Colorado hunters unit #65 and ATVs
09-28-2003, 06:59 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2003
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Posts: 266
Colorado hunters unit #65 and ATVs
Any hunters in #65 who use ATVs, contact me for update and road closures in Uncompagure national forest, we need everyones help to reopen USFS closures.
Contact [email protected]
Dr. Mike
Contact [email protected]
Dr. Mike
09-30-2003, 08:37 AM
#2
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Arlington Wa. USA
Posts: 1,386
RE: Colorado hunters unit #65 and ATVs
Just curious outdoor 338-I see where no one has responded back to this thread, but have you gotten any responses by Email?The reason I am asking is that I have seen where " land use" issues don' t get a lot of
attention here-since we are fighting a boguss[X(] wilderness proposal [>:]that will lock us out of over 63%of the Mt. Baker/Snoqualmie national forest here in western washington.[
]IF you want some help with this, you might go to[:-] www.snowest.com
and post it on thier " land use" forum. Snowmobilers seem to respond to these things much better than hunters do!!!!!!! Being that I am both,I have seen it with my own issues!! Good luck and best wishes................................S daWg
10-02-2003, 03:53 PM
#3
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 27
RE: Colorado hunters unit #65 and ATVs
I hunted on the platuea this year (61 for bear and 62 for muzzle elk) and I thought the ATV restrictions were great. They (USFWS) have clearly gone to great efforts to close off the renegade ATV trails that were cropping up all across the plateau. The hunts were much better because of the closures. Still more than enough vehicle access but now you can get away. Get off your machine and walk awhile - you might like it.
10-02-2003, 10:48 PM
#4
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Arlington Wa. USA
Posts: 1,386
RE: Colorado hunters unit #65 and ATVs
Hey DB ,when I' m hunting I dont ride an ORV-Now I might spend a little time in my truck,
but not on [X(]" renagade" [X(]trails, but established back roads [:-]which I believe this gentleman was speaking Of.
Now as for ORV' s riding [X(]all over in the manner you decribe-I believe all of us here would have a problem with that!
Now when I' m on my 800 Summit X, walking is more than likely NOT an option in most of the places we go!!!!!!!![:-]
but not on [X(]" renagade" [X(]trails, but established back roads [:-]which I believe this gentleman was speaking Of.Now as for ORV' s riding [X(]all over in the manner you decribe
-I believe all of us here would have a problem with that!Now when I' m on my 800 Summit X, walking is more than likely NOT an option in most of the places we go!!!!!!!!
[:-]
10-03-2003, 04:12 AM
#5
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2003
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Posts: 266
RE: Colorado hunters unit #65 and ATVs
Hi db,
Have you hunted GMU #65, the wilderness area, you take Owl Creek Pass road #219 up, and you will find that the USFS has closed a road, a logging road that we as tax payers have paid for. Its a well established road, it will not go away, its been cut throught the side of a mountain, and was very well used. Why the USGS closed this road is anybodys guess, but the road will take you within 1 1/2 miles of the Blue wilderness area. Now you have to walk 4.8 miles on a perfectly good road to get near the Blue wilderness area. I agree with summit, I am not talking about someone who has made their own renagade trails in the mountains, stay on roads and trails that are well used and maintained. I always use roads and trails and never go off them, and I walk to my stand from where I leave my ATV, and that is a fair walk.
The USFS has not done a good job in working with the public, db have you seen the Final Environmental Impact Statement on the Uncompahgre National Forest Travel Plan, read all about the USFS closings and the majority of the people who use the UNF have said keep the roads open, but don' t make new ones, and the USFS has many employees that are Serria club members. Remarks from USFS personal in public meetings are public record, you might be shocked at reading some of these. Look up PR37' s remark found on N-118 that will shock you! Remember this National Forest is public forests not Montrose' s or Delta' s national forest, meetings need to be held all over the state, have them in Denver, Colorado Springs and not just in Montrose, Delta, Ridgeway, Oury, and get everyone' s comments, opinions, suggestions, not just out on the western slope. Many use the UNF are from the Denver area. In regards to " get out and walk" , my friend, I do plenty of that, and need no extra exercise, I get plenty of walking going to my stand, and hauling out elk, can you say that?
Dr. Mike
Have you hunted GMU #65, the wilderness area, you take Owl Creek Pass road #219 up, and you will find that the USFS has closed a road, a logging road that we as tax payers have paid for. Its a well established road, it will not go away, its been cut throught the side of a mountain, and was very well used. Why the USGS closed this road is anybodys guess, but the road will take you within 1 1/2 miles of the Blue wilderness area. Now you have to walk 4.8 miles on a perfectly good road to get near the Blue wilderness area. I agree with summit, I am not talking about someone who has made their own renagade trails in the mountains, stay on roads and trails that are well used and maintained. I always use roads and trails and never go off them, and I walk to my stand from where I leave my ATV, and that is a fair walk.
The USFS has not done a good job in working with the public, db have you seen the Final Environmental Impact Statement on the Uncompahgre National Forest Travel Plan, read all about the USFS closings and the majority of the people who use the UNF have said keep the roads open, but don' t make new ones, and the USFS has many employees that are Serria club members. Remarks from USFS personal in public meetings are public record, you might be shocked at reading some of these. Look up PR37' s remark found on N-118 that will shock you! Remember this National Forest is public forests not Montrose' s or Delta' s national forest, meetings need to be held all over the state, have them in Denver, Colorado Springs and not just in Montrose, Delta, Ridgeway, Oury, and get everyone' s comments, opinions, suggestions, not just out on the western slope. Many use the UNF are from the Denver area. In regards to " get out and walk" , my friend, I do plenty of that, and need no extra exercise, I get plenty of walking going to my stand, and hauling out elk, can you say that?
Dr. Mike
10-03-2003, 07:51 AM
#6
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Arlington Wa. USA
Posts: 1,386
RE: Colorado hunters unit #65 and ATVs
Hopefully you can get bunches of people to raise hell on this,because it is what is desperately NEEDED!!!![][] [X(] Sierra club,elf,alf [X(]- they' re all from the same warped mold.[X(]
Now there are many indivduals, groups, and businesses of like mind with us,but what do we all do to unite in our cause?? That is where the Blue Ribbon Coalition comes in to the picture. Check it out at www.sharetrails.org
$20 to join- but money well spent if we want our roads open to us for the future[]
][] [X(] Sierra club,elf,alf [X(]- they' re all from the same warped mold.[X(]Now there are many indivduals, groups, and businesses of like mind with us,
but what do we all do to unite in our cause?? That is where the Blue Ribbon Coalition comes in to the picture. Check it out at www.sharetrails.org $20 to join- but money well spent
if we want our roads open to us for the future[]
10-03-2003, 08:29 AM
#7
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 27
RE: Colorado hunters unit #65 and ATVs
I was born and raised in Montrose and know the owl creek area well. I now live in Denver and haven' t been up owl creek in several years. I can say that based on what I saw on the Plateau proper - you cannot make a serious argument that access is too restricted. There are roads all over the plateau. Some two tracks were closed (and driven over by renegades). Trails that were closed were overkill, e.g. where there used to be three ATV trails going into a canyon there is now one. I also saw trails that allowed motor vehicle access from July 4 (after elk calving) through Labor Day but were closed the rest of the year except to foot traffic. Great idea! ATVs screw up hunting. There are not enough game wardens or USFS people to enforce the laws and ATV riders have shown (as a group) that they are incapable of regulating themselves. I have yet to meet an ATV rider who admits that they are the smuck who blazed a new trail through previously unmolested wilderness but we know that those trails just don' t make themselves. And let me get this straight - 338 you want to drive your ATV up a trail so you can hunt in a Wilderness Area where vehicles are not allowed? Is the irony lost on you?
10-03-2003, 10:25 AM
#8
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Arlington Wa. USA
Posts: 1,386
RE: Colorado hunters unit #65 and ATVs
DB,if I read correctly 338 said he wanted to drive his ATV up an established ROAD to access a trail into the wilderness[]. Now we all know that you can' t drive a truck,ORV,snowmobile,mountain bike,skateboard,wheelchair, [&:](discrimination of the handicapped)[]or operate a chainsaw in a wilderness area. Right?
I have no problem at all with existing wilderness areas as per the US wilderness act of 1964, but I DO have a problem with the sierra club and thier greenie allies trying to take perfectly good useable National Forest land (used by 87%of the NF visitors) and pushing to get more land that is [&:]NOT wilderness[&:] (as per the act of 1964) locked up to the 87%so that they can establish more wilderness that 13% of NF visitors actually use!!!!!!!!![X(] []
Now the first step is closing roads-that would be getting thier foot in the door, AND most people ,if it doesn' t affect thier own personal area- don' t say a word ' till it does. Kind of like the proper way to boil a live frog. He will jump out of the boiling water.
Now I don' t have the exact numbers on me, but right now there are approximately 130 million acres of wilderness in the NF system-the sierra clubs target for 2010 is 300 MILLION acres!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now that' s a lot of roads WE wont be able to use-and per the act MUST be [X(]de-constructed at OUR expense[X(]!!!!!!!!!!!! [X(]Now tht would really help with wildfires[>:], wouldn' t it?
I' m not trying to start a pissin match, just giving my opinion[:-] Can anyone feel the water warming up?!?!?? [>:] PS Thier buddies are burning SUV' s turning loose mink,and other acts of domestic Terrorism[&:][&:][X(][>:]
]. Now we all know that you can' t drive a truck,ORV,snowmobile,mountain bike,skateboard,wheelchair, [&:](discrimination of the handicapped)[]or operate a chainsaw in a wilderness area. Right?I have no problem at all with existing wilderness areas as per the US wilderness act of 1964, but I DO have a problem with the sierra club and thier greenie allies trying to take perfectly good useable National Forest land (used by 87%of the NF visitors) and pushing to get more land that is [&:]NOT wilderness[&:] (as per the act of 1964) locked up to the 87%so that they can establish more wilderness that 13% of NF visitors actually use!!!!!!!!![X(] [
]Now the first step is closing roads-that would be getting thier foot in the door, AND most people ,if it doesn' t affect thier own personal area- don' t say a word ' till it does.
Kind of like the proper way to boil a live frog. He will jump out of the boiling water.Now I don' t have the exact numbers on me, but right now there are approximately 130 million acres of wilderness in the NF system-the sierra clubs target for 2010 is 300 MILLION acres!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now that' s a lot of roads WE wont be able to use-and per the act MUST be [X(]de-constructed at OUR expense[X(]!!!!!!!!!!!! [X(]Now tht would really help with wildfires[>:], wouldn' t it?
I' m not trying to start a pissin match, just giving my opinion[:-] Can anyone feel the water warming up?!?!??
[>:] PS Thier buddies are burning SUV' s turning loose mink,and other acts of domestic Terrorism[&:][&:][X(][>:]
10-03-2003, 02:10 PM
#9
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location:
Posts: 266
RE: Colorado hunters unit #65 and ATVs
Hey db,
After reading your post I have gathered that you don' t own an ATV, and have a distain for them, I have been pretty upfront about current users of ATVs to stay on established trails, and we both would agree with that. I have seen the damage that you speak about, but not by any members in my hunting party. Road #219 is a well used logging road, if you know it well, then you know what is at the top, and that is a cattle guard, I have prposed to the USFS to close the road at the top. I park my ATV and walk the 1.1/2 into the wilderness area, and then go in a great distance to my stand, anyone that hunts with me will do the same. Since it has been some time since you hunted the area why don' t you take this plesant 4.8 mile walk up to the cattle crossing and tell me why you feel that this established road should be closed.
In regards to your hunting in the UNF, take a look at the appendices for UNF-Final Environmental Impact statement pages N 72, and 73 #HU03 this indivdual wants hunting cloesed and blames all damage due to hunters, not just ATVers #HU12 found on page N-73 this indivual and I quote " Hunting season is when the plateau gets over used, You and the DOW need to get together and close hunting....there are plenty comments like these, db maybe you sould look up the facts and then report, that' s a serria club member wanting to take your hunting rights away from you, thank God some folks want to protect all our rights, and I am in total agreement. You may hate ATVs but at least some people are defending your rights to hunt that ride them. If you want that quiet peaceful hunt, go into the Blue wilderness area, its very quiet in the woods, except....one....little thing, what about those loud jets overhead and contrails they make!
Dr. Mike
After reading your post I have gathered that you don' t own an ATV, and have a distain for them, I have been pretty upfront about current users of ATVs to stay on established trails, and we both would agree with that. I have seen the damage that you speak about, but not by any members in my hunting party. Road #219 is a well used logging road, if you know it well, then you know what is at the top, and that is a cattle guard, I have prposed to the USFS to close the road at the top. I park my ATV and walk the 1.1/2 into the wilderness area, and then go in a great distance to my stand, anyone that hunts with me will do the same. Since it has been some time since you hunted the area why don' t you take this plesant 4.8 mile walk up to the cattle crossing and tell me why you feel that this established road should be closed.
In regards to your hunting in the UNF, take a look at the appendices for UNF-Final Environmental Impact statement pages N 72, and 73 #HU03 this indivdual wants hunting cloesed and blames all damage due to hunters, not just ATVers #HU12 found on page N-73 this indivual and I quote " Hunting season is when the plateau gets over used, You and the DOW need to get together and close hunting....there are plenty comments like these, db maybe you sould look up the facts and then report, that' s a serria club member wanting to take your hunting rights away from you, thank God some folks want to protect all our rights, and I am in total agreement. You may hate ATVs but at least some people are defending your rights to hunt that ride them. If you want that quiet peaceful hunt, go into the Blue wilderness area, its very quiet in the woods, except....one....little thing, what about those loud jets overhead and contrails they make!
Dr. Mike