOKE. NOT A GOOD IDEA TO USE FULL CHOKE AS SOME ARE TOO TIGHT.

ALSO DON'T USE THE SABOTS IN A SMOOTHBORE, UNLESS YOUR USING A RIFLED CHOKE TUBE

slug technology has come a long way but all barrels shoot differently
so you may have to test a couple different brands to see which one your gun shoots the best. my 11-87 smoothbore shoots a 2 inch group at 100 yds using the cheap winchester 2 3/4 in. slugs through an improved choke tube.i'm happy with that !!!

Dozen Arrows 08-09-2008 10:23 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
So I can keep the same smooth bore rifle that I have for small game but I just have to get a new choke for it? I would be happy with 2 inch groups at 100 yards from a shot gun also since thisshotgun will be used for deep woods probably averaging only 50 yards or so.

I guess I will have to get some sabots tomorrow and worry about the special choke later. How much does a choke run me and is it rocket science to apply to the barrel?

Robert L E 08-10-2008 12:12 AM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
Shooting rifled slugs in a rifled barrel will not harm the barrel. It may lead it up a bit making cleaning difficult though. A rifled barrel does not improve the accuracy of rifled slugs so the rifling benefit is wasted. Another reason for the warning is that they make more profit on sabot slugs which DO get improved accuracy from a rifled barrel.

At 50 yards, a smooth bore with rifle sights, shooting plain old rifled slugs is more than accurate enough. Far more accurate than most people think. I have two 870's and I opt for the smooth bore partly because I am not willing to spend the money on the sabots. I may only shoot one round out hunting but I shoot at least 20 at the range. My last two shots in the field have each killed deer. Both were about 65 yard quartering shots, one towards me and the other away, both offhand. I hit both deer within an inch or two of where I was aiming so I have confidence in the gun and slug combination. I think that confidence is a big factor in accuracy, I do not second guess myself as I pull the trigger. (My range shooting also includes offhand practice.)

Rifle sights (or scope) on the barrel ARE important though. A bird bead may seem accurate at the range but that accuracy seems to fly away in the field when you are not aiming at paper.

Bob

Frank in the Laurels 08-10-2008 04:46 AM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
I did some serious testing from the bench last summer on this topic, bought about 10 different kinds of 5 paks... cleaned the gun after each 5 paks..let it cool down etc..the clear winner was the FEDERAL TRU_BALL by leaps and bounds in my smooth bore with a mod. choke installed... even with a 1-4 power scope they easily grouped out to 100 yards better than all the others.. If you can find them, which is not easy to do sometimes, give em a try.. BY the way, on game performance, no deer took a step once hit with one.. awesome..

bugs11 08-10-2008 08:11 AM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
I have a police 870, 18" barrel, cylinder bore, and bead sight. I'm good out to 50 yards with it shooting rifled slugs. 30 yards was the longest shot I've ever had to take with it. I'd like to get a DRS barrel for it, but with the type of hunting I do I can't justify the expense. Actually what I really want is an 1100 or a Benelli semi-auto.

jrbsr 08-10-2008 08:27 AM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 

ORIGINAL: Dozen Arrows

I bought an 870 combo it comes with both the rifled barrel has twists in it and a smooth bore barrel for turkeys and small game. I am new in the world of shotguns.

My question is I bought some Remington slugger rifled slugs thinking that I should use them for my rifled barrel with twists in it. However, when I read the box on the slugs it tells me NOT to use them in a demascus or rifle twisted barrel.

Should I keep these and just use and use them in the smooth bore barrel that was desinged for small game?

I really do NOT want to have to spend $12 for a box of 5 rounds compared to the $4 that I paid for these.

Where did you buy the Remington slugger rifled slugs at ?
Maybe they would swap them for sabots.
Just an idea ;)

I hope they will. Good Luck.

Paul L Mohr 08-10-2008 08:39 AM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 

ORIGINAL: Robert L E

A rifled barrel does not improve the accuracy of rifled slugs so the rifling benefit is wasted.

Bob
Really!? Your going to have to explain the theory behind that one to me. Any time you spin a projectile it will be more stable at longer distances. And the fins on a rifled slug don't actually impart any spin to the slug, they are there so the slug crushes and will fit through different sized chokes. They remain stable in flight because of the weight forward design, much like a shuttle cock in badmitten. They actually make foster slugs to be shot out of rifled barrels. I used to use Brenneke Gold Magnums.

I have owned both rifled barrels and smooth bores and shot various rifled slugs out of both. There is definitely an accuracy advantage with a rifled barrel over a smooth bore. My smooth bore was lucky to get 3 inch groups at 50 yards. My H&R ultra will clover leaf rifled slugs at 100 yards. Until the barrel fouls out that is, which is about 4 or 5 shots.

Shooting rifled slugs out of a rifled barrel will not hurt it, it just makes one hell of a mess when you clean it. It will take you much longer to clean it as well. The advantage of the newer sabot rounds is they actually perform better on game and will have more range than a rifled slug. Most of the sabot rounds are controlled expansion type bullets designed for game, where as a rifle slug is just a huge chunk of lead pretty much. Also a 1 ounce 50 caliber bullet will be longer than a full bore 1 ounce slug so it should be more stable in flight and have a better BC I believe.

The rub is they are very expensive. This is why I went back to my muzzle loader. It is just as accurate (more accurate actually) and doesn't cost as much to shoot.

And don't expect 2 inch groups out of a smooth bore with foster slugs. Not saying it can't happen but it certainly is not the norm. Most can't get that kind of accuracy with a rifled barrel, premium sabot rounds and a scope.

Paul

Hurricanespg 08-10-2008 02:37 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
Shooting rifles slugs out of a rifled barrel will not hurt the barrel, but it will lead up the grooves in the barrel.

2 Lunger 08-10-2008 03:01 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
My question is, why shoot rifle slugs out of a rifled barrel? Common sense tells me that if you shoot enough of these out of a rifled barrel it is eventually going to damage it.

bugs11 08-10-2008 03:44 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
The reasoning from the guy at work, shoots Sluggers in his 1100 with a rifled barrel, was:
1. Rifled slugs were plenty accurate out of his rifled barrel.
2. He doesn't shoot a but handfull or so a season.
3. They're cheap.
4. He cleans his barrel at the end of the season.
5. Why spend more when you don't need to.

Paul L Mohr 08-10-2008 04:29 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
It's not going to damage it as long as you clean it. It is no different than shooting lead bullets out of a muzzle loader, or a pistol or a rifle. Many hand gun ranges force you to use non jacketed bullets and .22 rimfires use all lead bullets. Lead is a fairly soft material and barrels are made of hardened steel. Rifles shoot copper jacketed bullets at much higher pressures without damaging the barrel and the copper alloy is harder than lead.

And don't believe that sabots don't foul out a barrel either, you still need to clean out all the plastic that will get in the grooves as well. I would say more rifles are ruined by improper cleaning than what was shot through them.

The saboted bullets biggest advantages are they have better ballistic coefficients and normally perform better on game than a large chunk of lead. It also lets you shoot a lighter projectile with more stability if you want to.

Dozen Arrows 08-10-2008 05:24 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 

ORIGINAL: jrbsr


ORIGINAL: Dozen Arrows

I bought an 870 combo it comes with both the rifled barrel has twists in it and a smooth bore barrel for turkeys and small game. I am new in the world of shotguns.

My question is I bought some Remington slugger rifled slugs thinking that I should use them for my rifled barrel with twists in it. However, when I read the box on the slugs it tells me NOT to use them in a demascus or rifle twisted barrel.

Should I keep these and just use and use them in the smooth bore barrel that was desinged for small game?

I really do NOT want to have to spend $12 for a box of 5 rounds compared to the $4 that I paid for these.

Where did you buy the Remington slugger rifled slugs at ?
Maybe they would swap them for sabots.
Just an idea ;)

I hope they will. Good Luck.
They might, but I will be only getting 2 boxes back for the 6 that I turn in, LOL. Awe heck, I am probably just going to do that and get the sabots. Two and a half boxes to sight in and three rounds to kill deer. Besides, I have the other barrel for fun stuff like skeet shooting and such, Good stuff :)

Ed McDonald 08-10-2008 07:24 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
I have been shooting rifled slugs out of a rifled barrel for about 10 years . My mother gave me something when I was a kid to help eliminate the lead buildup . It was a bucket of Elbow Grease !

bugs11 08-10-2008 07:55 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
"perform better than a large chunk of lead"??? I beg your pardon...

The last deer I hit with a large chunk of lead, a Federal rifled slug out of the riot gun,was at 25 yards running away. I hit the doe right in the back of the neck, the large chunk of lead flipped that deer over like a flapjack.

But, outbeyond70 yards or sothe sabots definitelyhave the edge in ballistic performance.

Bugs.

sjsfire 08-10-2008 08:02 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 

ORIGINAL: Ed McDonald

I have been shooting rifled slugs out of a rifled barrel for about 10 years . My mother gave me something when I was a kid to help eliminate the lead buildup . It was a bucket of Elbow Grease !

Thats right! I've been doing it for 26 years. My lasttwo shotgundeerwere taken with my 1187 and a cantilever rifled barrel with a Nikon scope. 125 yards and 127 yards with the $1.99 a box Remington Sluggers.

bugs11 08-10-2008 08:21 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
sjsfir,

Day-amm... 125 and 127 yards!!! That's some shootin'. What did the recovered slugs look like?

Bugs.

Dozen Arrows 08-10-2008 08:45 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 

ORIGINAL: Ed McDonald

I have been shooting rifled slugs out of a rifled barrel for about 10 years . My mother gave me something when I was a kid to help eliminate the lead buildup . It was a bucket of Elbow Grease !
LOL! I am diggin' the avatar DRILL INSTRUCTOR! :D

sjsfire 08-11-2008 08:42 AM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 

ORIGINAL: bugs11

sjsfir,

Day-amm... 125 and 127 yards!!! That's some shootin'. What did the recovered slugs look like?

Bugs.

Never found them but I would have liked to. Both thru shots heart and lungs.

Rebel Hog 08-11-2008 09:06 AM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 

ORIGINAL: sjsfire


ORIGINAL: Ed McDonald

I have been shooting rifled slugs out of a rifled barrel for about 10 years . My mother gave me something when I was a kid to help eliminate the lead buildup . It was a bucket of Elbow Grease !

Thats right! I've been doing it for 26 years. My lasttwo shotgundeerwere taken with my 1187 and a cantilever rifled barrel with a Nikon scope. 125 yards and 127 yards with the $1.99 a box Remington Sluggers.
10-4, No Doubt!:)...................I had a 200+ rifle range for 30+ years here at home and I use to bust burnt out flood lamps and place all shots within a 6" pie plate @ 150+ yards with an FNBRN A-5 w/Hastings Rifled Barrel R/S and Win BRI Sabots.

Robert L E 08-11-2008 09:50 AM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 

ORIGINAL: Paul L Mohr


ORIGINAL: Robert L E

A rifled barrel does not improve the accuracy of rifled slugs so the rifling benefit is wasted.

Bob
Really!? Your going to have to explain the theory behind that one to me. Any time you spin a projectile it will be more stable at longer distances. And the fins on a rifled slug don't actually impart any spin to the slug, they are there so the slug crushes and will fit through different sized chokes. They remain stable in flight because of the weight forward design, much like a shuttle cock in badmitten. They actually make foster slugs to be shot out of rifled barrels. I used to use Brenneke Gold Magnums.

I have owned both rifled barrels and smooth bores and shot various rifled slugs out of both. There is definitely an accuracy advantage with a rifled barrel over a smooth bore. My smooth bore was lucky to get 3 inch groups at 50 yards. My H&R ultra will clover leaf rifled slugs at 100 yards. Until the barrel fouls out that is, which is about 4 or 5 shots.

Shooting rifled slugs out of a rifled barrel will not hurt it, it just makes one hell of a mess when you clean it. It will take you much longer to clean it as well. The advantage of the newer sabot rounds is they actually perform better on game and will have more range than a rifled slug. Most of the sabot rounds are controlled expansion type bullets designed for game, where as a rifle slug is just a huge chunk of lead pretty much. Also a 1 ounce 50 caliber bullet will be longer than a full bore 1 ounce slug so it should be more stable in flight and have a better BC I believe.
Paul-
It is my understanding that most rifling in 12ga shotgun barrels is designed for the 50cal sabots and not an optimum rate for foster type slugs which are, of course, a full 12ga. I shoot open sights so, in any case, my equipment is more accurate than I am. I personally don't see an improvement, nor a degradation, of accuracy while using fosters. Almost all articles that I have read also say that a rifled barrel is mostly wasted on fosters. My smooth bore is designed for fosters, a "deer barrel", and at 50 yards any brand of foster slug will do.
You are right about everything else you wrote so you are probably right about this too.



ORIGINAL:Frank in the Laurels

I did some serious testing from the bench last summer on this topic, bought about 10 different kinds of 5 paks... cleaned the gun after each 5 paks..let it cool down etc..the clear winner was the FEDERAL TRU_BALL by leaps and bounds in my smooth bore with a mod. choke installed... even with a 1-4 power scope they easily grouped out to 100 yards better than all the others.. If you can find them, which is not easy to do sometimes, give em a try.. BY the way, on game performance, no deer took a step once hit with one.. awesome..
Frank- I too like the Tru-Ball slugs but I thought that they did not make them any more. I have not found them since the first two years of introduction. I've been saving the remaining ones that I have for actual hunting.

Bob

Paul L Mohr 08-11-2008 02:47 PM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
The twist rate is actually for a heavier full bore slug, that is why they tend to not shoot the light fast slugs very well. Normally most slug guns with a 1 in 35 inch twist rate tend to shoot 1 ounce slugs around 1500-1800 fps pretty well.

Some of the newer guns are coming out with faster twist rates, I think H&R may have even changed theirs. I know browning uses a faster twist rate.

I believe the rifled barrels and choke tubes were originally designed to extend the distance of existing Foster and full bore lead slugs. Then Sabots started to get popular.

I actually got better groups with some 3 dollar a box fosters than I did with some of the 15 dollar high tech sabot rounds. I just feel the modern the XTP controlled expansion bullets work a bit better on game then lead slugs do. Both will kill deer though.

Paul

Kid 08-12-2008 10:54 AM

RE: Rifled slugs in the smooth bore?
 
Count me among those who haveshot Foster style slugs from a fully rifled barrel for years with no ill effect. While I've heard many people say it will "ruin" a barrel, no one has ever been able to explain to mehow a soft lead slug at low pressure and only about 1600 FPS was going to damage a modern chrome-moly barrel. When i ask, the answer is invariably "that's just what i have always heard". As far as the accuracy goes, foster style slugs shoot much better out of my 870 Wingmaster with a fully rifled factory barrel than they do out of my 870 slug combo with a smooth barrel. I do most of my deer hunting on the ground, so shots tend to be within 40-50 yards, as a result i never felt the need to buy the much more expensive sabot slugs. In my experience the relatively huge frontal area of a 12ga. Foster slug (about .730 inches) combined with their relatively heavy weight makes them devastating at the short ranges i use them at. They absolutely kill like the hammer of Thor! For the few times i might encountercircumstances where i might need more range, i just break out my CVA Optima Pro. Withas much success as i have had with them, I'll continue to use Foster style slugsin my slug gun. ;)


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