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baiting response
Baiting with corn is really no different than putting down food plots, scent attractions, mock scrapes,trails, or water sources. All of these methods you are taking advantage of the fact that the deer will tend to come to them because it is easier for them. As hunters we need to support all forms of hunting and not attack each other for our chosen methods.
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RE: baiting response
I don't like any of those. But that's just me.
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RE: baiting response
I use corn by the 55 gallon drums myself, but nothing else.:D
You must be looking for a debate;) |
RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: halfrack VIII Baiting with corn is really no different than putting down food plots, scent attractions, mock scrapes,trails, or water sources. All of these methods you are taking advantage of the fact that the deer will tend to come to them because it is easier for them. As hunters we need to support all forms of hunting and not attack each other for our chosen methods. Baiting also helps spread disease better than any of the other methods. And has a greater chance of permantly and negatively altering deer patterns/behavior. That's not even something that can be debated. The only debate is the ethics of using it or any of these other methods. It's not outlawed in many areas because it makes it easier for hunters, its outlawed because it is bad for the herd. |
RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: mnbirddog ORIGINAL: halfrack VIII Baiting with corn is really no different than putting down food plots, scent attractions, mock scrapes,trails, or water sources. All of these methods you are taking advantage of the fact that the deer will tend to come to them because it is easier for them. As hunters we need to support all forms of hunting and not attack each other for our chosen methods. Baiting also helps spread disease better than any of the other methods. And has a greater chance of permantly and negatively altering deer patterns/behavior. That's not even something that can be debated. The only debate is the ethics of using it or any of these other methods. It's not outlawed in many areas because it makes it easier for hunters, its outlawed because it is bad for the herd. |
RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: bryant1 I would agree halfheartly with your opinion, but only in the region implied. In Florida the areas with a sustained high population of deer also are well supplemented with corn- Do you consider this just a coincidence? |
RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: mnbirddog ORIGINAL: bryant1 I would agree halfheartly with your opinion, but only in the region implied. In Florida the areas with a sustained high population of deer also are well supplemented with corn- Do you consider this just a coincidence? |
RE: baiting response
Abstract: We conducted experimental feeding using 3 feeding methods (pile, spread, trough)
and 2 quantities (rationed, ad libitum) of shelled corn to compare deer activity and behavior with control sites and evaluate potential direct and indirect transmission of infectious disease in whitetailed deer (Odocoileus virginianus) in central Wisconsin, USA. Deer use was higher at 2 of the feeding sites than at natural feeding areas (P <= 0.02). Deer spent a higher proportion of time (P < 0.01) feeding at pile (49%) and spread (61%) treatments than at natural feeding areas (36%). We found higher deer use for rationed than ad libitum feeding quantities and feeding intensity was greatest at rationed piles and lowest at ad libitum spreads. We also observed closer pairwise distances (<= 0.3 m) among deer when corn was provided in a trough relative to spread (P = 0.03). Supplemental feeding poses risks for both direct and indirect disease transmission due to higher deer concentration and more intensive use relative to control areas. Concentrated feeding and contact among deer at feeding sites can also increase risk for disease transmission. Our results indicated that restrictions on feeding quantity would not mitigate the potential for disease transmission. None of the feeding strategies we evaluated substantially reduced the potential risk for disease transmission and banning supplemental feeding to reduce transmission is warranted. http://www.bioone.org/perlserv/?requ...6-543&ct=1. And from the other stuff I have looked at in the last few minutes, it looks like CWD isn't really bound by climates. New Mexico to Canada. Just hasn't reached everywhere yet. And Bovine TB is WORLDWIDE, though scattered. So again, I didn't see anything that would shield Florida from these diseases. |
RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: halfrack VIII Baiting with corn is really no different than putting down food plots, scent attractions, mock scrapes,trails, or water sources. All of these methods you are taking advantage of the fact that the deer will tend to come to them because it is easier for them. As hunters we need to support all forms of hunting and not attack each other for our chosen methods. As long as it's legal in the state you hunt I could care less. Food plots, scent attractions, mock scrapes, etc are not illegal in Illinois. Baiting with corn or any other kind of food is. I know a guy who always leave some corn standing through deer season. Is it legal? According to how the law is written it is. Do I agree with the way he hunts.......NO. |
RE: baiting response
Source: Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission Contacts: Dr. Mark Cunningham (352) 955-2230 After extensive testing, the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission (FWC) has not found any evidence of chronic wasting disease (CWD) in the state’s white-tailed deer population. The FWC tested 636 free-ranging deer during the past year and more than 3,000 deer during the past five years, with no CWD-positive results. FWC’s wildlife veterinarian Dr. Mark Cunningham said, “While we can never say that Florida is entirely free of the disease without testing every deer, this sample size gives us very high confidence that if CWD is present in Florida, it is at low levels. However, even low numbers of CWD-positive deer would be cause for concern, so we plan to continue testing for the foreseeable future.” CWD is a contagious neurological disease that has been found in captive and wild herds of mule deer, white-tailed deer and Rocky Mountain elk within several Midwestern and Western states. The disease causes degeneration of the brains of infected animals, resulting in emaciation, abnormal behavior, loss of bodily functions and death. Thus far, no Southeastern states, including Florida, have been hit by the deer disease. To reduce the chances of CWD turning up in Florida, the state prohibits importing carcasses of any species of deer, elk or moose from 14 states and two Canadian provinces where CWD has been detected. States and provinces currently with CWD include New Mexico, Utah, Colorado, Wyoming, Kansas, Minnesota, Oklahoma, Montana, South Dakota, Nebraska, Wisconsin, Illinois, New York, West Virginia, and Alberta and Saskatchewan, Canada. Visit the United States Department of Agriculture’s Web site at www.aphis.usda.gov/animal_health/animal_diseases/cwd for the most up-to-date CWD reporting. “Early detection is the key to limiting the spread of the disease, if such an outbreak should occur in Florida,” said Deer Management Section leader Dr. Robert Vanderhoof of the FWC’s Division of Hunting and Game Management. Once again, this hunting season the FWC is turning to hunters and members of the public for assistance in helping monitor the state’s deer herd for CWD. “We’re asking hunters to report any sightings of sickly or scrawny-looking deer, or deer dead of unknown causes,” Vanderhoof said. “If you see such a deer, call toll-free 1-866-CWD-WATCH (293-9282). Please do not handle the deer. Wildlife biologists will respond, and if necessary, collect deer tissue for testing. It’s important to contact us as soon as possible, because such testing must take place within 48 hours of a deer’s death to yield reliable results. |
RE: baiting response
No offence to those who bait but i would rather find and hunt the sign and natural food source more of a challenge to me (mo) and more rewarding but thats just me if you wanna bait thats up to you if its legalgood luck to all
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Just out of curiosity, hasn't CWD been found in some states that it is illegal to bait????
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RE: baiting response
Im not sure, I'm sure somebody will. In MN baiting is illegal, and that fact does very little to stop baiting. It seems like nearly the majority of hunters in northern MN bait. Down here it's not so prevelant, but it still does happen. That doesn't mean that it should be legalized, though.
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RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: halfrack VIII Baiting with corn is really no different than putting down food plots, scent attractions, mock scrapes,trails, or water sources. All of these methods you are taking advantage of the fact that the deer will tend to come to them because it is easier for them. As hunters we need to support all forms of hunting and not attack each other for our chosen methods. If it makes you feel any better over here in NY, there absoulutley murdering the fishing, a fluke needs to be 20.5"!!! and can only keep 4, while your state its like 18" and 8... all i can do is laugh at NY... there are clearly PETA members runing the show. |
RE: baiting response
I found alot of this interesting, especially the transmitting of disease. I am planting food plots for the first time this year on a piece of land that I lease. My plots are less than 1/2 acre and hold clover, turnips, and corn. Less than 1/2 mile are farms with soybeen, corn, alfalfa, etc. that cover hundreds of acres.The persimmon trees in my yard attract more deer than throwing corn,should I cut them down?Hunting with baitis illegal in VA where I hunt within a certain distance from bait. I will not be setting up stands on the plots themselves but ambushing corridors where the deer travel.
Is my 1/2 acre plots contributing to the spread when Im that close to agriculture? I never thought it would, but I guess having a pile of corn in a feeder where many eat from would. I have never hunted managed property before, until this year. I cant stand to watch a TV show where they are picking these deer off while feeding. I would rather stop one in its track with a grunt, but thats just MHO. Interesting debate! |
RE: baiting response
Wheather you place bait or God grows an oak or apple tree, maybe your a farmer grows crops to sell, get my point?
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RE: baiting response
I am a Michigan hunter and not too fond of baiting. The state limits hunters to a small amount (I believe no more than 2 gal. at any site) however this doesn't seem to stop some people from throwing tons of bait out. It does make it a bit tougher when all your deer are drawn across property lines. I have been working on better bedding so I can at least ambush the deer when they are on the way to the feed bag! Some of the camps claim they "have to bait just to keep up with the neighbors." I say to each his own as long as they are abiding by the law!
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RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: jiminns Wheather you place bait or God grows an oak or apple tree, maybe your a farmer grows crops to sell, get my point? Most of the time, if your hunting in an area with crops, there are crops everywhere. Field after field, mile after mile of corn, soybeans, alfalfa, etc. That’s not the case with someone baiting… Sure there may be some other bait stations, but not on the same scale… If someone is hunting a 320 acre cornfield, take 320 feeders and spread them out over 320 acres of pasture etc.… Try and pattern those deer now… That would be closer comparing apples to apples – so to speak…. |
RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: Hoyt_Viper I found alot of this interesting, especially the transmitting of disease. I am planting food plots for the first time this year on a piece of land that I lease. My plots are less than 1/2 acre and hold clover, turnips, and corn. Less than 1/2 mile are farms with soybeen, corn, alfalfa, etc. that cover hundreds of acres.The persimmon trees in my yard attract more deer than throwing corn,should I cut them down?Hunting with baitis illegal in VA where I hunt within a certain distance from bait. I will not be setting up stands on the plots themselves but ambushing corridors where the deer travel. Is my 1/2 acre plots contributing to the spread when Im that close to agriculture? I never thought it would, but I guess having a pile of corn in a feeder where many eat from would. I have never hunted managed property before, until this year. I cant stand to watch a TV show where they are picking these deer off while feeding. I would rather stop one in its track with a grunt, but thats just MHO. Interesting debate! The deer were here before we got here and will be here when we are gone... For the record....If you do want to "bait", don't pile it up, use a seeder....;) It takes them a little longer to brouse through the area that way... I'll give you guys a good reason for baiting...Since I farm, I can kill deer any time I have a crop in the field that is being damaged, I can even use a light if I so choose... So, here comes hunting season and I'm getting the crops out of the field....I've got hunters coming in, wanting to see deer....Isn't it better to "seed" a little corn back into that cut corn field and harvest and use the resource we have (that have been getting nice and fat off MY crop all summer), then to go out there in the middle of August and kill them and leave them laying to rot.... We have so many deer in NC that this year we had an unlimited doe season, all season long, tags were free... |
RE: baiting response
Thanks. Its interesting to hear that you farmers can kill anytime, all the time.I live in a rural area, and have several acres on my home, and the law is that on your private property you can do what you want. Ive heard gunshots on the farms all year long. I certainly understand the pressure that feeding deer herds can do to crops.
My purpose for the food plots is simple. The hunt clubs run dogs all gun season, and for several months before and after training the dogs. They frequently run onto my property. I catch them and call the owners and bitch them out for running my deer around, making them walk on eggshells all year long. I want to create an environment where they have all the staples of a comfortable living environment. I leave their bedding areas alone, and provide them food so that they will "settle down" on my property. I never considered the food plots as "baiting" but rather feeding them so they dont have to be run by dogs 24/7. On the other hand, I do take offense to people that will take 50lb bags of molasses corn and pile up two days before sitting in their stand 25 yrds away. I understand your point of how its different for every state and person. Just like I read a thread on how many years, and how many deer killed. Its pathetic that someone hunts for 5 years and has killed hundreds of deer...as a hunter, not a farmer. Anyway, as I said, this debate is interesting. |
RE: baiting response
Don't even get me started on dog hunting....We can't keep the dang things off our property...I told the warden one day "So I own a million dollars worth of property and any little snot nosed dog hunter can come by and drop his dogs off on the road by my farm and there isn't a damn thing I can do"...
Only one way to legally stop or curtail the dog hunters, kill every deer that they run by you so they will pick up their dogs and move to another property, they hate it when someone kills a deer in front of their dogs... I had a group of hunters drive over 200 miles one morning for an afternoon hunt, got them all set up and 45 minutes before sundown a pack of 12-15 deer hounds came chasing one little old 75 pound doe through the farm....They were livid.... |
RE: baiting response
Yes Illinois
ORIGINAL: timbercruiser Just out of curiosity, hasn't CWD been found in some states that it is illegal to bait???? |
RE: baiting response
Illegal to bait anything here in California and also Arizona. So baiting for me was never really a issue because I have never done it.
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RE: baiting response
I have read an intereseting arcticle from a biologist that suggested it was the way the corn was piled up that was the reason that transmittal was happening. I dont ever pile my corn up anyway, I always spread it out to mimic natural browsing. This spreading of the corn on the ground and minimizing the use of high capacity feeders was suggested to lessen the spread of CWD by the biologist. These ideas are sound suggestions to me.
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RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: nchawkeye Don't even get me started on dog hunting....We can't keep the dang things off our property...I told the warden one day "So I own a million dollars worth of property and any little snot nosed dog hunter can come by and drop his dogs off on the road by my farm and there isn't a damn thing I can do"... Only one way to legally stop or curtail the dog hunters, kill every deer that they run by you so they will pick up their dogs and move to another property, they hate it when someone kills a deer in front of their dogs... I had a group of hunters drive over 200 miles one morning for an afternoon hunt, got them all set up and 45 minutes before sundown a pack of 12-15 deer hounds came chasing one little old 75 pound doe through the farm....They were livid.... Sounds like loopholes in the state laws to me or lackluster law enforcement. By Florida law, if your dog trespasses it can cost you a $500 dollar fine. Let your law enforcement write out a couple of those tickets and i bet your problem would cease to exist. |
RE: baiting response
Around here if we see a dog chasing a deer we can shoot it, half the year at least. Public or private land. Warden or law enforcement can shoot them any time of year if they are seen chasing deer. Still fascinated by the difference in hunting cultures around the country.
);self.focus();) |
RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: mnbirddog Around here if we see a dog chasing a deer we can shoot it, half the year at least. Public or private land. Warden or law enforcement can shoot them any time of year if they are seen chasing deer. Still fascinated by the difference in hunting cultures around the country.
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RE: baiting response
bryant...We have owned these farms over 40 years, the game warden can't stop them from releasing dogs beside our land...They can lease a 200 acre tract in the middle of a 6,000 acre tract and turn them loose...We have talked with the game warden several times, who covers several counties, and he says legally there is nothing we can do until the hunters actually set foot on the land, it's a joke...These guys line the road with their pickups and take pot shots from standing on top of the dog box, with their CBs they can warn each other when the game warden is in the area...
Another local law is that they can legally spotlight fields before 11pm, so they ride around and look for bucks to chase the following morning...They can't stand it that someone else might be trying to manage for big bucks... It is also a felony in NC to kill a deer hound and illegal to set traps before the end of deer season...It won't change until they outlaw dog hunting, and this will be sooner rather than later...We are no longer a "local" community where everone knows their neighbors and these "outsiders" are as sick of it as we are... We have 5 different hunting clubs in the county and have gone to each and spoken to them, it does no good, they always blame another club... It also doesn't help that some of the county commissioners and the sheriff are dog hunters.... |
RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: bryant1 ORIGINAL: mnbirddog Around here if we see a dog chasing a deer we can shoot it, half the year at least. Public or private land. Warden or law enforcement can shoot them any time of year if they are seen chasing deer. Still fascinated by the difference in hunting cultures around the country.
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RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: nchawkeye bryant...We have owned these farms over 40 years, the game warden can't stop them from releasing dogs beside our land...They can lease a 200 acre tract in the middle of a 6,000 acre tract and turn them loose...We have talked with the game warden several times, who covers several counties, and he says legally there is nothing we can do until the hunters actually set foot on the land, it's a joke...These guys line the road with their pickups and take pot shots from standing on top of the dog box, with their CBs they can warn each other when the game warden is in the area... Another local law is that they can legally spotlight fields before 11pm, so they ride around and look for bucks to chase the following morning...They can't stand it that someone else might be trying to manage for big bucks... It is also a felony in NC to kill a deer hound and illegal to set traps before the end of deer season...It won't change until they outlaw dog hunting, and this will be sooner rather than later...We are no longer a "local" community where everone knows their neighbors and these "outsiders" are as sick of it as we are... We have 5 different hunting clubs in the county and have gone to each and spoken to them, it does no good, they always blame another club... It also doesn't help that some of the county commissioners and the sheriff are dog hunters.... Wasn't this a thread about baiting with corn when it started out anyway? |
RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: bryant1 ORIGINAL: mnbirddog Around here if we see a dog chasing a deer we can shoot it, half the year at least. Public or private land. Warden or law enforcement can shoot them any time of year if they are seen chasing deer. Still fascinated by the difference in hunting cultures around the country. 
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RE: baiting response
Sounds fun! Not many people hunt hogs with dogs in my hunting club anymore. The timber company here wanted an eradication of them because they were destroying pine trees and spreading disease among them too. I have been promised a hog hunt with dogs from a friend in cross city during the summer so i cant wait for that. here piggy piggy piggy:D
Come on down i got plenty of room in my truck to introduce someone to deer dogging:D |
RE: baiting response
CWD isn't bound by climates. All it needs is a warm blooded host(s) to proliferate. It is predominant in areas that allow baiting and where penned deer or ruminates for that matter are kept in close proximity to one another. . The reason you don't see it in the north is because deer densities are usually much lighter, so one doesn't have that overcrowded, close animal to animal contact like southern climes where overpopulation is prevalent.
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RE: baiting response
Take the bait and toss it. Become a real hunter and learn to hunt, learn the woods, learn deer movements. I call bait hunters "Y2K Hunters", not your fault you don't know any better. Nothing like going out hunting and earning your deer the way it is meant to be.......I hunt New Jersey and 99% of the state allows baiting, and these "Y2K Hunters" kill alot of deer and then claim they are great hunters, I'm just happy the area I hunt, baiting is not allowed, and I still harvest a few bucks per year...Its called hunting
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RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: BOWHUNTERCOP Take the bait and toss it. Become a real hunter and learn to hunt, learn the woods, learn deer movements. I call bait hunters "Y2K Hunters", not your fault you don't know any better. Nothing like going out hunting and earning your deer the way it is meant to be.......I hunt New Jersey and 99% of the state allows baiting, and these "Y2K Hunters" kill alot of deer and then claim they are great hunters, I'm just happy the area I hunt, baiting is not allowed, and I still harvest a few bucks per year...Its called hunting  ) |
RE: baiting response
Switchback XT, RipCord Rest, HHA OL-5500 Sight,
Carbon Express Maxima 250 Arrows, Muzzy 3 Blade 100gr. Broadheads, T/C Omega, Leupold VX-II 3-9X40, 250gr. Sabots Remington 11-87, Leupold VX-II 3-9X40, Lightfields Slugs Mossberg 835 Turkey Shotgu When you throw all this stuff away and make your own bow & arrow from sticks and rocks, and then track and stalk your prey, then you will be a REAL hunter. Dont bash someone for throwing out some corn and such to attract a deer to a particular location. I would be willing to bet that you have hunted a fields edge, or near oak trees, this is essentially useing bait because you know the deer will get hungery and come to one of these spots eventually.We try to give ourselves every advantagewe can to harvest an animal, doe pee, cover scents, etc. I would think twice before you start labeling people. |
RE: baiting response
I kill deer every year some over bait and some not and they all taste the same.So everybody should hunt how they want as long as it's legal and about the spread of desease,it's legal to bait in KY and we have'nt had a single case of CWD even though 14 states and two canadian provinces have reported cases of it and I think I read that two states near us that dont allow baiting both have CWD reports,west virginia and illinois,but not here yet,or atleast not bythe end of the reporting last year.feed them corn and kill'em all,if thats what you want to do,just keep hunting and support your fellow hunters,no matter how they hunt as long as they dont break the laws,division among our fellow hunters is the first sign of weakness and there are groups that look for our weakness to destroy or rights as outdoorsmen and women.
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RE: baiting response
Dont get me wrong...I am all about hunting with what works. I have food plots, and my original post was the debate. We have had confirmed CWD cases here, and I was concerned about the ethical ramifications of my growing corn, alfalfa, clover, etc. I have hunted with dogs, usually later in the shotgun season...hell my best friend has 14 blueticks and walkers.
My disgust is that others around you just dont get the fact that dogs are hard to contain when hunting. Down here they say a day out hunting with your dogs, is another out hunting your dogs! I was on my hunting land a month after season ended tilling and burning brush, and at midnight there were 3 hounds running deer through my land. I caught one of the dogs and called the number on the collar, and the guy just said..."oh, they will come back when they are tired of running". Not everyone wants to hunt with the dogs...all of the time! Especially when Im bowhunting and setting up on a trail, I get real ticked off when hounds are chasing deer around off season. If you raise or hunt with dogs...just respect the hunter on the land next to you. Keep them penned up while out of season, and invest with radio collars so you can locate them and get them back in the box! My two cents! Im done! |
RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: Hoyt_Viper Dont get me wrong...I am all about hunting with what works. I have food plots, and my original post was the debate. We have had confirmed CWD cases here, and I was concerned about the ethical ramifications of my growing corn, alfalfa, clover, etc. I have hunted with dogs, usually later in the shotgun season...hell my best friend has 14 blueticks and walkers. My disgust is that others around you just dont get the fact that dogs are hard to contain when hunting. Down here they say a day out hunting with your dogs, is another out hunting your dogs! I was on my hunting land a month after season ended tilling and burning brush, and at midnight there were 3 hounds running deer through my land. I caught one of the dogs and called the number on the collar, and the guy just said..."oh, they will come back when they are tired of running". Not everyone wants to hunt with the dogs...all of the time! Especially when Im bowhunting and setting up on a trail, I get real ticked off when hounds are chasing deer around off season. If you raise or hunt with dogs...just respect the hunter on the land next to you. Keep them penned up while out of season, and invest with radio collars so you can locate them and get them back in the box! My two cents! Im done! EDIT: sorry, I thought when you said you started the debate you were the one that started the thread. But still, what is it that you are trying to say. I really like this debate, so I really want to see some counterpoints to my statements.;) |
RE: baiting response
ORIGINAL: johnnybravoo77 When you throw all this stuff away and make your own bow & arrow from sticks and rocks, and then track and stalk your prey, then you will be a REAL hunter. Dont bash someone for throwing out some corn and such to attract a deer to a particular location. I would be willing to bet that you have hunted a fields edge, or near oak trees, this is essentially useing bait because you know the deer will get hungery and come to one of these spots eventually.We try to give ourselves every advantagewe can to harvest an animal, doe pee, cover scents, etc. I would think twice before you start labeling people. |
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