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brace ht--myth or fact!
ok everybody this is to answer a few of my buddies questions and doubts about brace ht and forgivness--concerning accuracy.why cant a short draw archer with a 27 to 28 in draw length with a brace ht of between 53/4 to 63/4 be as accurate and consistant as someone with a draw between 29 and 30 in with a brace ht between 63/4 to 73/4.also due to draw length why cant a short draw archer shot a short bow axle to axle of 31 to 34 with the same accuracy of longer draw archers.i thought this was possible due to not as much string pinch on the shorter draw compared to the longer draw.any feed back would be appreciated ! i have told them a short draw archer really has a few added bonuses except for top of the line speed
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RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
I don't call those draw lengths particularly short, so you are comparing a 3.7 percent change in draw length, to a 17% decrease in brace height.
Also, you don't get the same bow often in the short draw length model. It isn't going to necesarily be a bow redrawn in every proportion to simply scale down the "forgiving" bow. If however you scaled down the bow in a forgiving way, I buy your basic proportions theory, but it would probably only justify a change of about 1/4". I think the critical factor is how well anybody shoots. If you have a great grip and bow arm position/performance, then I think that you will probably shoot a low BH bow with little difficulty. If a person is a bit of a hack, they are looking for further problems. |
RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
Because no matter how short or long your draw length - a shorter brace bow still releases the arrow closer to the rest than a longer brace bow (one of the reasons an over draw is harder to shoot)
The closer an arrow is release to its pivot point (rest) the more exagerated any deviations form center have on the arrow flight. this is one reason it is believed drop aways may lessen the effect of a short brace (because that "pivot" is gone) I also agree with Ossage in that the % difference is not the same With that said - short brace bows can still be shot rather well, and it depends on your form and how "well' you want to shoot. I don't care what your DL is a 5-1/2 Brace is going to much harder to hammer a 60x game than a 8" brace - because the margin of error is so small. Now throw in a broadhead and the forgiveness factor of a short brace can really expose bad form. Then add the clothing factor and problems can mount. But if your good - you can shoot em pretty darn well. |
RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
The longer the brace height the quicker the arrow gets off the string. Hence the forgiveness of the string imparting more or less torque (movement) on the arrow.
A bow with a 30 inch draw and a 8 inch brace height will be equally as forgiving as a bow with a 25 inch draw and a 3 inch brace height. That is assuming that the bows are equal in every way except for the brace height. Of course you have to keep your arm out of the way with a 3 inch brace height. |
RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
The longer the brace height the quicker the arrow gets off the string Some of the toughest to shoot - fasted bows around get the arrow off the string in 1/2 the time of the most forgiving target bows. If this where the case IMO Top pros would not be shooting 500 to 600 grn arrows at slow mo speeds. They would all be shooting the lightest fastest arrows they could. |
RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
You're right, it is but one small factor of a long list of factors that add to or detract from forgiveness of a bow. However, all other things being exactly the same the shorter brace height bow will be less forgiving than the bow with the longer brace height because the bow will move just a little bit more before the arrow leaves the string.
I know this would be virtually impossible to achieve but that's the theory. The quicker an arrow gets off the string the less a person can move the arrow around. Riser design, riser material, limb pocket desicn, limb material, split or solid limbs, length of limbs, weight of the bow, string material, cam design, draw force curve, arrows used, head weight, total arrow weight etc...etc...etc... all play a part in how forgiving a bow is. |
RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
also due to draw length why cant a short draw archer shot a short bow axle to axle of 31 to 34 with the same accuracy of longer draw archers. What makes the 31" bow less accurate is the fact that it is less stable. ie- an object at rest will remain at rest unless acted upon by an outside force. The shorter bow is easier to torque and cant because it is a smaller/lighter object and therefore easier to enact that outside force. (your hand, follow through) And I will agree with Rack about the brace height not being so much to do with the power stroke, but the closer it is to the rest. I beleive when the arrow is being propelled by the string, it is far harder to "cushion" itself against the rest than if it was off the string beforehand. |
RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
You are right to some degree with your theory.You are getting into power stroke.A person with a shorter draw can shoot a bow with less brace than someone with more brace and a longer draw and have the same power stroke.This will make the bows have the same "forgiveness factor" in both hands but in a perfect world with a perfect shot, it isn't a factor.
What gets overlooked is reflex and a bow can have an 8" brace and a 2" reflex and would be no more forgiving than a bow with 7" brace and a 1" reflex. Something else to ponder over while b.s. ing with your friends. ;) |
RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
Taking the general agreement between you guys that a very short bow is less accurate.......then why are mfgs. selling them and many archers wanting them? It absolutely makes no sense to use a less accurate bow for hunting.
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RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
Taking the general agreement between you guys that a very short bow is less accurate.......then why are mfgs. selling them and many archers wanting them? Also take into consideration that many of the bows with parralel limbs are much more stable than the short bows of just 2 years ago. The longer riser definitly adds stability. |
RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
guys i went to hunters friend.com and looked at there bow comparison chart and noticed all there shorter version bows scored less with the short brace ht. were all of these bows shot individually for the testing or do you think its just a common pt of view.would a string loop help to raise there score due to not as much pinch on the arrow you think.that was another question.due you really think a bow say of 31 in compared to one 34 in is that much of a difference in the woods or from a stand.i dont really see much for that purpose.
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RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
Taking the general agreement between you guys that a very short bow is less accurate.......then why are mfgs. selling them and many archers wanting them? It absolutely makes no sense to use a less accurate bow for hunting. But we don't need that sort of rig to obtain very good groups. I believe its very true that short brace and short A-A, high reflex bows are a less stable shooting platform when held by the average archer. But the average archer is willing to give up this small (sometimes not so small) amount of forgiveness to have a lighter, more manuverable hunting bow, that feels good in there hands. due you really think a bow say of 31 in compared to one 34 in is that much of a difference in the woods or from a stand |
RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
String dampeners on some of the more recent designs help keep a shorter brace height more forgiving. The string is stopped earlier thus causing the arrow to release earlier. I don't want to get into a product debate, but my LX is pretty forgiving, being that it only has a 6 5/8 brace height. It is a noticible difference between that and the shorter brace height Z-light that I used to shoot. Again, it all boils down to the shooter. I used a shorter brace height bow with no V-bar or side bars and shot a 305 on a 30 target 3-D range yesterday against guys shooting longer brace height bows with all the gear. Get something that is comfortable and learn to shoot it like a machine. That is where the game is at, be it 3-D or hunting.
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RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
Look at all the fun I missed over the weekend. :)
My take on this..... You are talking about small differences in percentages as someone mentioned above. The brace height has to be compared to the specific draw length. A 5 inch brace height bow creates a 20.25 inch powerstroke for someone that has a 27 inch draw length but what percentage of the draw is the powerstroke? 75% in this case. Now take a 30 inch draw length with an 8 inch brac height. That would mean a 23.25 inch powerstroke and a 77.5 percentage. A slightly larger percentage means that you can't really compare the two just by adding or subtracting the same amount to both the brace height and draw length. In other words, theoretically, a shorter brace height bow should be somewhat more forgiving for a shorter draw length archer but not drastically so....and not in equal proportions to the amount of draw length changed. I have always believed that a shorter brace height is somewhat more critical to shoot not because of the time on the string but rather because of the increased distance. The longer distance means more of a chance for shooting errors to impact accuracy. Ofcourse, other factors such as riser geometry, limb angle, etc... also all play a part in this as it is difficult to really separate one factor from all of the others. Hope this helps. |
RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
A bow with a 30 inch draw and a 8 inch brace height will be equally as forgiving as a bow with a 25 inch draw and a 3 inch brace height. What??? |
RE: brace ht--myth or fact!
ORIGINAL: PABowhntr Look at all the fun I missed over the weekend. :) My take on this..... You are talking about small differences in percentages as someone mentioned above. The brace height has to be compared to the specific draw length. A 5 inch brace height bow creates a 20.25 inch powerstroke for someone that has a 27 inch draw length but what percentage of the draw is the powerstroke? 75% in this case. Now take a 30 inch draw length with an 8 inch brac height. That would mean a 23.25 inch powerstroke and a 77.5 percentage. A slightly larger percentage means that you can't really compare the two just by adding or subtracting the same amount to both the brace height and draw length. In other words, theoretically, a shorter brace height bow should be somewhat more forgiving for a shorter draw length archer but not drastically so....and not in equal proportions to the amount of draw length changed. I have always believed that a shorter brace height is somewhat more critical to shoot not because of the time on the string but rather because of the increased distance. The longer distance means more of a chance for shooting errors to impact accuracy. Ofcourse, other factors such as riser geometry, limb angle, etc... also all play a part in this as it is difficult to really separate one factor from all of the others. Hope this helps. |
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