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Dead deer in public view???

Old 11-29-2005, 12:12 AM
  #151  
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Default RE: Dead deer in public view???

ORIGINAL: zrexpilot

I understand being considerate to other people and if you asked me to be considerate and not showmy deer offwould be one thing. But to make consideration a law is just plaing wrong !
I pick my nose, scratch my butt, scratch mynads and fart. Would I do it in public ? No. out of consideration. Do we need to make a law that says I cant fart in public ?
Dont you see where this is going ?
I totally agree that it should not be a law, but to the respect of others, I don't want to be scractching my butt in public either, as there is a time and place for everything, but when in mixed company, I believe one should conduct themselves approperately.I would not go to church and smoke inside or use foul mouth for the respect that I have for others, and that same respect I try to show as a hunter, to those that may be on the fence. We are a minority as hunters, but it is up to us to try to educate the public and win them on our side as opposed to saying this is the way we are. By your actions that you do, are you actually promoting our sport or hurting it by what you do? I say show off your deer in camp and at home but while enroute, respect those that may not share the same feelings as you. Good day.

Bobby
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Old 11-29-2005, 12:16 AM
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Default RE: Dead deer in public view???

ORIGINAL: mustad

Manuman,

I am troubled with your definition of True Tolerance...

You state - True tolerance means allowing someone to be different without attacking or belittling. First off, why do you say attacking and belittling and what is the definition of that? Were you belittling the 20 year old at the gas station by concluding that she gave you a negative look with regards to your displayed deer? Were you belittling her by mentioning it here? I'm not sure your time would be worthwhile even thinking about it. More importantly, who is determining what is allowed? Is it you, me, Pamela Anderson, PETA? I think it needs to come back to a notion of what is defined as acceptable by the general population. There are laws right now which define what is acceptable and these laws can and will change as the majority consensus changes (hopefully never including anything about the display of harvested animals of any type). Why would you consider it "political correctness" to simply maximize the probabilty of the majority not having a negative impression on hunting since they can have a huge impact into what is deemed "allowed"?

Are you saying that it's the general population's responsibility to tolerate you showing your harvest? Why?

Finally, with regards to your comment on "gays", does your concept of tolerance stop at sexual preference?

Cheers,
It isn't difficult to figure out what attacking and belittling is--it isn't a veiled attempt or a slight of hand issue--plain and simple--if you agree or disagree, slinging insuts, becoming agressively heated, and making obscene gestures would probably qualify for being intolerant.The original post labeled everyone that displays their deer as fitting into a certain category, and that is wrong--pure and simple. My motivation had nothing to do with any of his stereotypes or any of the others that followed.I think I spelled that out pretty plainly. The new tolerance says that all views are on equal footing, not allowing for ANYONE to be right--if everyone is equal, then you have no concept of what is truly right or wrong, true or false--it is only opinion, and opinion and truth are not one and the same-necesarrily.I think the 20 year olds actions spoke for themselves considering she flipped me off, and I have no problem with lip reading either. It wasn't an assumption, which would be entirely different.I did not respond to her in kind. And before you say--see, if you had not done this it wouldn't have happened, let me go ahead and say--her attitude toward hunting didn't arise from my display--it only surfaced what was already there. And I will repeat--she was the only one that responded in this matter. out of literally hundreds of people on the highways.It is considered political correctness, due to the reasoning behind people's everchanging attitudes toward issues such as hunting. Surely you have the discernment and the awareness of the changes that have taken place in the past 15-20 years.It is of the same fabric, this mentality toward sanitizing and neutralizing any form of a standard concerning most anything in our society today. You are not allowed to have a defined position on anything for fear of 'offending'. And, it is not a devil may care attitude or being cavalier that I'm talking about--it is standing up for what you have based your life on--carefully and thoughtfully, without concern for retribution or rejection. I don't care if you or others agree with me, or act or believe as I do. You have the right to do so--that very right is in jeopardy because of the weenie mentality that attempts to neutralize and categorize everything and everybody into some neat little generic package.It is foolish to think that you can project some image of hunting that doesn't consider the reality that it involves the taking of an animals life. To attempt to skirt around this implies that there is indeed something wrong that needs to be hidden.Where do you propose to draw the line? The next logical step is to remove any photos or magazines or articles--retreat, retreat! I say no. It is time to present it as it is, and to do it in manner consistent with the broadness of the spectrum.As for the general public tolerating it--yes I am saying this. I'll kill 2 birds with 1 stone.I mentioned gays , not to make a statement one way or the other here, although I do have very definite concerns here--but that is for another forum. Ify ou want to make it into something more you can, butI don't make any reference one way or the other, other than to use this issue as an illustration. It is a loaded topic, and it is very volatile. As we are regressing in our society, what was once considered shameful, and even its participants were inclined to hide their actions--now has become more widely accepted, while the partcipation in an activity such as hunting has become something , now, that we are supposed to go around and hide as if we were participating in something shameful. This paradigm shift is very troubling. It is not for us to go around hiding or being made to be shamed into condescending or compromising what we know is an acceptible practice.Our responsibility is to reverse this trend by being able to demonstrate verbally and through educating the general public on the necessity and legitimacy of hunting as completely credible and understandible. Then we won't have as many 20 year old girls reacting to me or anyone else as if I had done something vile or immoral. Her perspective led her to react in anger. Her perspective is what the problem is--her perception.I can have the perception that if I walk out of a 30 story building I can fly like superman, and find out through someone enlightening me of my faulty belief system, without having my rights infringed or being somehow violated.And don't come back with she's entitled--because that is not the issue at all. She's entitled of course, just as any one is entitled to do anything. But entitlement does not imply or distinguish right from wrong or true from false. You or I are free to smoke, do drugs, drink one's self into a stupor everyday ofyour life--but it won't change the fact that it will still hurt or kill you and others.You can allow someone their rights and still deliver the truth to them without being intolerant. It isn't necessarry to retreat into a neutral position to achieve being tolerant. It does become necesarry to show mutual respect and dignity --regardless of ones position.And, it does point to the need for a standard that transcends opinion. What was true yesterday is true tomorrow and always. Opinions and ideas come and go.
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Old 11-29-2005, 12:49 AM
  #153  
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Default RE: Dead deer in public view???

Manuman,
It sure isoddhow truth becomes intolerance when it interferes with feelings and is stood for.

C. Davis
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Old 11-29-2005, 02:29 AM
  #154  
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Default RE: Dead deer in public view???

ORIGINAL: NY Bowhunter


Why do you feel the need to "show off" your deer to people driving along the highway? They could probably care less anyway. This" I can do what I want and screw everyone else" attitude is getting annoying. Kind of selfish if you ask me. It has nothing to do with PC. It has to do with doing what is in our control as hunters to always protect our sport. You really need some kind of half assed ceremonial parade around town displaying your dead deer to culminate a successful hunt? If that is actually a part of your enjoyment of hunting then I feel sorry for you. You're missing the big picture.
You are not clearly reading my post #92. I don't need your pitty!! I stated how some ways dead animals are transported have been implemented. Good changes. Now if a dead deer head is the only visible part of the body in the bed of ofmy truck that's still not good enough for you. Come ON. I'm not parading anything.

ORIGINAL: NY Bowhunter

Next time one of my beloved relatives dies instead of transporting the body in a closed casket and hearst I think we will tie them to the hood of a car and parade around town for awhile. Shouldn't bother anyone should it? If it does to heck with them..... I'll do what I want to anyway.

[:-]
I have not noted anything negative about any posts, but this is way out there!!


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Old 11-29-2005, 05:04 AM
  #155  
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Default RE: Dead deer in public view???

Well, I agree that it takes COMMON SENSE to try not to offend anyone who might be offended, while at the same time I don't believe in "hiding" our sport behind the scenes. Making more laws seems like a bad way to go, we have enough.Perhaps just mentioning this to others, maybe friends or co-hunters, might convince them to be a little more discerning.

As for the post that started all this, I have learned 3 things about Red Allison I didn't know before this:
#1 He doesn't believe in blatantly showing off dead animals, and he is very passionate about it.
#2 He feels the best way to get his point across is to insult everyone who disagrees with him, as much as possible.
#3 He really wants everyone to know he has killed over 200 deer!!!
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Old 11-29-2005, 06:54 AM
  #156  
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Default RE: Dead deer in public view???

ORIGINAL: Bionicrooster

Well, I agree that it takes COMMON SENSE to try not to offend anyone who might be offended, while at the same time I don't believe in "hiding" our sport behind the scenes. Making more laws seems like a bad way to go, we have enough.Perhaps just mentioning this to others, maybe friends or co-hunters, might convince them to be a little more discerning.

As for the post that started all this, I have learned 3 things about Red Allison I didn't know before this:
#1 He doesn't believe in blatantly showing off dead animals, and he is very passionate about it.
#2 He feels the best way to get his point across is to insult everyone who disagrees with him, as much as possible.
#3 He really wants everyone to know he has killed over 200 deer!!!
In this part of the country and in this county with a 4 deer limit. About the only way I know anyone could amass 200 deer would be to have a .22 magnum a good spotlight, and I can gurantee they would not be driving through town with their tailgate down.

C. Davis
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Old 11-29-2005, 08:08 AM
  #157  
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Default RE: Dead deer in public view???

I have thought about this all day yesterday and I still think there is a lot to be said and a lot of points have been missed. I think manuman said it best. We are as Americans for the most part embracing and accepting of acts/behavior that at one time was consideredimmoral/illegal. We have been spoon fedalifestyle sooooo much that many Americans are tricked into thinking that this is normal behavior and should be accepted by the masses. I am talking aboutGays, drunkards, adulterers, drug users, sex offenders, the list could go on and on. Heck we even have the NAACP to fight for the rights of sex offenders and child molesters.

Where will it end? Hunting/trapping/fishing are all activities that have always been legal and an accepted practice throughout our American history. In a world where we are "supposed" to be tolerant of all behaviors we as sportsman have a fight on our hands, and some suggest the best way to fight it is to "hide" it?

We have to "hide" our kills to keep from offending others?

We have "hunters" backing/suggesting the thought of a law to make showing you deer in public a crime punishable by paying a fine?

If this type of approach or method of thinking continues to be common place among our group..............where will we be in 10 years?.....20 years?

I am not one to say "fight the power", but at some point we have to stand up for what we believe in rather than adhering to the others opinions and compromising what we do. Dang, we are not doing anything illegal, immoral, or even wrong,however if Red has his way, a perfectly legal act would be made illegal and the snowball would be made and pushed down the hill.

For the record, I always put my tail gate up, not because of fear of offending anyone, I do it because I don't want the deer to fall out.

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Old 11-29-2005, 08:12 AM
  #158  
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Default RE: Dead deer in public view???

Well said Gus!
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Old 11-29-2005, 08:17 AM
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Default RE: Dead deer in public view???

i drive a jeep so ill slap it right across my hood. im not gonna jam it into the back. im not gonna go rent a u-haul, or bother a friend to use their truck to haul my deer. people dont have to look at the deer. but many people may find interest. making a law that you cant expose a killed deer is ridiculous. if you win a trip to go moose hunting and you own a smaller suv you mean you wouldnt go becuase you cant haul it back without other people seeing it? and if they did youd get a ticket? are you kidding! unless they got the deer tied to a rope and dragging down the road i dont see what the problem is.
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Old 11-29-2005, 08:19 AM
  #160  
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Default RE: Dead deer in public view???

I just don't understand the purpose of driving around with an exposed carcass with the INTENT of showing it off to the general public. What's the point? The only possible thing that can happen is a NEGATIVE effect on the 75% general population that are on the fence and ultimately have the upperhand in the future of hunting. Why take the chance of doing anything to have a negative impact on the sport? Do you really get that much joy out of showing it off to every Tom, Dick, and Harry? Is it worth that much to you?
I still say it is not a matter of PC or hiding what we do. It's simply a matter of courtesy and respect to others that may not want to see your dead deer while driving to Wal Mart. It's not hiding the fact that you are still a great white hunter. The deer would be under a big canvas or game bag and on a trailer with a rack sticking out. You'd probably be in hunting gear .DUH!!!! Roll the window down and proclaim your excitement to everyone on the streets that you got a deer (no dont' do that either) Fear not little Johnny and soccer mom will still know you are a great hunter and know you harvested a deer.

The risk just doesn't seem to equal the reward to me. Actually I don't see how it's rewarding at all but that's JMO.
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