Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

I've been hunting turkeys for 16 years now, and have taken quite a few gobblerswith plain old copper plated lead,like about 40 or so now.For the life of me, I cann't figure out how I've done that with out the help of Hevi Shot and such. Can someone pleasehelp me figure outon how I've been able to dothat? Thanks Paintbrush
What I'm getting at here is what is the need for anything other then a load of lead that you have cofidence in.All I think is that Hevi Shot and such is just a marketing gimmic to get more money out of our pockets into manufactors pockets.
Isn't a dead turkey shot at 35 yards or so with lead shot just as dead as a turkey shot with Hevi Shot at the same range,but with only about 1/3 the cost per shell.
If it ain't broke,why fix it!

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

We must follow HNI's newbashingpolicy..:DI went through the hevi-shot phase last year,and found it to be about the same,and ended up staying with my 3 1/2" Winchester HV#4's.I still have 3 boxes of #4 hevi in 3" 12ga.SO I am going to use them in my 11-87 for my wife to use.When they are gone I won't be buying any more.I'm with you on this one.;)

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

I would have to say you are right. I used Winchester 3.5" HV #4's and rolled several longbeards. But for me, and this is just me, I have enjoyed seeking the best pattern. It has been fun, albeit not cheap. It has just been another aspect of the sport that I personally have enjoyed. I even bought Nitro shells this year and they are real expensive---but they pattern like a dream.

There is nothing magic about Hevi Shot---but they do pattern a bit denser and pack a punch. But you are right. Dead is dead and if you don't see the need to spend the money---you probably have more sense than I. I have just enjoyed the search.

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

I agree with Sour1. I am switching to hevi-shot this year. The current lead loads I am using work fine but I enjoy thesatisfaction of getting the best possible pattern from my gun. I will get to enjoy some time at the shooting range preparing for the new season and filling the lull until spring arrives. And yes dead is dead, but maybe one day (it hasnt happened yet)when that turkey hangs up at 45-50 yards, instead of passing because he is out of my range, I will feel confident that I can make a clean kill.

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

Paint your question is legitimate, but you have to understand the logic. Basically the HS and all the other lead substitutes are for longer ranges. Lead simply peters out at much over 50yds. The new stuff patterns like steel and outweighs lead so it has more energy and longer killing power. You wouldn't shoot a deer at 250yd with a 30/30 would you? When properly dialed in the topend loads and guns can kill effectively well in excess of 50 yards with occasional shots being 70+yds. I won't get into the question of ethics by some traditonalists but whereI hunt in large pastures and cropfields that extra distance DOES come in handy. 50yds is a loooooong way to shoot a bird in timber I'll agree. But 65-70+ is not out of the question in fields if you have worked on your gun/load/choke and know what it will do. I killed a bird (STONECOLD DEAD too!) at spot on 50yds with HeviShot in the open, mature hardwoods of southern MO. In the thickets of my home area of western TN such a shoot wouldn't be an option!

Sure if you are sworn to NEVER shoot over 45 yds then yeah DON'T waste your money with $100 tubes and $7 Nitro shells (there has been a BIIG price increase in the stuff this year!) I will not argue that. But with a red-dot and some new "technology" there are much farther capabilities for the long range turkey hunter than is possible with even the best lead loads. How many times have you had that, "Man he hung up out there at 55-65 yds?" It used to happen all the time too me. Many would just take the shot anyway and either scare thebird or worse, wound it but it flew away. Now you have the opportunity to take that "hang up" out of the equation. More odds in your favor.

I am sure you guys will get onto me now for saying someone can take a turkey well over 50 yds, but I am not here to defend or disprove the question of such. Just answering why we will pay for extra performance.

Tools of the trade...
RA

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

I beleive you can shoot them that far.My longest shot is 72yds.I only got 3 pellets in the neck,but I got him.I shoot turkeys every year @ 45-56 yds.I guess I am lucky enough to have found a choke/shell combination.That's why I went back to my 3.5" Winchester HV #4's.I try to shoot @30,but I know my gun will flatten them out easily @60yds.

SO,you get 180-200..or 320 hits whatever it is.It'smostly small shot!.The nitro loads are mostly hevi #7's.I saw the pellet count at Jesse's hunting site.390 #7's out of 553 pellets?The restare 4's,and 5's.That doesn't impress me.Those 7's don't hit like my 4's.I have more 4's in my shell than there are 4's and 5's combined in the 4x5x7 nitro load.I may not have the # of hit's,but will take bird for bird against a nitro load.;)There's difference between poking holes in paper,and poking holes in the necks/wingbones/legs of turkeys.But if you are satisfied with the $ that you spent,and it gives you that much more confidence...That's all that matters.

http://www.jesseshunting.com/articles/hunting/category14/11.html

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

i can only assume that paintbrush is using a single shot 12 or 20, no choke tubes and a 2 3/4" standard high brass load.................if he isn't, isn't he just buying into the gimmick of the manufactueres?

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

Ranch99 how many turkeys have you killed with Hevi-Shot, Nitros and other non-steel shot?

I was shooting Rem's Hevi-Shot at turkeys before it was even legalized as a steel substitute by the Feds for waterfowl. Many of my hunters (I have guided on a commercial cattle operation in southern MO for 20 years) went too it after some "proof" on the range for them. And I have worked in two proshops nowand have 100s of customers who have switched too the lead alternatives. All in all I have been in onor around 100s of birds killed by the stuff. It IS that danged good.

If you don't like it, want to continue to use lead and whatever chokesthat is completely fine with me. No one is holding a gun too your head and demanding that you use it. But for you to blatantly belittle and berate hunters who DO use it, that is wrong and speaks poorly of you. Do you deerhunt? I suppose you hunt STRICTLY with a muzzleloader or a 30/30 then? Those new fangled magnum centerfires with high powered scopes,they are justa waste of money and are aconspiracy by the makers to take hunters money right? Are those hunters stupid for using such equipment? They really are just morons for using it when in reality it really offers NO performance increase does it? It's all just a figment of their immagination nowisn't it?

See how crazysuch sounds?
RA

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

Well,red I guess you took me wrong.Having confidence in your weapon is a good thing.I am agreeing with paintbrush,that what is done with nitro,can be done with a well selected choke/shell combination.I have killed birds with hevi,and it does do the job,but it is not worth the $ to me.My post was not meant to belittle or berate anyone who does use it.It is good,but it is EXPENSIVE.It is more costly than what the output is to me,and that was my piont.Not to down anyone.I'm not like that.And to humor you Yes I deer hunt I use Bow,shotgun,muzzleloader,rifle,and have taken deer with a x-bow.I am all for any advantage that I can get,but with the super expensive nitro/rhino...and hevi..I don't see where it is any better than a fine tuned load of #4's.;)It is hard to prove that a bird that is taken with nitro,could not be taken with lead,and vise versa.I know people(including me)that have consistantly taken birds at the mentioned distances with lead.And therefore I say If it gives you more confidence in your firearm that's all that matters.I too used to not have confidence in my 11-87 3",and went seeking the 3.5" advantage,and it made all the difference in the world.Sorry to have ruffled your feathers.:D

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

Oh,and I am getting one of those new fangled 270WSM's![8D]The ballistics speak for themselves.There is a difference with one bullet,and shot pellets though.

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

Well stated, that was my going to be my very response as well!!!

The search for the ultimate pattern out of a certain choke and load was my "Holy Grail" for many years. The Rhino choke and Nitro Hevishot loads finally gave mewhat I have been searching for. By all means, if your currently happy with your present choke, load, and gun, I agree, why fix something that isn't broke. But, I wanted the best pattern all the way out to 40-45 yards, but that's just what myself and apparently some others have been striving for all along. Right now, the price of Nitro loads have gone up, so they are now getting quite expensive. I want to try out some of the new Hevi-13,Winchester & Federal heavyweight loadsas soon as my current supply of Nitro shells are all used up. "IF" these new shells pattern as good, I'll switch.

Lead or copper plated lead shot will surley get the job done, never said they woundn't. But,the Hevishot pellets,are a muchdenser, harder hitting pellet, at a smaller size than comparable lead. Harder hitting and better patterns = quicker kills, less chance of wounding, and better performancedown range. These are the reasons that I switched to Hevishot. Proven performance,nomarketing gimmickhere.

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

I've never used them..I figured if my 3-1/2" mags. wasn't enough fire powder with regular lead I needed to hunt something beside turkeys. I personally don't get a thrill at shooting them way off, I like to get them up to 30 to 35yds. If I can't I figure I couldn't call him in and he wins. Several yrs. ago I kinda got tired of the more is better thing and quit hunting with my mags. and went to side lock12ga. muzzle loadershotgun and now am using .62cal. smooth bore(20ga.) flintlock..so I have to get him 30 to 35yds. anyway. I like the feeling of hunting like my ancestors did. However, I'm a firm believer in hunting with what you like....that's what I do.

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

Let me clarify myself Ifly.

Like you, I love to try and call them in to the 25-35 yard range on every hunt!! But, we all know, birds hang up sometimes at 35-45 yards for no reason. It's nice knowing that your gun can cleanly take them at that range. The name of the game here folks is taking, killing, or harvesting a nice gobbler.Each one of usowes it to ourselves and the bird to be equiped with the proper gun and ammo while out there hunting. How many people actually never even bother to pattern their guns, and just use what ever choke tube that's in their gun and garb some regular field loads!! Then blame their equipment when they miss or worse, cripple a bird and it gets away. Trust me, there are people out there like that!! I pride myself on getting out of this sport what I put into it. I pass on all jakes, and try to "cleanly kill"a dandy tom each year. This is just a restriction that I placed on myself each spring season. It lengthens my spring season, instead of ending it within the first few days with a jake or two!!

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

Outside of patterning better than any other shot I have ever used the penetrating ability on the Nitro Hevi-Shot won me over, I think the Turkey deserves the best we can give him in making a quick clean kill and IMO the Hevi-Shot gives that without any question whether you are shooting at 35 yards or 65 yards. I shoot maybe 2 or 3 shells a year, It cost more to shoot my bow than it does the Hevi-Shot.

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

RE: Hevi Shot and such,am I missing something?
 

Maytom..I personally think when they hang up there is a reason..and it may be that they hang at 35 to 45yds. because they don't want to take a chance of getting their head blown off if they come any closer..due to all the yrs. getting shot at 30 to 35yds..and the instinctual behavior has been passed on in the genes..if I can't get him on in to 30 to 35yds. he wins. It really hasn't got anything to do with Hevi shot by it's self..it's the whole more powerful shells, bigger mags..etc. concept. I just personally think it takes away from what spring gobbler hunting has been all about over the yrs. not only that..but shooting gobblers at 50 to 80yds..and yes I've heard of people killing that farlike it's nothing to it with the right load, gunwork..etc...it's just bound to make it even harder to get the birds in close. People cringe at the thought of hunting where rifles are legal..there's notto much difference in riflesand the 80yds. lethal range of tungsten and whatever may be the nextmaterialon the market to top it. The gobblers get shot at every time they get within 80yds. of a hunter theywill eventually get to where they'll just make 80yds. the hangup distance or stay up in the tree and make the hens come to them and when on the ground will run from a hen yelp.
However..to each their own..I"m not berating any-body's way of hunting..I justrather hunt with a flintlock and "know" I got to get him 35yds or closer before I will take a shot...and not only that..I like the challenge..Igot tired of stacking the deck so much in my favor to where I felt like all I had to do was get the bird in site and pull the trigger and mysouped up ultra mag with platinum shot would guarantee a dead bird. Ipersonally like knowing I have a lot of things that can go wrong with my flintlock..and that I have to make sure all arelooked after and intop condition..to where if I do get one within range my gun will go off. Personally I really think in the near future a lot of people are going to take the same route I did and go back. It really is a good feeling walkin under the same old hardwoods with the same equipment thatthe old long gun hunters did 300yrs or so ago.If I could come close to making a wing bone sound like a henit would really be nice.