RE: How come I didn't do this sooner?
 

That's exactly what I am talking about! Everyone has a preference and skill level that shapes what they want to hunt with and how they hunt it. Things wouldn't work as well for me as they do for you, just a simple fact! I'm glad someone finally sees it!

RE: How come I didn't do this sooner?
 

3 bowhunters in the woods, one with a compound, one with a crossbow and one with a recurve. Their bowhunts pretty much are identical from the start to almost the finish. One might hang a stand a bit differnt angle because his bow is 64", one might get a bit higher in the tree because he's shooting 325 fps, one guy might sit his stand a bit different to get a good rest for his crossbow ......... but until that time comes to shoot, nothing really changes too much, does it ?

Everything changes at that point. The choice of weapon makes the hunt much more difficult, or much easier, when it comes time to shoot. Still gotta watch that wind, watch the movement, get 20 yards etc ....... nothing changes there.

I don't mind crossbows in archery season, or compounds, or whatever bow you want to use. I understand the differences, each bowhunter has their own priorities. Self bowyers earn the utmost respect in what they do. Traditional hunters do it the hard way too, not quite as hard, but hard. Compounders and crossbow hunters take the path of least resistance - but it still aint easy to kill a deer with their weapons, the challenges are still there, just not as challenging.

RE: How come I didn't do this sooner?
 

Lol Bob--funny thing is, it seems to bother the women worse than the men!

Burbaust, I didn't get the pm's--sorry--or if I did I don't remember it, and they aren't in my box now.

Put a selfbow, a longbow, a recurve, and a compound in a vise and they will all shoot tight groups. Accuracy is in the archer, not the bow. Put a 600 grain arrow on a 60# compound, you will see the speed gap narrow by a LOT. Again, accuracy is in the archer, not the bow. I bet any Olympic archer can out-shoot the average compound shooter at 50 yds and beyond. Very easy to use, no doubt. Easier to be consistent with, no doubt (consistency is in the archer also).

Just that trad bows can, with practice, be used in many more positions. That's a biggie when hunting.

I'm not that great, but let me pick the shots/positions and I'll out-shoot most any compound, just because I know their limitations. Standing straight up, on an open range, and at known distances any decent compound shooter would beat me. However, put those same guys against shooters like Rod Jenkins, Bill Leslie, Ricky Welch, etc. and they'll get a run for their money. I watched a sponsered "Pro" (with a decked-out compound) spend $20 or more ($2 at a time) before he could beat a guy with a recurve on a novelty shoot a few years ago. No tricks to this--it was a narrow but wide-open lane, down-hill, with water (Grenada Lake) for a backstop. The target was an orange dot on a doe target's rump. The guy with the recurve shot 3 arrows ($2). The range was later stepped off to be about 44 yds. The guy with the recurve was a lot better than average, but not a pro or IBO shooter.

A compound is easier in the short run, but if you put the time the advantages of a trad bow( in my opinion anyway) outweigh the advantages of a compound.

RE: How come I didn't do this sooner?
 

I dunno, that 64" of longbow got in the way for me SEVERAL times this year. Maybe sitting down didn't help. A compound I can do a lot of things with too - at full draw :D

If your theory is true ....... why not open up 3D shoots to a whatever you want to shoot shoot ?

answer - because compounds score a lot higher. Why do they ? Better shooting bows - period.

Sorry, I just disagree with the belief trad bows are better weapons. They aren't - every fact I can find proves it.

They ARE more challenging, more fun, people can use them very well ....... but in the ends, just as rifles are better weapons than ANY bow, so too are compounds better than trad bows.

RE: How come I didn't do this sooner?
 

OK, well I'll try again with a pm.

With the way everyone has talked about your abilities and the way you talked about yourself there, I got the idea that you were about god with a bow. You say youre not, ok. You're still a whole lot better than I am lol.

RE: How come I didn't do this sooner?
 

I agree with everything you're saying, except for one part. Everyone shoots better with different things. In general, yes, compound is a more effective weapon, just as a rifle is better than any bow.

I personally shoot better (more proficient respectively)with my compound bow right now over my rifle. Meaning: I won't hit a bullseye at 100 yds with my bow, but at 35 yds and closer I'll do it about everytime with my bow. I'm not that proficient yet with my rifle at the ranges that I would shoot at with it. I am pretty good with my rifle, but compared to how I shoot my bow, it's not even close yet.

So I agree with you, in general purposes, but for specific people its all relative to one's capabilites, limited by what they practice more (in my case, the bow) and what they prefer.

RE: How come I didn't do this sooner?
 

Like I said, compounds have their advantages.

Already covered that. Our last surviving local club (crashed last summer) was a mixed shoot, with different classes. When a trad guy took over setting out the targets, he set them with trad shooters in mind. The compound guys left--they were destroying too many arrows. I seldom ever lost or broke one, and my group would often shoot from the compound stakes just to make it interesting. People like to shoot with their peers.

Depends on the course or situation. Use a course like is usually set up for the AL State trad championship, the TN Classic, the Jerry Pierce, or the Howard Hill (especially the old HH shoot), orLost Tribe's April Fool's shoot--a good trad shooter will smoke a good compound shooter. When I shot mixed shoots, and the club was obviously ruled by compounds, the course was very different vs. one ruled by trad shooters. Clear lanes, stand straight up shots vs. trashy lanes and shots where you often had to squat/lean/stretch/kneel.

That's your right. I base my statements on my experience. I've seen good compound shooters waxed by good trad shooters, and I've out shot several myself. They didn't believe me either, until it happened.

So accept my challenge. I pick the shots and use my longbow, you use the compound of your choice. I will out shoot you--I have no doubt whatsoever. I can say that without ever having seen you shoot.

There's no cut-and-dry definition of which weapon is best--it's going to depend on who's hand it's in, and the situation. Want proof? Let's go pheasant hunting--me with my longbow, you with a compound or a rifle.:D Come shoot with me at one of thetournaments I mentioned, and you will get a first-hand education.None of them allow compounds, but you will get the point.

RE: How come I didn't do this sooner?
 

Lets pheasant hunt ........ you'll maybe go 1 for 50 and the compounder might go 0-50 is there REALLY that much differnce ? Unless you want to ground shoot them ........ advantage compounder :)

I'm not so much talking about 3D and trick shooting as I am hunting LBR. Stand placement is critical regardless of weapon. Compound shooters have aHUGE advantage deer hunting with few exceptions. Those exceptions might even fall under the "unethical shot" catgeory too (ie snap shooting)

Bottom line, and you said it yourself I think, people like to get everything for nothing - they want every shortcut they can take to eliminate any work involved while at the same time increasing success rate - find something that does that and you'll be a millionaire from scnet eliminating clothing to compounds to mechanical broadheads to laser rangefinders.

Its the Big Easy ....... and compounds Rule bowhunting because of it.

Is easier better ? Define better - better for filling your tag, absolutely with few exceptions.

You reference your experience in 3D, I reference mine in hunting. I'd have at least 2 P&Y whitetails and a P&Y bull plus a couple of other nice Arkansas bucks had I used a compound over the past years. That I chose more difficult weapons to hunt with resulted in tag soup. Thats okay too ........ my point though is with a compound I'd have tagged animals because with a compound comes more power, more accuracy, at farther distances.

RE: How come I didn't do this sooner?
 

Lol--we go from blanket statements to a little more specific eh? Ok, I'll play.

First, with practice, a decent trad shooter will do better than that--some a lot better. Doesn't really matter if it's1 out of 1,000 vs 0 out of 1,000 though--the point is the compound (or rifle)is simply not always the superior weapon.

Are you implying that every hunting situation will allow for a perfect, straight-on shot with a clear lane? 3-D is simulating hunting, and a good course will have the targets set in hunting situations. I included 3-D and trick shots, but my points aren't exclusive to just those situations.

Easier in the short run--that's why they rule--almost instant gratification. Take two people of equal talent/dexterity/eyesight/etc., put a compound in one's hand and a recurve in the other's, the one with the compound will be consistently on target first. I haven't argued that. However, take a good compound shooter and a good traditional shooter and there are some situations where the compound shooter has the advantage, but also many situations wheretraditional shooter has the advantage.

Wrong again. The very first time I hunted deer with a bow (with a compound), the compound was a handicap. I could have killed that deer easily with a recurve or longbow and minimal experience, but he went on his way without a scratch after two shots with the compound. The reason? My pin was off. Shoot, I could have killed that deer with a spear, maybe with a big rock. And yes, it was without a doubt my sight--I left the woods immediately and checked--it was WAY off, although I'd been bustingnocks with it in my back yard before.

When I went to Canada a few years ago on a moose hunt, there was two separate cases with two different guys who, if they had been using a trad bow, most likely would have at least gotten a shot, but it was blown due to them having compounds. One came to full draw, but the moose moved his head over his vitals (scratching or something), so the guy had to wait. He couldn't let down slowly and smoothly due to the let-off (he was on the ground), so he had to hold at full draw for while. While he waited, he drifted forward of his anchor a bit. Moose got right, he came back to anchor, arrow fell off the rest. He stood there, bow draw with no arrow on the string, moose staring at him. He finally had to let down, moose headed for AK.

Second instance--one of the guys forgot his release aid and realized it when he was in his spot, a LONG walk away from where his release was. He figured he could shoot fingers if he got a moose close. As the sun was going down, a bull moose got dangerously close (agitated from the challenging calls the guy had made--moose was tearing crap up). He couldn't shoot because: he'd forgot his release aid, and he couldn't find his pin through the peep. His name is Kip, and he got a longbow shortly after he got home. He used to post here, but I haven't heard form him in quite a while.

Third case--same trip. It was unseasonbly hot, the moose activity was near nothing during the day, so a few of us did some grouse hunting. No shots at flying birds, but most were in the trees. Compound guys didn't dare risk a shot, 3 out of 4 of the trad guys got birds (4th didn't buy a license). We managed to bring home at least some game for our efforts, due to having trad bows. Compound guys knew that, hit or miss, their arrows were gone after one shot.

Again, I know, realize, and admit that compounds do have their advantages, especially in some situations. I think I have adequately proven my point that they are not superior in all ways period; and that in some situations--trick shooting, 3-D, and hunting--traditional bows are obviously superior.

I take it you are declining my challenge?;)

RE: How come I didn't do this sooner?
 

If filling your tags is the only reason you hunt, I'm sorry to say but that is sad. I really hope you hunt for more than that, honestly. Hunting is about so much more than filling a few tags up each season. I don't intend this with any malice, so please tell me you could have justworded that statement better. You have to understand how it sounds from this end of things...