Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Now that you've effectively poo pooed carbon clothing for me, for which I'm forever grateful as it keeps money in my pocket :) , how 'bout some of the other options out there?

Such as-

1- Ab-scent, scent absorbing crystals.
2- Silver impregnated material to nip odor at the source, preventing bacteria from producing, such as the X-scent line.
3- Deoderant impregnated material, such as the Contain line.
4- Chemical impregnated material, such as the No-Trace line.

I firmly believe in starting with a squeaky clean and scent free body and all clothing to be worn into the field, but the X-scent stuff has me intrigued. Makes sense, start clean, prevent further bacterial growth plus the material they use is designed to be worn next to skin and is moisture wicking. Plus, it's cheap!

I keep waiting for the No-Trace stuff to take off so there will be more out about it, but so far, not much. Supposedly the chemical they treat the fabric with absorbs odors as effectively as activated carbon, but can be regenerated by washing, no high heat required. I'm dissapointed they don't offer a set of moisture wicking/body temp controlling "long johns" as an option. Makes the most sense to me.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

What up Range:D

I am truly anti - scent eleminating industry[:'(].

I do believe we are being scamed 90% of the time with this stuff.

I like the idea of Bacterial elemination......but again - how long will the clothing be able to do this after repeated washings and usage????

I refuse to use those scent away sprays[:'(] - There is absolutely no proof they work. I know I know, great hunters everwhere swear by them.....................

The reason this market hass us by the B[:-]lls with this scent stuff is.................well........We cant freaking Smell anything[:o][>:]. Our ability to smell is like 1/ 1,000 of a deers abiltiy. We are blind with our noses............and IMO we are paying for it.

Dress a blind man in purple and pink leasure wear - tell him he looks good and.......if he trusts you he HAS to believe you.

Absorbing crystals:eek: - Sure they MAY have the ability to "absorb some scent but...........how many thousands of thos "crystals" are you dropping on your way in and out of the stand????....like leaving a trail of popcorn if you ask me:eek::eek:

You asked my advise ........well here it is (and as a shop owner I know this is bad business)but.....Forget it all.....all of it. Forget the carbon clothes, the crystals, the spray the black carbon spray, the powder........the whole lot of it:D

Lets get back to some common sense, scent fundamentals. Lets look the devil in the eye, grab the mirror too while your at it:) and admit a few things.

1 - We Stink[:-] - no way about it....like a skunk to a deer. Sparay some of that magic potion on a skunk.....and tell me you don't smell it.
2 - The proper wind or luck - is the ONLY way to keep a deer from smelling us when on stand!!!..period
3 - We know nothing about scent....I mean it nothing. Its like UV lighting..Its there but damn if I can tell.
4 - You have been busted, You will get busted........just deal with it
4 - In trying not to "kill" a stand....focus on wind and what smell you are leaving behind going in and out......example........

I met a fellow hunter I knew casually in the woods a couple years ago. We where both leaving our stands and met up in some thick scrub oak. He had on the works...Carbon suit...black carbon stains...a wafer on his head:D..and lord knows what else. As he was working his way towards me in the thick stuff along his tackline, he was grabbing and pushing small branches out of his way with his BARE HANDS. Upon meeting, he told me he saw 10 deer on stand the first day (not one winded him), 3 deer the next time (none winded him) and none today..........Duhh[:o]. He noticed I was wearing rubber gloves on my hand....and commented on how I must be more of a scent freak then him........LOL.
All I had was clean clothes, rubber boots and the gloves.......far from a freak......well....atleast to me:D. This guy just didn't get it.

Put as many stands as you can in the BEST areas you can find. Hunt the wind to the best of your ability. Use simple common sense when it comes to your scent, and take your lumps as they come.

Sorry no magic answers here:D

No offense to those who use these products......JMO:):D;)

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

I agree with Rack. Clean clothes and body, rubber boots and rubber gloves, (unless you can walk through the woods and climb into your stand without touching anything with your hands. (Gloves come off when in the stand.) I no longer use scent eliminators and scent lok suits. (Yes I was suckered into buying one). I do use a homemade pine coverscent. I believe it helps.

I did notice they are now selling carbon underwear. Only $100 a pair.[:o][:'(]
Easy enough to test out on TACO night.[&:][X(]

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Great points Rack. :) I agree, common sense is a neccesity. Forget the wind...Just hunt! LOL, yeah right.

The only thing I ever use is Scent Killer. To a deer, I don't know how well it works, but to a humans nose ... it works pretty well. I can sweat all day long working.... and once I spray my stinky, sweat soaked hat...the smell is gone completely. Now, can the deer still smell me??? Probably... but to me it's a cheap vote of confidence...and I figure even if they still can smell me, it can't be near as bad. I still play the wind, regardless.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

:D

I'm a little center of left from you on this, I think and my personal anecdotal evidence suggests some of this stuff has value. Especially the spray which I whip up as a home brew for $4 per gallon :)

I've gotten away with stuff I never did in the past, enough to give me some confidence in it.

I guess the allure of having scent absorption is the icing on the cake. I agree that apparently bacteria can't reproduce in the presence of silver, but even if what the manufacturers state is true, that it's good "for the life of the garment", logic suggest the stuff would have to be in constant contact with your skin, where the little nasties live. Hard to do in the pits, crotch and under a full head of hair :).

As for the ab-scent, it's been around for years, doesn't seem to have caught on, either bad marketing or it doesn't work.

The no-trace sounds intriguing, and again is reported to outlast the garment, but they want just a hair under what carbon goes for, basically for soaking some camo clothes in a vat of the stuff :(

If it was a liner type system made of a wicking material and went for around $20 per pant and shirt and headnet, I'd try it. Apparently though, the company has allusions of granduer. Perhaps they wanna make a killing before people like you catch on and wise the rest of us up... :)

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

The jury is still out as to weather I wisen up or stupify "the rest of us".................LOL:D

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

I have agreed with you on this before and do so again Rack !! :D

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

I save a bundle on scent elimination. I just bath in febreeze and hang a glade plug-in aroung my neck:D:D. Just teasin, I have to agree with you to an extent rack. Most if not all of these things do eventually wear off but I still like the scent elimination spray. I know it doest kill all the scent and the deer can still smell me but I think it cuts down on the odor and makes it a little tougher on the deer, but I always play the wind regardless. No matter how many gimmicks they come out with, nothing beats time and hard effort.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

That's what my wife keeps telling me...

:D

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

I used to train a couple of dogs for competitions where they had so many minutes to find x number of birds. The olfactory senses on these animals are mind boggling.

I would guess the whitetail to be at least or near equal to that of a dog. There are many documented cases where a dog followed a missing person's trail days after it was made only to find the individual. Look at the drug smugglers. They hide their wares in everything from coffee grounds to fish. Talk about cover scent! Yet a trained dog will have no problem distinguishing the presence of a drug. I would not at all be surprised if they wrapped the "goods" in scentlok clothing. Now that would be an interesting study wouldn't it. :)

I saw an add recently for 'Elimitrax' stating that two trained Bloodhounds could trail a rubber booted person but they could not trail a person wearing their product. Now we know nothing of the controls set up on this "independent" experiment. Atmospheric conditions can play a huge role in ground scent. Do I believe the results of their experiment? Sorry, I am a doubting Thomas. When it comes to making money off of a product that can't be quantified I get skeptical in a hurry. Is it better than rubber boots? I don't doubt that. But even then ground scent is only part of the equation.

We are stone blind when it comes to the olfactory universe. We smell just good enough with our nose to get ourselves in trouble. We add "reason" to our olfactory knowledge and believe we are thinking like a deer! That cracks me up. The deers sense of smell is not a sense that operates alone, independent of the other four. Though not strictly correct that is the world WE live in. A deer's olfactory unit is intricately woven into all five of their senses at a level we have trouble grasping.

Imagine yourself as being deaf. You are about to walk across a train track when look up and notice a train is coming. As the train goes barreling past you can't hear it. You can feel the wind and vibration it is causing and see the effects of its momentum. But until you identified it by sight, you had no clue to it's presence. Now add being blind to the same scenario and see how it further complicates the issue. Now you don't even know the train track is there. (As we all know a deer doesn't need to hear or see you to know your there). That gives you and idea of the handicap we deal with when it comes to a deer's nose.

Of course our ace in the hole is our brain. Half of the time I wonder if mine is working, especially on those rare days when I hear one snort that turns into a multitude of snorts and I know I have just been had. [:@]

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Some of us dont have that problem [:o] or

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Anyone who works with dogs will not believe much of this scent elimination stuff. I have to believe deer are at least the equal of a dog in regards to scenting abilities. I hunt and trial beagles and have owned bunches of them for years. My beagles can find me by following my tracks (made with rubber boots), many hours after I have left the track. Not only that, but they can tell my rubber boots from a large number of other tracks made with rubber boots. I've tried to fool them and cannot. I've sprayed the bottoms of the boots with Scent Eliminator and cover scents. It doesn't slow them down a bit. Think about this. My dogs can tell which way a rabbit is moving by smelling the track. They can detect the difference between the track they're running and any new tracks that cross the original one. They can easily determine when a rabbit has "backtracked". I've seen them following the track of a rabbit without missing a turn, while running as fast as they can. And for those who think rubber boots leave no scent, they can follow my rubber boot tracks much easier than any animal track.

I don't own a carbon suit and don't plan on ever spending the money to get one. If I had one, I'd bet anything that my dogs could find me as easily while I was wearing it, as they can when I'm not. Having studied my dogs scenting abilities over the years, has convinced me that you are not going to fool an animal's nose with the scent elimination stuff they're pushing on us at this time.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

I never got into all that scent elimination clothes and stuff,I just figured that it was a bunch of you know what.I use common "scents"and that what works for me...Bob

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Hype is powerful tool. At one time or another we all find ourselves in its grasp. Once a paradigm has been accepted, obvious truth found in logic, common sense, and yes, at times, even experience can be blurred.

Years ago one would read about the merits of wearing rubber boots for scent control (come to think of it we still do). It became standard practice to wear them and believe that for the most part deer couldn't smell where you walked as long as the boots were free from obvious issues like petroleum products and such. It seemed to make sense so I added rubber boots to my "can't live without" list. However, as Straightarrow has very eloquently pointed out, I noticed my dogs had no problem finding me or my trail even when I wore them. Further, I witnessed first hand deer go on full alert upon discovering my rubber booted trail. Though scoffed at by some of the guys in bowhunting circles I tried leather boots and found that there was no noticeable difference in the deers reaction as long as the boots were free from "foreign" material. Even though my experience showed otherwise it was hard not to put those rubber boots back on until cold weather came.

Fast forward to the invention and now "improved and refined" carbon suits. Not only do we have pages upon pages of ads declaring their effectiveness, we have videos of some of the most successful and well known hunters in the country saying things like, "We couldn't have killed this monster if it hadn't been for our carbon suit!" That is powerful marketing. How is the average "lunch bucket" hunter going to be able to deny the power of the "suit" when seemingly all of the known experts have said "they wouldn't hunt without one"!

I'll bet only a modest percentage of hunters even know there is some scientific doubts as to their effectiveness and longevity. Like the medieval knights of old, we can see by the numbers of carbon clothing being sold that our hunting brethren have accepted the carbon suit as their protective armor. I don't see this paradigm changing anytime soon.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

IMHO Carbon suits & scent eliminators are just "snake oil" in a new package. I see I am not alone.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Rubber is gas permeable. Odor is gaseous in nature. Go figure...

I bought a pair of Rocky SCS boots, and can honestly say after wearing them for two full seasons, they have no discernable odor to me.

They're breathable to let moisture escape, and have a treated lining to prevent bacterial growth which apparently works very very well.

I start with clean and de-scented as much as possible feet, socks washed in sports wash, and use a pair of Dr. Scholl's odor eater inserts.

I've had both does and bucks cross my entrance path nose down and show no sign of alarm. In the past, this was never so.

I think the key is clean feet, and boots that prevent bacterial growth from generating odor. This combo has worked very well for me.

I have no doubt deer/dogs could detect or trail me if they were so inclinded, but for hunting deer, I don't seem to be leaving any odor that alarms and puts them on the offensive.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

I've got to get involved in this and put in my two cents. I have to agree and disagree with you Rack (and others). As - I personally wear carbon suits and I have been doing this long enough (remember the old days) to know that it has helped me stay more, undetected since using it! How long it works - who knows. I guess time will tell in the next season or so. That's okay, because I do quite well financially and if I have too, I will purchase another suit. This is my opinion only!

Now - the part where I agree 110% with Rack. I too have encountered other hunters (some I know, others I don't). It boggles me that some people can appear to be so intelligent but prove to be such idiots. For example; last year I decided to hunt a little 100 acre patch that my dad and I own and hadn't hunted in a couple years. So I got up REAL early one morning, threw on my sweats, grabbed my gear and drove to the local 7/11 to get some coffee for the 45 minute drive. While at the station, hunters pulled up in their truck. The driver started fueling up his rig, while the other ran inside to grab coffee and breakfast sandwiches. This is an older place and it smells like eggs and bacon 24/7. They looked at me grinning and asked if I was going hunting!?! I grinned back and said yes - how about you? They said yes!

Here's the point: They were already suited up in Carbon Suites, boots, etc. They had everything except safety harness, bow and gloves on. Now you tell me - is their carbon suites going to help them remain undetected? The answer is NO. You may be thinking - well - what about you. I stripped each thread of clothing off, sprayed down with scent killer and put on my hunting clothes at a later time.

IMO - I think this is the biggest problem with scent-elimiation garments. Hunters do not preserve them the way in which was intended. I am a freak when it comes to odor. I will not put on my hunting clothes until I'm in the environment in which I plan to hunt. I will not wear them outside that environment. All of my gear is stored in locked, scent-free containers with baking soda, etc. Doing this requires disapline and is a lot of work and sometimes can be very uncomfortable! But if you want an edge on the whitetail nose, you have to. YOU DON'T have a choice!!

Before you tear me up Rack - let me say that I've never said and will never say that carbon suites or anything else will conceal the human stench! I don't think anything can. I'm simply saying that it has HELPED me. Maybe it's a chemistry thing - ya know - like cologne. Some colognes smell different on different people!!

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Come on...........I wouldn't do that.......

I respect what you have seen using the carbon suit........heck man YOU may be right:)

We may disagree.....but as long as we "argue" for the pupose of getting closer to the truth.........rather then defending our position or purchase........then I think its for the greater good:D

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Found the link to the No-Trace stuff-

http://notrace.us/Home/home.html

If they offered it in a base layer designed to be worn next to your skin, I'd be interested in trying it out...

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

There's another side to this discussion. If you could buy a product that would make you absolutely undetectable by any deer, would you use it? How about if you could buy a bow that is so forgiving, that you need not worry about poor form or bad tuning, would you buy it? How about a broadhead so deadly, that it flies straight out of any setup and is guaranteed to pass through a deer leaving a huge wound, no matter where you hit?

Once things get too easy, are we still bowhunting or are we just hunting? If you want to be undectable and absolutely lethal with your weapon, why not just use a rifle? Once you go too far with technology, aren't you just going the same direction that gave us easier kills (as in shotguns and rifles). If it gets to the point where there is little to no challenge, there will be little to no reward. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that technology is bad, just that it makes bowhunting different. How easy does it have to be?

Personally, I'm very happy that most of this scent control stuff is hype. But if it wasn't, would you really want every advantage possible? Do you really want to remove as much of the challenge as you can? Isn't there a reward in choosing a hunting method that requires more skill and less technology, one where getting close isn't always guaranteed, one where the quarry has a very good chance of escape? Just some thoughts to ponder when each considers why they bowhunt.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

I agree mostly with what has been said. I want to dig a little further, what about sent free soap, you can't really use irish spring or ivory and what about deoderant. Just curious what everyone thought about this type of scent elimination.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

like others have said, IMO, the key to hunting scent free is getting in and out without being detected. Forget while your hunting. If your hunting with a bad wind, you're screwed, a mature buck will bust you.

The key is to take every precaution to not ruin you stands by stinking up you arrival and departure paths. This means wearing rubber boots, having clean clothes, clean body, rubber gloves, etc.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Double Creek, In my opinion clean and scent free are different. I understand what you meant by clean but how do you clean your clothes or your body without scent free soap and still get them clean and remain scent free.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Rack-attack

no kidding iwoudl say more like 95% of the time for scent clothing! Just way too expensive & I just won't shell out the doe for that stuff! I question how well activated carbon can work since you can not get it hot enough to reactivate it in a dryer!

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

http://www.fastestbows.com/articles/...an/x-scent.htm

I might actually buy some of this stuff. Not any more $$$ than a good set of long underwear. So it can't hurt.. and if it helps me out a little then it's worth it.

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

While I clearly see your point, there's also the part about doing everything right, finally getting a crack at the big one and Mother Nature throwing a wierd wind swirl you're way and him packing, without your arrow in or through him... :)

Yes. You need to use solid fundamentals and woodsmanship to get shot opportunities. But for those who don't get to hunt as much as they'd like (fricking jobs), a blown opportunity or two can easily ruin a season.

I agree, hunt the "prevailing" wind direction. Problem is, it's rarely 100% consistent in it's direction. Have you seen the original tree lounge video where they documented some guys sitting around a campfire and the wind direction changed 57 times in one hour? Easy to tell from the visible smoke, if they'd been in a tree, their scent would have been blown 360* around them. Paying attention in stands, I find this holds true probably 85% of the time in areas I can hunt.

I don't forsee products that greatly reduce human odor as being the final nail in the whitetails coffin and threatening their extinction :)

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Not my point at all.

My point had to do with deciding on how much challenge each wants to have. Some will prefer as little challenge as possible. Others will want to continually add to the challenge. You can shoot at sitting ducks in a pond or you can try to hit them on the fly. Either can bring home the meat, but one is far more challenging and rewarding than the other. :)

That's part of hunting. If it wasn't, it would be called shooting. ;)

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

i will be watching this post closely. i have been a scent-lok hunter now for 4 years and before that i never really saw any deer. same area and everything that i was doing before. i was going to buy the whole scent lok jump suit liner but i am not sure. i shower every time before i go hunting and not having something like scent-lok on me kinda makes me feel naked. now this might have been advertising sunk into my brain but i don't know. the one guy said something about making a home made pine scent cover spray. i think this would be the key in my area because it is 75% pine thickets. keep this thread going cause i will be watching...thanks

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

I'm with Rack, but slightly not in some places!! :)

I think Carbon suits are a flat joke. They actually kill the product by themselves saying it "traps" odor. Doesn't kill it, just traps it. Hmmmm.. I guess when I run around in a Scent-Lok bubble it might work eh? Too many holes (collers, buttons, cuffs) for odor to escape.

Now this x-scent stuff.. now that might be getting somewhere. I'm cool with them trying to kill it first and applying science that has worked for years. I work with military folks and the U.S. military uses the x-scent sock to kill bacteria and avoid the famous "boot rot" they get. If you buy some, they are in green! Imagine that. Now with that said, I think it might help and I stink enough that anything that helps I'm cool with at a price. This stuff is extremely cheap and worth trying. Also, read the article and other carbon articles from the link above (by KBacon). Very good stuff in my opinion and will open carbon believers eyes I think!

RE: Hey Rack, how 'bout this stuff
 

Carbon suits are one of the many scams pulled on gullable hunters everyday. we have to be one of.......if not the biggest group of suckers walking the earth.

Guys will buy ANYTHING if they think it will better their chances in the woods.

The hunters market is an absolute DREAM for product pushers. The greatest thing about scent elimination is it can never be proven true or false. A guy who sits in the woods all day and sees nothing can easily think to himself "maybe I am getting winded and they are avoiding me"............maybe..........maybe not. In the same vein......a guy wearing scent lock everything may see a bunch of deer or a nice buck and love his suit to death even though he has no way of knowing if he would have seen the same deer if he smelled like a dead carp. It's like when Homer wanted to buy Lisa's rock that kept bears away..........there were no bears around.........the rock must work right??

It's just the nature of hunters. I know guys that have hunted and dropped estrous scent for 10 years trying to lure a buck to their stand........if one deer in 10 years even looks like he might have sniffed that trail they are hooked for life........forget the 99.9% of the time it did nothing or actually hurt their chances..........any sign of success and it's hook, line and sinker!!!

I saw a very interesting show on Mossy Oak Classics the other day on TV. A guy arrowed a big beautiful buck from a stand on the corner of a food plot. What was he wearing?? A full blaze orange vest. The guy looked like a pumpkin in his tree and arrowed a big mature buck that anyone would love a shot at. Makes you think sometimes about all these guys trying to become invisible by painting their faces and buying up the latest and greatest patterns.


Back on topic. Scent wise I will give scent eliminating sprays the benefit of the doubt because I had a rain suit last year that stunk to high heaven of rubber. I sprayed it down and instantly could not even get a hint of that smell that was very strong to start. Does that mean a deer couldn't smell it??.......doubtful......but it's better then it was.

I wash all my stuff in scent free soaps and store them in a large bag with earth wafers in it. I spray all my stuff with scent elimination spray and then earth scent or Kischell's golden rod (same thing). I will gather up some folliage from my usual spot shortly before the season starts and place it in with my stuff.........I figure it is what they smell every day so how can it hurt?? I shower with scent free wash and get dressed in the field.......gloves stay on until I am seated in stand. I don't see that as excessive but it is also not careless.......takes little effort on my part and I have never felt like scent was something holding me back............the vast majority of my gun kills are within 40 yards and many are well within bow range and I use no scent precautions during gun season........and wear orange from head to toe.

I guess the deer suddenly lose their eyesight and smell when the guns come out because guys seem a lot less concerned when they lock and load then when they grab their bows.


One last thing before I go...........I think the funniest/saddest thing I have ever wittnessed about scent is when I bought my bowtech the guy at the shop showed me something I bet most guys would never know. He had the limbs off a Mathews and let me smell the grease in the limb pockets......WOW!!! Talk about a stiff chemical smell. The bowtech grease stunk like crazy too. I wonder how many guys out there are freaking out about scent elimination down to the most obsessive details.............and then toting a bow in the woods with grease on it that smells like a chemistry lab??


I have to go now............my Deer View Mirror came in from Cabela's today and I just know it is gonna help me get a nice buck this year........can't wait to try it!!


;)