snapper1982

beer cans do not work "just as well" because it does not show you the whole pattern. you may be off a couple of inches and be able to move your sights to get a better poa/poi.

according to my way of thinking and patterning my gun is good at 50 yards and will kill 100%. but I still use it as a 40 yard gun. if by chance I happen to misjudge then I have a solid 10 yard buffer.

my gun went 6 for 6 this year(I killed 4 and my bud killed 2) all inside 45 yards with hevi 7s 3in 2oz.

as for what was said about KE from the 20 gauge of Adrian's. it does not matter if the shot is from a 410 or a 10. if the pellets are the same size(6s) and the velocity is the same then the per pellet KE is the same.

Topgun 3006

"as for what was said about KE from the 20 gauge of Adrian's. it does not matter if the shot is from a 410 or a 10. if the pellets are the same size(6s) and the velocity is the same then the per pellet KE is the same."


***That's something that many people have no idea about and think you have to go to a 3 1/2" 12 gauge for extra power, when if the velocity is the same what you are getting is more pellets in the shell and not more power. However, if that pellet count is tight and accurate I would imagine Brad would agree that you greatly up your chances of killing a bird.

Brad C.

You bet. It's all about the numbers. They don't lie, and if a person follows the 100 in the 10" you will know your true max range for any gun, choke, and load regardless of the size of the shell or the gage of the gun.

Topgun 3006

Brad---I hope there are a lot of turkey newbies and others that aren't real familiar with ballistics and patterning their guns that are reading this thread, as I think you have offered an awful lot of beneficial information for the average guy that hasn't done a lot except to go hunting thinking they are okay with what they have! Just grabbing a shotgun off the rack that you use for rabbits, etc. and sticking a turkey choke on it and going out doesn't hack it a lot of the time unless a gobbler is right on top of them. Then when a bird is out there at 40 yards and doesn't go down like a rabbit might at that distance they wonder why!!! My guess is that more often that not that many people who turkey hunt don't put the time and effort into doing what is necessary lijke you're talking about to assure a humane kill 100% of the time.

Todd1700

There is actually a great example of this shown in pictures in the "How to pattern your shotgun" thread in the "Tips and Tactics" section. SwampCollie posted a picture of just a turkey head target that had been taped to a big sheet of paper and then he posted a photo of the whole sheet of paper it had been taped on. If you had just been shooting at that small turkey head target you would never have know that center of that pattern actually missed it. You would have simply thought "gee that shell didn't pattern very well". When the truth could be (as SwampCollie demonstrates) that it threw a pretty good pattern just to the left or right from the point of aim. And trust me many shotguns "DO NOT" throw the center of their patterns directly to point of aim and require an adjustable sight to get POI and POA in line with one another. And that goes for the cheapest shotgun out there all the way up the much coveted Benelli's.

Adrian J Hare

yes and your 100 shot in 10 is your opinion and your opinion only. There is no written rule about this its all about "Grouping of Shot" Something that I have spent time with to get the patterns I get. Your Myth is yet another "Sugar Shot" Quote sorry.

I've spent the dollars to find the best shooting patterns from a 20 gauge and now you call me a liar ! Ya ok...

Brad C.

Thank you. And I don't think your right, I know your right. I believe more and more folks are starting to either ask questions about patterning a new turkey gun, or any gun that they might use to shoot turkeys with. And that's due a lot to the internet and forums like these. So that is a plus, but there still are quite a few that are lazy and think I'll just by a great choke like Indian Creek, Pure Gold, or Jelly Head and even if they buy the better Hevi-13 loads think they still don't need to pattern their gun. And typically these chokes with these Hevi-13 loads will shoot great. But you still need to verify that and to make sure your gun is shooting the load to center of point of aim. A lot of guns won't. And that's why a lot of guys miss.

And I can't illustrate enough to shoot at a true 40yds. I can tell you through experience that if you have a gun shooting deadnut at 40yds to your poa, your going to be about deadnut at 15, 20, and 30yds as well. A shotgun sighted dead on at 40yds is going to be good to even 50yds for centering the pattern to so dang close to like it was at 40yds, but you do need to make sure your pellet count is there. And again that don't mean you have to shoot at 50yds if you don't wish to. But you better make sure you have a choke and load that is guaranteed to shoot 200 shot in the 10" at 40yds just to be on the safe side at 50yds. And I would tell you a bare min of 180 in the 10" at 40yds. But 200 would be more of a set norm just to be sure.

I see so many guys that pattern their guns each year whether it be at the gun range, or talking to hunters at Walmart, gunshop, or where have you, and probably most come from turkey hunting forums like this on the internet that shoot small turkey targets you buy at Walmart like the Hunter Specialties or Primos that are like 11" x 11" or say even 12" x12" at 40yds. Now they think they are doing what they are supposed to for afterall it is a turkey target. But just shooting at these targets at a gun range with no backer is a big mistake. A lot of times your main part of your pattern won't even hit these targets or only half of your pattern will hit these small targets. So you don't know what really is happening on your pattern. Shooting these targets taped to the center of a big or huge piece of cardboard will tell the true tale of what your gun, choke, and load is doing. Then if you need a set of adjustable sights, or a red dot sight or scope you will know right away. And some guns can shoot patterns that are just about deadnut from poa to poi. Rem 870's are probably one of the best guns out of the box at doing this on most loads with the stock bead. But I can tell you firsthand and this goes mainly for Hevi-13 loads, that various Hevi-13 loads and I'm talking about shot size changes to smaller shot charges to bigger shot charges can all vary a little bit and shift your center of your poi from your poa. Trust me I have seen it in my 835 using a rock solid rest at 40yds and a dot sight that won't move shift zero using Hevi-13 3.5" 2.25oz #7's, Magblends 3.5", Hevi-13 3.5" 2.25oz #6's, and Hevi-13 3.5" 1.75oz #5's. And that's from having my Tasco open red dot sight zeroed perfectly with the Hevi-13 3.5" 2.25oz #7's at 40yds. All the other loads I mentioned above shifted slightly to say 5" from my poa.

I'll show you what size pieces of cardboard I like to use at 40yds taped. And again you can either use a stick on dot or draw a circle in the middle or tape a turkey target to the center or just aim at the center of the cardboard.



And what I love about big sheets of cardboard like this, and it don't have to be round, but it can be a big square or rectangle piece, but you get almost the entire pattern on the cardboard except maybe a few 10 or 20 pellets at probably the most. So when you shoot and you want to get a better feel of what the results are, you can do what I do, and that's turn the cardboard over and look at the backside. Now this just gives you the true idea of how difficult the head of a gobbler would have at surviving the center of your pattern.

I'll give an example of the 360 pattern I showed in another thread. Here's the backside. That's dead on anyway you try to examine it. I hit this about as deadnut as one could hope for.



But I hope more folks that read this in the future will take the time and the pride to pattern your gun, choke and load, and follow the methods I discussed here. They will have 100% confidence if they do.

Sorry for the long read.

snapper1982

Brad you know from the other threads that I 100% agree with you on the number thing. I only wanted to point out the KE per pellet for new people because a lot of people think oh man it is a 410 or 28, or 20 so it wont be as good as a 12. when in fact if you can put the same number of pellets on target they are equal. but if you put 100 6s on target with a 12 and only 50 with a 20 then things are not equal

Topgun 3006

Excellent patterns for 40 yards as mentioned above!!! I would also like to see some 60 yard patterns to see what is left in the kill zone at that far distance if you're shooting birds with it out that far with a 20 gauge.

snapper1982

Adrian those are awesome 40 yard patterns and I would hunt with that any day but at 60 they are going to fall off pretty bad. do you have a 60 yard pattern to show us?