In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

You are King of hunting Utopia. You control Utopia's large deer herd. You make the hunting laws. Which, if any, of the following will you disallow or limit hunting with/overbecause you thinkit is unethical? Why?

Of those activities you do not select, what makes them ethical?

For clarification - "Trophy" hunting is hunting by people only for the largest trophy animals. "Meat" hunting is hunting by people concerned with filling their tags, with no regard to the size/age of the deer.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

I don't have a problem with any of it. I could manufacture a situation for each item which would make it unsatisfactory though. However, since I am king, I'll allow it all on a case-by-case basis subject to my review and specific approval.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

I voted for dogs. I did it because last year on the first day of dog season I was waiting out a buck in a tree line when the guy on the adjacent property let loose what sounded like 10 dogs in the woods. They ran through very close to me and spooked the deer I was waiting on.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

I do not like High Fences, and Certain weapons. The high fences is unfair chase for me. The deer has all his sense to fight against you but a high fence means he couldn't run away. Certain weapons would be limited for saftey reasons.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

Since I’m king, I would make it interesting and more of a challange. Baiting , High fence , dogs and semi-autos would be disallowed.

#1- I see no need for baiting if food plots would be allowed.

#2- High fence is made to keep domestic animals in , not wild game

#3- Dogs can spoil the hunt for other hunter as mentioned. If a drive is the game, let a party of hunters do the push.

#4- No semi-auto , why ? just because I am king...

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

I don't really have a problem with any of it.

When it comes to trophies though, I think some consideration should begiven to where taken.Taking a trophyon a game ranch is gonna be easierthan on your brother-in-law's 640 acre corn farm, which is gonna be easier than public land in competition with thousands of other guys who don't have access to private land.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

I voted against trophy and meat hunting simply based on your definitions. If you hunt exclusively for large mature bucks then does will overpopulate. If you hunt for meat simply for "filling their tags, with no regard to the size/age of the deer"you are probably going to be shooting a lot of immature bucks.

I also voted againsthigh fences. I don't have problems with them where they are allowed but in Utopia you won't have the need for high fences to keep the low life bums out and we will have QDM on the entire place so no need to worry about a high fence.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

Where is the option for none? I wouldn't want to disallow any form of legal hunting or legal hunting accessory, whether I like certain styles or not is irrelevant if I'm against it and disallow it I am basically part anti. Whether it is anti-high fence hunting, anti dog hunting, anti stand hunting, oranti bait hunting. They all contain two words I don't like(when used together),anti hunting, and I would not want my reign as king to be associated with that term, no matter what the word in between themhappens to be. But you can fetch me someslow roasted venison tenderloin, some squash casserole, and some skin on mashed potatoes. I'll be washing that down with a nice 96 Penfolds "Bin 407" Cabernet Sauvignon(wait a second, I'm king, why am I stil drinking $30 a bottle wine?) Cancel the wine, bring me a 12 pack of Budweiser and a bottle of Cuervo "1800" I think I might fight the court jester later(he's really not that funny and he's been plucking my nerves lately).

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

No Bait, Fences, Dogs, or Foodplots(depending on other factors).

Any deer you wish to shoot, do it. One man's 'preference' does not trump another.

Stands, blinds, camo, scent control(or lack thereof) is all acceptable.

Being King, I control who comes in and who doesn't. I am a big advocate of other hunters not infringing on others. People MUST respect anothers space.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

What he's saying is that it's only legal if YOU say so. This is a chance to step out of the 'if-it's-legal-I-have-no-problem-with-it' cloud and actualy give an opinion on YOUR ethics.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

Yeah I got it. Basically another thread for people to talk about the kinds of hunting they don't like, what a new concept. I don't think that someones ethics or moral values are compromised by using different hunting styles. A person can be an excellent father, husband, good member of the community,but then theygo hunt over a pile of bait or some fenced ranch or use dogs and now they have poor morals and bad ethics? I'm not into that train of thought, I try to keep things in perspective and I don't think how or where someone chooses to kill a deer defines their moral character most of the time. Ethics by definition is the disciplinedealing with what is good and bad, a set of moral principles or values. The principles of conduct governing an individual or a group. To be ethical is to to conform to professional standards of conduct. I wouldsay that those standards and principles governing us (hunters) as a group are the laws and rules of of your state and Dept. of Game, as far as hunting goes anyways. That doesn't mean that you have to fully agree with everything and you have the rightand ability to not participate in anything that you have a personal problem with, but that doesn't necessarily make it unethical.I don't kill deer over bait or in high fences but I don't think someone that does is doing something bad or unethical and I guess that is why I neverget the point of these threads. Now ifthat person drank a bunch of liquor all night, stole the gun he was using, and dropped off a hooker on the way to his stand which wason a fenced enclosure over a bait pile, then I would say he might be unethical but not because of the fence or the bait. It's all about perspective and of course this is just my opinion.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

I voted agianst high fences, trophy hunting, and meat hunting. In my Utopia everybody shoots does and nobody shoots immature bucks. Dogs are OK , but you only get a 3 day season in late December, you must have at least 1,000 acres, and all other regulations must still apply. Bait, in my opinion is not much different from a food plot, accept I don't think it works as well, and in my Utopia there is no CWD. By the way, I think the big CWD scare was mostly BS any way. I know it's real disease, but I don't think it will destroy our deer herds.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

In a perfect world YOU won't be hunting MY deer, I will be. And if I'm not worried about pleasing others I will do whatever it takes to take the game I want.

Paul

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

Thw word 'ethics' may be thrown around a little too much, butthis threadwas talking about how you'd rule the land if given 'your' way.......Has nothing to do with raising children, alchohol abuse, felony theft, illegal prostitution, or community relations. I'm not sure how that part got going.....geeesh.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

Throw me in that "if it is legal and you have no personal problems (ethical) with the method of hunting then go for it" crowd.....Enjoy and have a good time.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

I know I was running with the ball a little bit there(I was bored out of my mind at work)but mainly my point was that ethics are beat to death on this site on a regular basis. And since there will never be an individual ruling over a hunting utopia this just looked like another thread for people to tell the kinds of hunting they don't like and their own personal stance on what kinds of hunting practices are ethical. So I put what my definition of ethics is and how it applies to hunting(to me) and because ofmy perspective on the ethics topic and how I relate that to hunting I stated I wouldn't really want to disallow any of thepoll options.I think a good thread might be if you won the powerball lottery of 300 million dollarsand could buy a 25,000 acre ranch how would you set it up(or something like that). It's almost as unlikely as the hunting utopia but it is possible. Anyway just my .02,....... over and out.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

I voted against bait, since I do consider that cheating, unless you're hunting bears or hunting wolves.

I think food plots are fine, I have hunted foodplots once and come up empty.

I don't see why any weapons should be banned for hunting deer, since in Utopia we train our kids to be marksmen at the age of 4, and also we make buck fever seem like nothing, since we fire .460 Weatherbys behind them while they shoot their gun at a target, so they have to overcome distraction, and shaking from getting scared, and these kids are so smart and tough in American Utopia, that they overcome, and so they can kill a deer with a .223 or a .17 HMR, because they are skilled enough to do so.

Camo, Scent Control, Stands/Blinds/Box Blinds, and Trophy and Meat Hunting are fine, hunting is about, well, hunting, not just about the deer (Though I do admit hunting wouldn't be the same without deer, lol)

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

I don't see a single item on the list that I would consider "unethical", but there is one that "I" consider poor sportsmanship. Since I am "KING", I will BAN EVERYTHING except stand/blind, trophy and meat hunting, and I will allow any weapon over 22 cal and under 50 cal.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

.22 caliber centerfire or rimfire?
What about muzzleloaders and shotguns? Some of them are over .50 caliber.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

What makes bait cheating and food plots not? Aren't they both designed to attract deer?

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

Those of you that voted against high fences, what makes a high fence unethical? What if the ranch is 25,000 acres and only the perimeter is fenced?

What if at the boundaries of Utopia, hunters just outside of Utopia are not practicing QDM? They follow the philosophy of "if it is brown, it is down", which starts negatively impacting your Utopia deer herd. You have no powers outside the boundaries of Utopia to prevent this. Does your answer change?

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

As far as 22 caliber, my "law" is just what I said. Nothing 22 caliber or under is allowed.

As far as the 50 cal rule, that only applies to centerfire weapons. I will allow muzzleloaders in 45 cal and up, and shotguns will be allowed for use with either buckshot or slugs.

In handguns, the same "over 22 cal and under 50 cal" rule does apply.

As far as archery, no broadheads under 100 gr will be allowed, and the bow must exceed a 50# draw weight.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

I would do away with high fences! I personally don't think of it as sporting!

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

Food Plots, are actually a food source of the deer, it's like hunting antelope over a waterhole in the desert, unlike bait, which doesn't enhance antler growth, or help the does produce largernumbers of fawns, or enrich the soil.

I just think food plots are actually beneficial to the preservation of the hunting environment, whereas bait is not.

RE: In the perfect world.... (another ethics poll)
 

I voted Bait, High fences and Dogs. They're just things I don't see as needed to tag a deer. I realize that the Dog thing is a regional deal too. I've never liked the idea of hunting deer, or most anyother big game animal, with a dog or dogs.