Arrows leaving nock high
09-12-2004, 10:09 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 24
Arrows leaving nock high
45 lb. recurve 32"Easton carbon 400 with Zwickey 2 blade, 4 in. feathers. Shooting a cobra caliper release. Shooting off the shelf with some rabbit fur glued on to shelf and window. Arrows are hitting consistantly in the same spot but I can see them fly nock end high about 10 yards out. Could this be the release pinching the nock? I don't have a nock set below the arrow to keep release from contacting it. I have tried moving nock set from 90 degree(arrow to string) up to 1/4" nock high and back and it doesn't seem to change the arrow flight.
I want to eliminate this so I get a good straight point on impact and not lose any energy in the arrow.
I want to eliminate this so I get a good straight point on impact and not lose any energy in the arrow.
09-13-2004, 07:34 AM
#2
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Illinois
Posts: 1,862
RE: Arrows leaving nock high
I don't know anything about your experience with a recurve, so I will ask:
-Does your bow have a "crowned" shelf (high center) and is the riser "center shot?"
-What brand, model, length, and age?
-Are you using Dacron or Fast-Flight string?
-Is your string and "endless" or "flemish?"
-What is your brace height?
-What do you have on your string other than a nock-set?
-Have you checked your "string nock" for a starting point of 1/8" to 1/4" above 90 degrees (horizontal from rest?)
Although your diagnosis of a nock-high flight is USUALLY contributed to a low nock height causing too much feather-to-shelf contact, it best that all accessories and settings be correct for your setup and form before trying to chase down just one cause.
If your shelf is "flat," you may need to get the arrow up from the shelf to reduce the feather contact which could be kicking your arrow's nock up.
BTW, are you getting a fairly loud and harsh release of the string, using a caliper release? I suppose too, that the release is causing you to have a shorter draw-length?
-Does your bow have a "crowned" shelf (high center) and is the riser "center shot?"
-What brand, model, length, and age?
-Are you using Dacron or Fast-Flight string?
-Is your string and "endless" or "flemish?"
-What is your brace height?
-What do you have on your string other than a nock-set?
-Have you checked your "string nock" for a starting point of 1/8" to 1/4" above 90 degrees (horizontal from rest?)
Although your diagnosis of a nock-high flight is USUALLY contributed to a low nock height causing too much feather-to-shelf contact, it best that all accessories and settings be correct for your setup and form before trying to chase down just one cause.
If your shelf is "flat," you may need to get the arrow up from the shelf to reduce the feather contact which could be kicking your arrow's nock up.
BTW, are you getting a fairly loud and harsh release of the string, using a caliper release? I suppose too, that the release is causing you to have a shorter draw-length?
09-13-2004, 07:56 AM
#3
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Stoutsville Ohio USA
Posts: 191
RE: Arrows leaving nock high
Sounds like you need to adjust the nocking point on the string. I can never remember for sure but I think if you are going nock high in flight your nock on the srtring is to low. Experiment with it and I think you can correct probelm. 
09-13-2004, 09:11 AM
#4
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: West Bloomfield Michigan USA
Posts: 262
RE: Arrows leaving nock high
Sorry guys, but I have to disagree. Normally an arrow flying nock high is an indication of too high a nocking point. It can also be an indication of too weak an arrow spine. (ref. Easton Tuning Guide) Since you are shooting with a release aid you may have affected the natural tiller of the bow. I'd try lowering your nocking point to below 90 degrees and see what affect this has.
09-13-2004, 10:33 AM
#5
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Illinois
Posts: 1,862
RE: Arrows leaving nock high
Floxter:
Your diagnosis could be correct if a paper tune or bare shaft shows that shaft impacted tail high ,which would indicate that the string nock may have to be lowered. I say "could" and "may" because we know that nothing is certain in archery until an adjustment of gear or form actually corrects the problem.
I am responding first to the statement that he can see that the nock-end of his shaft is already "nock high" at 10 yards out, indicating that the shaft may be slightly porpoising. That could indicate that the nock end is being pushed down by a too low nock point and is causing hard contact with the fletch and the bow shelf. Since he said he had already moved his nock up, I opted for the too low and contact diagnosis.
I also suggest that he check for shaft nock tightness to string.
As for the release affecting the natural tiller of the bow; maybe. I shoot 3 fingers under on bows not tillered for 3 under and have never noticed a critical difference. However, I am with you on having a critical eye upon that release. My experience with testing a caliper release on a recurve, was that I had to forcibly pull the trigger to get it to release, and the release of the string was loud and harsh. In addition, with the release, the caliper end is probably applying some heavy pressure against the nock, which we know will cause bad arrow flight.
I presently still opt for 1) the string nock being too low, but will go with trying a higher set to at least ½" above 90 degree and, 2) that he may need to get his shaft above the shelf regardless of correct nock set.
One problem though; the release may be the culprit for this problem.
I need the bow and shooter specs. I always feel like I am stabbing in the dark trying to suggest possible causes and solutions without knowing the specs and present setup.
Your diagnosis could be correct if a paper tune or bare shaft shows that shaft impacted tail high ,which would indicate that the string nock may have to be lowered. I say "could" and "may" because we know that nothing is certain in archery until an adjustment of gear or form actually corrects the problem.
I am responding first to the statement that he can see that the nock-end of his shaft is already "nock high" at 10 yards out, indicating that the shaft may be slightly porpoising. That could indicate that the nock end is being pushed down by a too low nock point and is causing hard contact with the fletch and the bow shelf. Since he said he had already moved his nock up, I opted for the too low and contact diagnosis.
I also suggest that he check for shaft nock tightness to string.
As for the release affecting the natural tiller of the bow; maybe. I shoot 3 fingers under on bows not tillered for 3 under and have never noticed a critical difference. However, I am with you on having a critical eye upon that release. My experience with testing a caliper release on a recurve, was that I had to forcibly pull the trigger to get it to release, and the release of the string was loud and harsh. In addition, with the release, the caliper end is probably applying some heavy pressure against the nock, which we know will cause bad arrow flight.
I presently still opt for 1) the string nock being too low, but will go with trying a higher set to at least ½" above 90 degree and, 2) that he may need to get his shaft above the shelf regardless of correct nock set.
One problem though; the release may be the culprit for this problem.
I need the bow and shooter specs. I always feel like I am stabbing in the dark trying to suggest possible causes and solutions without knowing the specs and present setup.
, I'd suggest trying a string loop. See what effect putting the angle of pull on the string directly behind the arrow has on your arrow flight.
09-13-2004, 07:44 PM
#9
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 24
RE: Arrows leaving nock high
ORIGINAL: c903
I don't know anything about your experience with a recurve, so I will ask:
-Does your bow have a "crowned" shelf (high center) and is the riser "center shot?"
-What brand, model, length, and age?
-Are you using Dacron or Fast-Flight string?
-Is your string and "endless" or "flemish?"
-What is your brace height?
-What do you have on your string other than a nock-set?
-Have you checked your "string nock" for a starting point of 1/8" to 1/4" above 90 degrees (horizontal from rest?)
Although your diagnosis of a nock-high flight is USUALLY contributed to a low nock height causing too much feather-to-shelf contact, it best that all accessories and settings be correct for your setup and form before trying to chase down just one cause.
If your shelf is "flat," you may need to get the arrow up from the shelf to reduce the feather contact which could be kicking your arrow's nock up.
BTW, are you getting a fairly loud and harsh release of the string, using a caliper release? I suppose too, that the release is causing you to have a shorter draw-length?
I don't know anything about your experience with a recurve, so I will ask:
-Does your bow have a "crowned" shelf (high center) and is the riser "center shot?"
-What brand, model, length, and age?
-Are you using Dacron or Fast-Flight string?
-Is your string and "endless" or "flemish?"
-What is your brace height?
-What do you have on your string other than a nock-set?
-Have you checked your "string nock" for a starting point of 1/8" to 1/4" above 90 degrees (horizontal from rest?)
Although your diagnosis of a nock-high flight is USUALLY contributed to a low nock height causing too much feather-to-shelf contact, it best that all accessories and settings be correct for your setup and form before trying to chase down just one cause.
If your shelf is "flat," you may need to get the arrow up from the shelf to reduce the feather contact which could be kicking your arrow's nock up.
BTW, are you getting a fairly loud and harsh release of the string, using a caliper release? I suppose too, that the release is causing you to have a shorter draw-length?
09-16-2004, 04:40 PM
#10
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 24
RE: Arrows leaving nock high
OK switched to port orford cedar arrows with delta snuffers. I went to shooting fingers and canted the bow like I used to and presto! Groups are almost what they were and are getting better. Like riding a bike!