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NRA does do for hunters....
For those who wanted to know what the NRA has done for hunters. Here are some examples of why it's important for Hunters to support the NRA, because of what they do besides protecting our Second Amendment. All of the below examples can be seen in the March 2007 edition of American Hunter. NRA Bylaws, Article II Section 5: To promote hunter safety, and to promote and defend hunting as a shooting sport and as a viable,and necessary method of fostering the propagation,conservation,and wise use of our renwable natural resources. NRA Outreach: Many NRA staff also hol seat on prohunting organizations. Wayne Lapierre..National Fish and Wildlife Foundation Randy Kozuch..Virginai Dept of game and Inland Fisheries Susan Recce..Sporting Conservatio Council,U.S.Dept. of the Interior, AmericanWildlife Conservation Partners, Association of Fish and Wildlife Agencies, and D.C.-based hunting and conservation ad hoc group Bill Poole..Association of Fish and Wildlife Agencies The NRA is a Coprorate member of the Professional Outdoor Media Assoc., Western Outdoor Writers and Southeast Press Assoc. Examples of NRA-ILA advocacy for Hunters. Passed Right -to- Hunt constitutional amendments Passed dove hunting legislation and referenda Passed bear hunting seasons in Maryland and New Jersey Passed Sunday Hunmting in Ohio and other states Passed Hunter Bill of Rights Passed No-Net-Loss legislation to protect public hunting lands. Passed laws protecting hunting guns and ammo Passed legislation to protect gun ranges in 46 states Stopped mandatory licensing of duck huters as boat operators Stopped Kerry bill that would have outlawed Remington 11-87 and other hunting shotguns. Sponsored laws prohibiting hunter harassment in all 50 states. Grant Funding: Shooting Sports Camps....$327,778 FFA.....................................$390,945 Range Development...........$7,599,681 4-H Clubs............................$6,019,412 Boy Scouts of America......$3,186,955 NRA Youth Hunter Education Challenge...$892,230 Now Again for those non-believers... Who or What organization contributes more to Hunting than the NRA? |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
Shooting Sports Camps....$327,778
Last I checked, shooting sports camps promote recreational shooting sports, not hunting. FFA.....................................$390,945 Smallbore recreational shooting competitions - again, not hunting. Range Development...........$7,599,681 Gun ranges for shooting enthusiasts. I can't hunt at the gun range. Maybe you can, but I can't. 4-H Clubs............................$6,019,412 Nice for the agricultural kids - again - not hunting-related. Boy Scouts of America......$3,186,955 Again, nice for the kids, maybe tangentially promoting conservation, but Boy Scouts aren't a hunting organization. NRA Youth Hunter Education Challenge...$892,230 More veiled attempts to promote shooting sports and convince the standard outdoorsmen that the NRA cares about hunting. Cost/benefit campaign aimed at raising $$ and convincing guys like you that the NRA is a hunting rights group. __________________________________________________ ________________________________ Failed again, Trykon. As much as you hate to admit it, you know that I'm right. The NRA is a second Amendment rights group. Nothing more, nothing less. The mere fact that a few NRA officers serve a dual role on other boards that DO promote hunting/conservation proves my point. If the NRA was so great for hunters, those guys wouldn't have to serve in a dual capacity. ...and just so you know, the NRA, no matter how much they like to toot the horn, they never "passed" anything or "Stopped" anything. That's legislators making decisions based on voting demographics. Frankly, it bothers me that the NRA claims to have "passed" any laws - seriously, how stupid do they think we are? I'm not saying that the NRA doesn't support gun rights, believe me, they do. You just keep trying to paint the zebra brown and call it a horse. Look at what they're doing - promoting SHOOTING. Shooting and Hunting are two very different things. Obviously, they're not mutually exclusive, but they're different. You just can't seem to get over that fact, Trykon. It's this simple: If you want to support hunting, you joint a hunting/conservation lobby. If you want to support the second amendment, you join the NRA. If you're joining the NRA thinking that they're saving your deer season, you're sorely mistaken. Let it die man. You're wrong, and you know it. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
Failed again, Trykon. As much as you hate to admit it, you know that I'm right. The NRA is a second Amendment rights group. Nothing more, nothing less. I suppose we are to believe you are smarter than all 4 million plus NRA members? Come On, I hope your arguments in court will be better than those on hunting net bashing posts on th NRA. It's obvious Fran that you have an agenda. I see you removed your name from your profile.... Trying to hide the real person? Your the one who's failing at your repeated attempts to discredit the largest organization we have as both hunters and Second Amendment supporters. Remember all one has to do to see the real you is look at your post history. Your exposed in your own words for all to see. Who's Failed? |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
What's the matter, Tryk - can't respond to my assertions, so you have to get personal? Nice.
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RE: NRA does do for hunters....
Quik,
You're right about assertions, that is all you did, was make them. Does the NRA use scare tactics to get money - sure they do. Do they blow things our of proportion - sure they do. Do they help us keep our 2nd right - sure they do. There are a lot of folks who live in this country that would love to see our rights go away. And by the way, the 2nd amendment wasn't talking about hunting, that was a given. Our forefathers would have fell over laughing if they heard that was going to be taken away. It is about the right to bare arms, so that the American people can fight its own Government if it becomes too powerful and stops representing the people of this fine country. I don't support the NRL, at least not financially, but I guess I should. Their stuff gets thrown away with the rest of the sob story mail. Just my opinion, but I'd say that hunting and recreational shooting go pretty much hand in hand, I mean that is why I shoot, you know recreationally, to practice for hunting. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
What's the matter, Tryk - can't respond to my assertions, so you have to get personal? Nice. Personnal? I said what everyone knows. It's not personal, sorry you took it as such. Maybe your a little thin skinned(personal) I don't know. Oh and nice PM. I see the fact that I stated about your putting things down for all to see made you think twice about your posts.Just like when you get frustrated youalways claim "personal attack" Its the same old playbook over and over. You might think your the smartest person on this board, but your not. You have said on more than one occasion that people can't resond or keep up with you on your posts. Insinuating that your so smart and the rest of us are somehow beneath you and your superior intellect. That makes you arrogant and very foolish. And by the way I'm not your Bro. And your PM is lacking any form of maturity whatsoever. You couldn't bother me in the least. And I have a hard on for noone. Don't flatter yourself. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
What's the matter, Tryk - can't respond to my assertions, so you have to get personal? Nice.
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RE: NRA does do for hunters....
Hey Trykonoisseur,
I think this from your post, is easily understood. NRA Bylaws, Article II Section 5: To promote hunter safety, and to promote and defend hunting as a shooting sport and as a viable,and necessary method of fostering the propagation,conservation,and wise use of our renwable natural resources. If this is not a good example of the NRA working for hunters as well as other gun owners... then somebody is missing the point. Come on.... to promote & defend hunting.... how clear can you make it? Good post man. DW |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
Sure bro,just likeExxon says it's their mission to promote alternative sources of fuel and hybrid technology.
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RE: NRA does do for hunters....
quik; Why the apparent chip on your shoulder about NRA? I agree that they are first and foremost a 2nd Amendment/shooting organization, but you seem to think they do nothing at all for hunting/hunters. I think shooting/hunting are so closely related that whatever someone is doing to promote one is, at least peripherally, helping the other. Here's NRA's Hunter Services webpage:
http://www.nrahq.org/hunting/ |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
What's the matter, Tryk - can't respond to my assertions, so you have to get personal? Nice. LOL at first I thought you double posted, but I see your imaturity is rearing it's ugly head once again. And in public! Way too funny:D By the way if and when you respond to some of my assertions then I might consider reponses to your drivel. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
MORE Relationships between the NRA and Hunters............
Supported lowering minimum age requirements to encourage new hunters Supported conservation programs on farm lands that improve wildlife habitat Supported "OPEN FIELDS", state programs that provide incentives to land owners who open their to hunters and anglers Supported the Pittman Robertson Act to increase oversight and accountability of fund managers Supported Federal Legislation to open up huntingoppourtunities for disabled Americans Stopped onerous law enforcement regulations thet threatened hunting on millions of acres and federal lands managed by the Bureau of Land Management Advocated for federal agencies' use of hunters when game populations need to be reducedoutside of hunting season Signed a partnership agreement withthree federal land management agencies and 39 NGO's to protect,support and enhance acess on public lands Should I go on? Here's more.http://www.nraila.org/media/PDFs/NRA_hunting.pdf Oh I forgot! We are supposed to believe that the NRA programs and websites and magazines and monies donated are all just a scam of some sort. Totally laughable and you'd have to be purposely closing your eyes due to a political or other agenda. It's a plain as the nose on your face. There is a connection between the NRA and Hunters, besides the Second Amendment. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
Quicksilver is one of those Zumbo supporters. Is it all that supprising that he wouldn't support the NRA.
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RE: NRA does do for hunters....
Even though I live in California which has fairly restrictive gun control laws, by far my biggest frustration is not the ability to buy a firearmbut finding a quality place to hunt. I was once an NRA member but their endless pleas for money becameincreasingly annoying. Before I went to medical school I was a Foreign Service Officer with the U.S. Department of State and when the "jack booted thugs" remark was made I decided I did not want to be associated with an organization that felt that way towardsmy co-workers and myself.
I insteadhave joined Ducks Unlimited. DU does much more for hunters than the NRA does, and I can be assured that my contributions to DU are going to be used in a way that will provide more game and more places to hunt. I am not indifferent toSecond Ammendment concerns but from my vantage point the biggest threat to the future of hunting is not loss of access to guns but the disapearance of placesfor average peopleto hunt. Caldoc |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
I respect your view and can understand your frustration with the requests for donations. But that is a necessary part of defending and supporting our causes. Noone is going to automatically just send in extra dollars without some sort of solicitation. It is very simple to call and ask them to place your name and membership # on the Do Not Solicit list. I can also understand that the DU organization is your choice of an organization to support, but no way do they spend as much or lobby as much in congress for hunters than does the NRA.
DU is primarily a wetlands and waterfowl organization. Some of what they support and do will benefit other game species , but no comparison can be made in dollars spent on various aspects of hunting and conservation and education. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
CalDoc: While the term "Jack Booted Thugs" may have been a tad over the top, it didn't refer to anyone who worked for the State Department. That was a reference to certainBATF agents and in light of their participation in the Branch Davidian and Weaver incidents, wasprobably afair description of some of their tactics. After all, who, other than a jack booted thug sniper, wouldshoot a woman holding a baby in the back?
A little perspective on the JBT comment, from a "liberal" writer: The Ethical Spectacle, July 1995, http://www.spectacle.org Defending NRA Rhetoric A lot of fuss was made after the the Oklahoma City bombing about the NRA's use of phrases like "jack-booted thugs" to describe federal agents. The thesis was that the NRA was promoting violence against federal agents by demonizing them with this kind of rhetoric. Now, I believe that the NRA is a dangerous and dishonest organization, because of where it spends its money and the laws that it supports. So I was ready to jump on that bandwagon, when I realized that those bashing the NRA for the "jackbooted thugs" quote were laboring under an immense double standard. In a recent article, I called the CIA a "serial killer in the basement of government". There is no moral difference between this statement and the NRA's "jackbooted thugs". The only argument that I can think of, that I am not knowingly addressing an audience of gun owners and the NRA is, won't wash. The minute we start trying to differntiate identical speech based on the audience it is addressed to, we are in a world of double standards. I believe in the elimination of double standards, not their promotion. Did I make a mistake with my "serial killer" rhetoric? I don't believe so. I think the statement is well within the borders of normal, lively expression of strongly held beliefs. So is "jackbooted thugs." No-one bashed me for my "serial killer" remark, and those criticizing NRA conveniently forget that BATF, the target of the "thugs" remark, was badly out of control in both the Branch Davidian and Weaver incidents. Most of us would likely welcome an investigation into the abuses of a law enforcement agency, if we weren't so fearful that a far right wing agenda was being advanced in the process. But it is a strange day when the left in America defends police brutality and the abuse of power. Unlike the NRA, I believe Randy Weaver was-- is--a criminal. But he was entitled to his day in court. The sniper killing of his unarmed wife, with her baby in her arms, was shocking. The FBI should have to explain it. If it is not murder, it is at least homicide committed in gross negligence of human life. To defend the rights only of criminals and suspects precious to the left, and to allow BATF and the FBI to have a field day with those of the far right, mires us in an unconscionable double standard. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
I have to agree with tryk on this one. As far as DU, PF, and NWTF (which i am a member of as well as the NRA), well
DU does much more for hunters than the NRA does |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
I am no longer a NRA member, I was for over 10 years until they got worst thana tV evangelist trying to get every dime thier members have.
So I put my time and money it to groups like DU and the NWTF. I servied on the local commitee on both and was I Jakes Coordinator for 3 years, We put on game brid hunts and would have 40 to 60 kids show up at these hunts, a good number of these Kids were with single Mothers and they told us that this was the only way thier kids would ever get to hunt. We saw the local NRA rep. one time. Now Zumbo said he could not under stand wye anyone would use a AK-47 or a AR-15 to hunt Praire dogs and Coyotes or any other Black gun! so that happens? out comes the Jack booted thugs to destory him and any onewho may support him. Zumbo was one of the NRA biggest supports, He has helped generations of kids learn about hunting and shooting. If I was a NRA member I'd hang my head in shame! |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
Good points Lost. I've worked on several pro-bono environmental initiatives in law school, and I can assure you that there was never an NRA dollar that trickled our way for those efforts. I've also worked with DU, NWTF and Pheasants Forever - again, I've never heard any of those guys mention NRA funding. Why? Because there is none.
Caldoc -Good points. Many donors losesight of the fact thatmany of the NRA's key funded initiativesactually contravene the interests ofstate and local law enforcement (i.e.heightened registration requirements, expansive criminal background checks, tighter gun transfer laws, etc..). I just can't see donating to an organization that undermines the efforts of law enforcement,indirectly causing taxpayer dollars to be wasted in courtfighting thesebattles. I would urge ANY NRA member who wants to see his/her donations directed at pro-hunting initiatives or conservation efforts, to discontinue their membership and join a credible, proven huntingorganization (Izaak Walton, SCI, NWTF, DU, PF, etc..)or even donate to your state's fish and game commission (earmarking your donations to be used for public-access land or whatever program that you find most important). Your dollars will go a lot further. If you think I'm lying, call your local Pheasants Forever chapter and ask them how many birds were ever paid for by the NRA. Or maybe ask how many prizes were ever donated at a NWTF event by the NRA. Zero. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
ORIGINAL: quiksilver Good points Lost. I've worked on several pro-bono environmental initiatives in law school, and I can assure you that there was never an NRA dollar that trickled our way for those efforts. I've also worked with DU, NWTF and Pheasants Forever - again, I've never heard any of those guys mention NRA funding. Why? Because there is none. Caldoc -Good points. Many donors losesight of the fact thatmany of the NRA's key funded initiativesactually contravene the interests ofstate and local law enforcement (i.e.heightened registration requirements, expansive criminal background checks, tighter gun transfer laws, etc..). I just can't see donating to an organization that undermines the efforts of law enforcement,indirectly causing taxpayer dollars to be wasted in courtfighting thesebattles. I would urge ANY NRA member who wants to see his/her donations directed at pro-hunting initiatives or conservation efforts, to discontinue their membership and join a credible, proven huntingorganization (Izaak Walton, SCI, NWTF, DU, PF, etc..)or even donate to your state's fish and game commission (earmarking your donations to be used for public-access land). Your dollars will go a lot further. If you think I'm lying, call your local Pheasants Forever chapter and ask them how many birds were ever paid for by the NRA. Or maybe ask how many prizes were ever donated at a NWTF event by the NRA. Zero. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
Actually Tryk just listed a bunch of "acts" that the NRA "supported." Newsflash! Everybody else supported the same things! It wasn't like the NRA was the driving force behind the Federal Government owningland, or a new law allowing disabled people to hunt. Kinda cracks me up how the NRA takes credit for every act that gets passed.
Pathetic. I mean really, how stupid do they think we are? It's pretty easy to say "Oh yeah, I support this... and thattoo..and this... I supported that too... blah blah blah." But when push comes to shove, and it's time to put the $$$ where their mouth is, the NRA is a dry sandwich. Ask gotlost. He says he worked for Jakes, which is one of thepremier youth hunting programs in the country. How many prizes did they buy? Zero.How many employees did they send out to help? Zero. Besides, I thinkthis "rhetoric" is a little eye-opening. Obviously you do too, or otherwise you wouldn't have been inclined to respond. Then again, I'm just making all this stuff up. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
the only reason I responded was to correct you. saying the NRA doesnt do anything for the hunting community solely because they dont do as much as other organizations is a flawed argument.
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RE: NRA does do for hunters....
quiksilver if you use a single gun to go hunting then I deem you a hypocrite. Also why is one the NRA magazines a HUNTING magazine? Man I sure would like to meet the man that can shoot a duck on the fly with a bow...
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RE: NRA does do for hunters....
ORIGINAL: quiksilver Many donors losesight of the fact thatmany of the NRA's key funded initiativesactually contravene the interests ofstate and local law enforcement (i.e.heightened registration requirements, expansive criminal background checks, tighter gun transfer laws, etc..). I just can't see donating to an organization that undermines the efforts of law enforcement,indirectly causing taxpayer dollars to be wasted in courtfighting thesebattles. Hunting organizations are good, but if the Second Amendment ever falls, will ALL hunting NOT be far behind! As far as asking for donations, nobody is FORCING you to donate! But if you are not helping to defend the Second Amendment, then you are helping to distroy it! Is the NRA the only way? No, but it is the best/strongest voice we have! 4 million NRA members out of almost 100 million gun owners, if ONLY half the gun owners were NRA members you would NEVER hear the words "gun ban" again! |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
"Before I went to medical school I was a Foreign Service Officer with the U.S. Department of State and when the "jack booted thugs" remark was made I decided I did not want to be associated with an organization that felt that way towardsmy co-workers and myself."
The term "jack booted thug" was thrown at the ATF by none other that pro-gun US Representative John Dingell(D) of Michigan. The NRA picked up on it. Doc, i respectfully submit, that after the state of Kalifornia gets all of those dastardly "assault weapons" and "sniper rifles" off the street,you will whine to the high heavens when they come for your "hunting guns:""Where is the NRA?" |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
ORIGINAL: JagMagMan 4 million NRA members out of almost 100 million gun owners, if ONLY half the gun owners were NRA members you would NEVER hear the words "gun ban" again! Caldoc |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
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RE: NRA does do for hunters....
ORIGINAL: quiksilver Good points Lost. I've worked on several pro-bono environmental initiatives in law school, and I can assure you that there was never an NRA dollar that trickled our way for those efforts. I've also worked with DU, NWTF and Pheasants Forever - again, I've never heard any of those guys mention NRA funding. Why? Because there is none. Caldoc -Good points. Many donors losesight of the fact thatmany of the NRA's key funded initiativesactually contravene the interests ofstate and local law enforcement (i.e.heightened registration requirements, expansive criminal background checks, tighter gun transfer laws, etc..). I just can't see donating to an organization that undermines the efforts of law enforcement,indirectly causing taxpayer dollars to be wasted in courtfighting thesebattles. I would urge ANY NRA member who wants to see his/her donations directed at pro-hunting initiatives or conservation efforts, to discontinue their membership and join a credible, proven huntingorganization (Izaak Walton, SCI, NWTF, DU, PF, etc..)or even donate to your state's fish and game commission (earmarking your donations to be used for public-access land or whatever program that you find most important). Your dollars will go a lot further. If you think I'm lying, call your local Pheasants Forever chapter and ask them how many birds were ever paid for by the NRA. Or maybe ask how many prizes were ever donated at a NWTF event by the NRA. Zero. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
ORIGINAL: Californiadoctor ORIGINAL: JagMagMan 4 million NRA members out of almost 100 million gun owners, if ONLY half the gun owners were NRA members you would NEVER hear the words "gun ban" again! Caldoc |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
"I suspect it's because the vast majority don't own weapons that have been targeted by bans and confiscations yet. So, they figure they'll sit idly by on the sidelines letting other pull their weight. The Brady Bunch has started talking about "sniper rifles" now... They're after .30-30's for pete's sake. They're talking about bans of rifles that are so accurate they can hit "within millimeters at distances over 100 meters." Come on. That's every hunting rifle on the market. But don't worry. You can sit back and let others do the work."
Justwait untilthe "sniper rifle" ban and the new and improved "assault weapons" ban get throughthe US congress. When all of thoseleft leaning "hunters" find out that their hunting rifles and Benelli shotguns arebeing confiscated by the very folks that they voted for they will all whine in unison: "Why didn't the NRA do something." |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
lose the 2nd Amendment and we're all gonna look pretty silly running round the woods with our pointy sticks trying to get in touch with Mother Nature...
Beneath the 2nd Amendment lies distince parallels... Self defense, hunting, recreational shooting... are all equal... they are lower on the food chain than the 2nd Amendment. The NRA's purpose is to protect the 2nd in turn protecting your right to own and use a firearm in your endevour whether it is stopping an intruder, whackin the turdy point buck or puttin lead downrange @ 500 meters... If there is so much as a single firearm in your home or under your ownership you had best leave all other tirades behind and get on board with the organizations fighting to protect that firearm... no matter what you may use that firearm for... it's not about the deer or the target or the bad guy... it is about your RIGHT to KEEP and BEAR ARMS as a God given right to be armed and partake in activities against said deer, target or bad guy.. pretty darn cut and dry... there ARE NO gray areas when it comes to the 2nd Amendment... you're either with it or against it... you just have to make up your mind... a maybe this or maybe that does nothing but cause disarray and dissention in the ranks and leaves the door cracked so the enemy (read that Anti-Gun folk) can sneak in and try to snatch the cake away, one crumb at a time. |
RE: NRA does do for hunters....
Rootsy and JagMagMan, I couldn't agree more with you.
All lawful owners and users of firearms have to realize that the anti-gun misguided politicians and fanatics won't be satisfied until every last type of firearm is registered, then confiscated. They work one step at a time here just like they did in Great Britain and are doing so in Australia and most European countries. The NRA is one of the biggest most aggressive pro-gun owners’ organizations that is active in the U.S. There are others I grant you that. If you choose to support another that is doing effective work on protecting gun owners right to own and use firearms that have been available and used legally for more than a hundred years (semi-autoloaders) and other firearms for as long as there has been a USA, more power to you. Please just don't bash this organization because of trivial things like some of those we've heard like "they didn't give prizes to" whatever your favorite programs is. That's not their primary reason for existing. It doesn’t mean they don’t value your causes. We need to be joining together to beat these radical gun banning liberal bunch that has been embolden with this last election. We better get at least as serious and work harder to protect our 2nd Amendment rights as the anti's are to try to take them away. |
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