Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

Just got my new Outback with a Bodoodle Pro-Lite Rest. Having all kinds of trouble getting it tuned. Shooting nock left tear about 1/2 to 3/4 inch at 5 yds every time. I moved the rest in as far as it had adjustment for, still tears left. Shooting 60lbs with a 29in draw right handed,shooting xt5575 gold tips and also trying a lighter spined Pse 300 carbon arrow, not much help. I am reasonably sure I am not torqueing it as I can shoot bullet holes with my other two bows that have the exact same rest. Any suggestions???

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

Sounds like fletching contact to me !

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

Same rest does not mean same grip. Mathews grips are IMO prone to torque and left tears. If you cannot adjust windage to get rid of tear - Suspect contact first, grip second, then spine.

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

What can I do about grip?? I have two Bowtechs that I grip the same way I am this Outback and have no problem. I have shrink tube on the prongs , so if the fletching was making contact I would imagine there to be black streaks on the plastic vanes that were making contact.

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

ohio,

somebody correct me if I am wrong here but it sounds to me like you are moving the arrowrest the wrong way. If you are tearing to the left you should move the arrowrest to the left, I think. It sounds to me like you were moving it toward the riser when you maybe should have been going away from it. Sorry if I'm wrong.

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

When paper tuning and you are getting tears that require moving string- nock or rest, always move the component opposite of nock tear. In most cases, if fletch/vane tear is up, move nock down. If tear is down, move nock up. If fletch/vane tear is left, move rest right. If fletch/vane tear is right, move rest left. In some cases, moving the string-nock and rest may require that you adjust to the same direction as the "tear."

However, do not misconstrue that I am saying that adjusting the position of the string nock and/or rest is all you need to do to solve any "tear" problem. Solving "tear" problems (arrow flight) may require an adjustment of one or several components, which includes arrow spine and your shooting form.

Additionally, there are some other adjustments that are rarely listed in the paper tuning troubleshooting steps that might correct a "tear" problem when the "standard" methods do not.

For example:

- I once was getting a "high tear," and nothing in the standard troubleshooting methods would cure the problem. I eventually tracked the problem to the tension setting of my rest (I use GFK Rover and Golden Premier) rests.

I had changed the prong group (prongs and shaft) on the rest to a newer style. Although I marked the setting of the prong group that I removed, the new group did not accept the same setting as the one I had removed. Consequently, the rest tension was too weak. Although weakening the tension of the rest is one method that can cure a nock-high tear, I discovered that that the rest was partially collapsing at full draw. When I fired, the down pressure (release shooter) caused the rest to fall, which caused the fletch and nock end of my shaft to smack the rest, which then kicked the nock end of my shaft up.

I cornered the problem when I discovered that the nock high tear only occurred when 10 yards from the paper, but disappeared at 21 yards. That led me to look for a contact problem that was minimal enough to allow the arrow fletch to stabilize the shaft when given enough distance to do so.

- On another occasion, I decided to experiment with a "Martin" prong rest that came on both of 2 new Martin bows I purchased. This particular rest had prongs that flexed independent of each other. I was getting right/left tears and none of the standard trouble shooting methods would cure the problem.

I finally boiled the possible causes down to being a contact problem, and also detected that a side pressure on the shaft could be intermittently occurring, but should not have (side pressure) being I was shooting with a release and a center-shot rest.

What I discovered was that the tension on the left prong of the Martin rest was much weaker than the right prong. The left prong would flex downward before the right prong could react. This caused my shaft to roll off the right prong, putting most of the down pressure on the left prong. This phenomenon then caused the right prong to ride against the side of my shaft, creating a quasi-pressure button affect, and allowed the right fletch to clip the right prong. Put my trustworthy GFK on and the problem was solved.

- Another time I was having right-left tear problems when shooting a Pro series Martin "Firecat." I was adjusting right/left alignment of the rest to the point that the "centering" of the rest was too far left and then too far right. Everything pointed to a torque problem. However, I rarely torque. In fact, I shoot with such a loose grip, I have had bows jump out of my hand.

I eventually tracked the cause to the custom grip on the bow. The grip (wood) was larger than I prefer, and had a large "palm swell." Regardless that I was not torquing the bow, the design of the grip caused a natural torquing when I drew the bow. I resized and reshaped the grip, and the problem was cured.

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

Certainly every new bow is a potential new tuning adventure. Grip torque is one of those things that can frustrate your efforts to get a good tune. I actually have two bows that will not shoot well through paper, or with bare shaft arrows, unless I grip the bow with some firmness, and curling my fingers around the front of the grip. If I use a loose grip, the bows give me a pretty bad right tear.[:@]

My experiences have been about the same as C903 as far as height and nocking point. As far as the left-right component, what he says about tears is what I have found to be true with a bare shaft arrows, and where they are hitting. When I am getting a left tear while paper tuning (rare for me), I usually have to move my rest to the left to get rid of it, not to the right. Again though, every bow is a law unto itself as far as adjustments are concerned, at least AFAICT. www.bowjackson.com has the Easton tuning guide and other helpful info.

I probably should not be on the technical forum "bantering", but I am just trying to help. [8D]

If you can't get the bow tuned properly, you should probably visit a qualified pro shop and seek their assistance.;)

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

JOE PA:

You are not "bantering." Telling about personal experiences with problems and solutions is just as instructive ....sometimes more so, as providing technical info.

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

I agree with c903. Why this use of terminology? I feel reassured when I see that others have had the same issues/problems as I have.

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

Frank:

The answer to the question can be found in a multi-page thread that you yourself started! :D

Seek the path to BE the ultimate moderator!;)

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

Jeff,

You been smokin' something buddy? I get kind of confused with that Zen stuff....:)

I looked back over the last 50 threads you posted on an could not find a clue to what you are talking about.

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

try another group of heavier spined arrows. I bet its the spin, i would put the arrow rest back and shot some 400's, or take the point off and see if it tears better, or as light a point as you can go. Were at in ohio im from Cincy.

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

I agree with elk freak. If your rest is all the way to the right then you arrow is already sitting in a position pointing to the right which will give you a left tear. I believe you need to try to recenter your rest. Then start over. The arrows are not the problem. If anything they are on the stiff side which would give you a right tear.

RE: Help!! Frustrating left nock tear!!!
 

ohiogleanerman, how about an update? Have you solved the problem yet?

Just a bit more "non-technical banter" but thought I would relay my experience from last night.[:@]

One of my Axis arrows had a few tears in the fletching, so I decided that it was time to see where I was at with bare shaft tuning with the Pro 40 Wheely. As I started out, I was getting a slightly tail-right flight, and the bare shaft was hitting just a bit to the left of the fletched arrow. I figured I knew what adjustments to make, but they just made the situation worse.[:@] The Wheely has a GKF micro-adjustable rest on it, so I thought this would be easy to take care of. I tried different horizontal positions, vertical positions, spring tension, and nothing made the bare shaft fly straight. Adding to the frustration were my two other bows that were shooting the bare shafts as close to perfectly as I can tell @ 16 yards. Frankenstein, my put-together bow with a new brown Whisker Biscuit rest was putting the bare Axis, fletched Axis, and even an ACC 3-60 into the same spot. Even the ancient Viper was doing basically the same with an old XI Omega rest.;)

I ended up setting the rest the way it was when I started, which gave me the best results, bare shaft about 3/4 to 1" left. With the Bowtech, I had been putting my hand on the ridge of the grip right on the thumb side of my lifeline, and gripping it loosely. On a whim, I decided to grip the bow like I had to with the other two bows. First shot with the bare shaft, it flew perfectly. The fletched arrow tried to squeeze into the same hole in my bag target.:) Being a slow learner at times, I shot the same spot again. Anyone know where I can buy more X-nocks?[&:] After that, I started shooting different spots, with the same results. Grip the bow, excellent bare shaft flight and grouping. Tried to go back to the loose grip, got the tail right flight and left impact back.[:'(] I could continue to tear my hair out over this, but it is already getting thin in the front.
Guess I will just grip this bow too, and see how it does. I think that is what I would normally do in a hunting situation anyway, unless I made a conscious effort to use the exaclty placed loose grip.;)

As far as your problem goes, I had a Q2 XL and an MQ 1 and both of these bows shot and tuned better for me with a high-wrist grip. The Mathews grips are very narrow throated, and flare to wider dimensions farther down. Lots of guys like them that way, but it didn't work too well for me unless I high-wristed the bow. Might be worth trying if you continue to have problems.