Got a response from mathews
 

Here is an email that I received from the tech department at mathews. I have been contacting them about the ideas and suggestions that I received from my post on what would you like to see from mathews in 2004. Here is the letter, and please keep responding to the other post because they might be looking into it.


Rodney, let me say that if we are backed into a corner it is a good
corner to be in with a fantastic view. Not only do we feel and stand behind
the one cam being the correct path to go down but record sales again for
September and October of 2003 back this statement. Yes Matt will continue to
pursue his Guitar business and his Gospel music as this is what he likes to
do. I think that you will be impressed with what we will have to offer this
year and am very excited to get it started myself !! Something else you
might be interested to know is that the competitor that you had previously
mentioned lost two of their top shooters, , not to us but it is another
single cam bow manufacturer. Don' t know the reasons, probably money but it
will be interesting to here what their feelings are on shooting the cam 1/2.

Matt has a lot of new innovations to offer in the future to further
increase the stability and growth of Mathews, but you have to be careful
when you bring them out as something' s are just to much to fast !!
Rodney, trust me ! We are just getting warmed up ! You cant run a 99 yard
play on every down but we will give it our best shot and to remain at the
top of our game for sometime to come !!!

Shoot through riser' s ? That play wasn' t perfected in the first quarter
!!!

THANKS
ART HENDERSIN
WARRANTY/TECH
MATHEWS INC.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

I wonder what so called " innovations" they have planned for this year. The roller guard is pretty much worthless and doens' t change performance of the bow, in fact all I' ve read on it is that it caused lots of headaches with cable wear. String suppressors?...You know you are getting desperate when that is the biggest imporovment for a model year. I just don' t like the idea of a hole in my limb at that point. Parrallel limb design, please, I don' t see hoyt going parralel, and they seem quite comfortable being ahead of mathews setting all these new records with the cam.5. Sure they are backed into a corner and I don' t think they do have a good view, because I believe that the view looks better from ahead than it does behind...does anyone concure on this? The v-lock limb cup system, what a joke. I just saw a really really old jennings bow with a forged riser at a yardsale that had the same exact thing. The only thing mathews can do to keep up with the new trend of 2 cams, duallys, and cams that are greater than one but less than two is to market there own. Maybe come out with stronger limbs and how bout some better customer service. Slap some winners choice strings and cables on as stock and stop using your inferior zebra twist strings...they creep, they suck, bite the bullet and get over it. I would suggest dumping the roller guard, its useless. Also, better grips and how bout some mossy oak camo instead of bill jergins camo. I' m a fan of solid limbs so keep them, how bout a pivoting limb pocket, and an adjustable cam. I' m sorry for rambling on but man do I hate mathews. I hate there advertising and I pretty much made my conclusion on the company and the people who run it based on that. They remind me of the older brother who doesnt like being shown up by the younger so he' ll do dirty tricks to make them look superior and the younger inferior, only instead making a complete horses ass out themeselves and making the younger shine in the process.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

If you dont like anything about them then by all means DONT BUY ONE......But the new shoot through riser now thats a big step forward......:D To each his own ....Thank God or we would' nt have anything to complain over......;)

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

Hawgz

I think you will find that there have been shoot through risers in the past so nothing really new about them.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

If they use the time and effort they spend bashing Hoyt on their own products maybe they will be at the top of the archery world again some day![:' (]

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

Ausie-Guy........Yep I know I was being...well smart to Doc about Mathews innovations....;) And BF what makes you think they are not still at the top????? Still ahead of Hoyt in sales....[:o]

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

Do you have a copy of your e-mail to them too?

It' s good that they responded to your e-mail but why must they single out another bow company in their reply?

Heck, it' s public knowledge Mathews has a beef with Hoyt... First with the cam.5 and they' re already talking bad about the shoot through riser bow Hoyt' s making...I can' t believe they even include it in their e-mails... Well, yes I can...

I' ve been responsible for doing BowTech' s technical e-mails for almost two years now and if I downed another company like that (or in any way) I would probably loose my job with BowTech.

JMHO.... I know it don' t count as much though...;):D

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

:D

After reading that reply email I just have to go read the Mathews thread....

:D

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

All I mentioned in my e-mail to mathews was about the ideas and suggestions that were being posted, and the fact that it seems that one of their biggest competitions seems to be hoyt. This is obvious because of the marketing and information that we hear and read about in practically every magazine we look at. Right now, I like to shoot mathews, but believe me if hoyt, bowtech, pse, ect. makes something I enjoy shooting more, then thats what I would shoot. I am not a one company person. It' s funny, I have two proshops within 20 minutes of my home, and one is a mathews dealer and the other a hoyt reflex.[:-] I would love to shoot a bowtech, just to see what they are like, but no one close deals them around here that I know of. Like I mentioned in my other post, I , in no way want to turn this into an arguement about different companies, or down each others choice of equipment in any way, I just wanted to see if mathews would listen to the ideas of shooters currently using their equipment. If I were shooting any other bow, I would do the same thing.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

I agree. I was really turned off by all of their recent adds. Personally I don' t care about their beef with another company. To me it' s just like the mud slinging the politicians use in their campaigns. It' s annoying.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

This
Is what mathews REALLY needs to take care of in 2004.

There is nothing wrong with being proud of your product. There is something very wrong with being unprofessional and juvenile about it.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

JeffB, I agree 100 percent with you. It seems that a company that makes a great product can tarnish it some when handled this way. I' m sure it turns alot of people off from even trying a bow made by a company when they see this stuff. I know that bow makers always try to have a better product than the others, that is called business, but I wish they would stop seeing it as one company vs. another company, and look at the bigger picture. Archery is a brotherhood, no matter what you shoot, and everyone should do what they can to make it grow, especially the bow companies. JMHO.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

I think Mathews is heading in a non-positive direction. Ole' Matt will have to have something huge up his sleeve to bring them back up to the level they once were !
Even though their sales are good right now.........I see a decreasing trend coming on.......unless like I said ......he' s got something huge in R/D !!

I have been a die hard Mathew' s fan....and only owned Mathews for the last 6-7 years. And I also have gotten all my friend' s shooting Mathews' bows. Years ago , I never shot anything even close to as smooth as a MQ-1 or MQ-32......but now-a-days there are so many just as smooth .
Reading all these posts has reminded me of how bad Matt screwed my old pro-shop (a Mathews senior pro shooter)..... Look at their advertising this year(even though I don' t think Hoyt is a saint either) and ponder about an seemingly insignificant problem on my LX.
My LX' s string stretched as they normally will do........problem is .......on the roller guard bows , this can cause your string to come off the roller during the shot (unlike a traditional cable gaurd). It quickly can eat up a serving ...........when my dealer called about this(since I got their first LX) .......Mathews said " strings are not covered under warrenty" !!![:' (]

After all these posts .........I think I' m starting to get ticked off about it !! Unless they come up with something unbelievable...........my next bow will probably be a Bowtech or possibly a Merlin (if I can ever get to actually see one) !!

[Deleted]
 

[Deleted by Admins]

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

Hey guys, I have been shooting Mathews bows for some years now and i like them!
I would not say I am a Mathews shooter for the rest of my life...no, no not at all...
I keep looking at other brands as well.
I once changed from PSE to Mathews and i had comment from other shooters like i wasnt loyal to the PSE and it wasnt done or something like that.
Well....fact was, and still is, Mathews makes good bows.
We can all go like there is something else better, but mine are still doing very, very well.
In fact, I was thinking about going for new targetbow next season and so far, from what i have found, mathews is the one i will focus at.
In a time where different brands try to sell bows with much different colors and non-reliable specs on speeds and all....
I still for the simple truth.
Mathews, Darton, Bowtech...... These 3 are af far ias i can see the most relaiable at the moment.
I really like to see what they come up with....
Oh..and as far as the shoot trough risers....It will simply not be my type of bow.
I just cannot see why it would be a step forward.
Arrows on these kind of bows are shot the same way as others.
As far as i know there is only one type of compound shooting arrows really trough the middle; the oneida.
Due the camsystem on the others the strings where allwayws a little bit out of the middle......
Simple as that.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

Amen my friend, Amen :D

I don’t think anyone can really fault any bow company for wanting to make money. After all they are a business just like any other, and have families to support and mouths to feed just like any one of us. The business plan Matt has is smart for long-term success. His marketing plan however has started to slide downhill..at least from a business " ethics" standpoint (if there is sucha thing[:-])

I’ve always liked the Mathews product, even though I’ve have had my ups and downs with single-cam technology over the years. There is no doubt Mathews has made some great contributions to archers and the industry. If I were not shooting a BowTech right now (and I see no reason to change with what I’ve seen of the 2004 offerings), I’d be walking in the woods with a Legacy or LX come Saturday morning. It’s that simple.

Regardless, the BS marketing, the insults, and the arrogance has to go. You can see it in dealerships, on ranges, and now it is blatantly promoted in the advertising. Friendly competition is a good thing, but this current state of affairs is unhealthy not only for the industry as a whole, but for Mathews in particular. How many great athletes, movie stars, musicians, or other folks in the limelight have destroyed their own careers by running off at the mouth on one too many occasions? Not to mention that this industry very much goes in cycles for the “who is on top” title. 8-10 years ago HCA was riding high. Now look at them. Only the SMARTEST successful companies have managed to stay near or at the top year after year. What about Pearson? Or Bear Jennings? Even enthusiasm for PSE has waned considerably in the past few years. If Matt and his advertising crew don’t turn this around, they will likely find themselves in deep dog-poopy very soon.

It all boils down to this: Nobody likes an arrogant Ba$tard, no matter how good they are at what they do.

Too much politics in archery these days…..[:' (]

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

I don' t think I would be interested in a shoot through riser bow myself. I can' t seem to get the image of a souped up q2xl, decked out in mossy oak and all the latest bells and whistles. A little different riser design, new cam, and whatever other innovations mathews can dream up. Also shooting over 300 fps with a 7 inch brace height and modest draw weights. Also winners choice strings and cables as standard,(even though that stands a snow balls chance in h#ll since the zebra string is a mathews product). Hey, I can dream can' t I?:eek:

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

I bought a Matthews sQ2 almost 2 years ago. I looked at it based on it' s " hot reputation" I bought it because I liked what I saw. After reading some of the replies about their attitude I couldn' t agree more. I have experienced their marketing attitude through my local pro shop. I was having trouble with string stretching and went in to talk to him about it. I asked to order a winners choice string and was made to feel embarassed for asking such a thing. I took his " advice" and put on a Zebra. I am already experiencing the same problems as last year. I can tell you the next string won' t be a Zebra. When I look to buy a new bow I know I won' t be so quick to jump at Mattews again[X(

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

Now that' s funny.

I' ve never been one swayed much by advertising. But the new direction Mathews is taking sways me, far away. If they must digress to bashing and negative advertising; this says to me there is a lack of confidence in their product' s ability to stand on it' s own merit.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

Innovations are what keep companys going,if nothing ever changed we would not buy new,I look forward to the new bows & innovations coming out every year.
As for the adds Mathews runs they must work, I shot at the 2003 Indoor Nationals
in Kansas City in March, at least 1000 shooter there I bet 80-90% of the bows the
there were Mathews. Also shoot thru risers are nothing new anybody remember
the York STO ? They were junk.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

That was a problem with the dealer, not Mathews. Most stock strings are junk and need replacing, from most bow companies.

____________


Here' s my take on the situation. Mathews advertising works, and works very well. When I go to my local range, 80% of the bows being shot, are Mathews (I don' t shoot one). Out of curiosity, I' ve asked many of them what they thought of Mathew' s advertising. Most say, they like it. A few didn' t even know what the ads said, but no one said it offended them. I think this is very typical of the average hunter who isn' t on their computer talking about this stuff all the time.

I think the microcosm of bowhunters on this forum, do not at all represent the average bow user out there. Heck, I' d bet that half of the posters here, have some affiliation with a bow company or bow shop. They are biased, to an extreme. Many have anit-Mathews agendas, and will put them down at all costs. It' s always been typical business practice to attack the company on the top. Some of these anti-Mathews posters, post frequently and have gained respect on these forums, so when the issue is Mathews, they often sway the opinions of others who read this stuff. In the real world, the attitudes I see on these forums, do not exist to a noticable degree. Mathews has been wildly successful doing what they do. If the advertising didn' t work, it would be known immediately by Mathews and they would change it right away. The mere fact that it remains, is proof of it' s effectiveness. Almost no one in the real world gets offended by a product advertisement that is targeting a competitor, unless they are affiliated with a competitor.

The attiltudes that persist on these forums in regards to Mathew' s advertising, do not occur to any great degree among the average bowhunter. Believe me when I say Mathews knows this. No company dumps that kind of money into advertsing without evaluating it' s effectiveness to the nth degree. If other companies put the same amount into their advertising, you' d see a lot of the same kind of comparisons, and although this kind of advertising greatly effects competitor' s attitudes and those who are overly loyal to another company, the average bowhunter doesn' t give a hoot.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

That was a problem with the dealer, not Mathews. Most stock strings are junk and need replacing, from most bow companies.

____________


Here' s my take on the situation. Mathews advertising works, and works very well. When I go to my local range, 80% of the bows being shot, are Mathews (I don' t shoot one). Out of curiosity, I' ve asked many of them what they thought of Mathew' s advertising. Most say, they like it. A few didn' t even know what the ads said, but no one said it offended them. I think this is very typical of the average hunter who isn' t on their computer talking about this stuff all the time.

I think the microcosm of bowhunters on this forum, do not at all represent the average bow user out there. Heck, I' d bet that half of the posters here, have some affiliation with a bow company or bow shop. They are biased, to an extreme. Many have anit-Mathews agendas, and will put them down at all costs. It' s always been typical business practice to attack the company on the top. Some of these anti-Mathews posters, post frequently and have gained respect on these forums, so when the issue is Mathews, they often sway the opinions of others who read this stuff. In the real world, the attitudes I see on these forums, do not exist to a noticable degree. Mathews has been wildly successful doing what they do. If the advertising didn' t work, it would be known immediately by Mathews and they would change it right away. The mere fact that it remains, is proof of it' s effectiveness. Almost no one in the real world gets offended by a product advertisement that is targeting a competitor, unless they are affiliated with a competitor.

The attiltudes that persist on these forums in regards to Mathew' s advertising, do not occur to any great degree among the average bowhunter. Believe me when I say Mathews knows this. No company dumps that kind of money into advertsing without evaluating it' s effectiveness to the nth degree. If other companies put the same amount into their advertising, you' d see a lot of the same kind of comparisons, and although this kind of advertising greatly effects competitor' s attitudes and those who are overly loyal to another company, the average bowhunter doesn' t give a hoot.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

Come work a few weekends at the shop I help out at :D, I think you' ll find that' s not the case. Matt' s smear campaign has worked (we sell Hoyt & Mathews), and worked well. Before that ad started to see great circulation, C.5' s walked out the door at an unbelievable pace. Once the ad had been out for some time, then the questions started..Hoyt sales which had steadily increased since Nov. of 2002 leveled off, and dropped. Interestingly enough, LX sales which were absolutely abysmal for the first few months we had them, suddenly skyrocketed. That may not be representative of the entire country, but it sure affected us, and the bowhunters in our area (highest concentration of Bowunters in NYS, btw)

That said, I don' t think anyone is questioning the effectiveness of Mathews advertising (which is mainly what your post addresses) but rather how it' s not particularly healthy for the industry at large, may ruin his credibility, and/or how " ethical" the smear campaign may or may not be.

:shrug:

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

This is correct. You see, in the archery business, most dealers sell many different lines of bows whereas in say the auto industry, dealers sell Ford or Chevy not usually both... So the " yours sucks, ours is better than yours" advertising has a different effect.


In my work, I speak to and visit a lot of dealers and many of them sell several different bow lines (BowTech being one of them) and of the ones that sell both Mathews and Hoyt too, the higher percentage didn' t like the Hoyt sucks magazine ads and video tapes. I' m not saying the ads weren' t effective but were they really necessary?

Yes, I am a little biased (it' s my living and pays my bills) but I' m not anti Mathews. I will however say that their 7-8 page ads never did anythng for me but, I sure do like them better than the 2 page ads against Hoyt...

JMHO...

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

Jeff,

Actually, the main point of my post, was that the average bowhunter doesn' t care if Mathews smears Hoyt' s bows. If they did, the ad wouldn' t work. It' s only on these forums that there is a great outcry for justice to be served on the evil empire. [8D]

Bowtech shooter,

Your area may be different, but around here there is one Mathews dealer for about 40 miles. The other 25 dealers, sell something else, yet a vast majority of the bows in our league are Mathews bows (league is held at a shop that doesn' t sell Mathews). It' s easy to see why the other 25 dealers want to put Mathews down so badly. Funny how the bowhunters don' t really care. People like yourself care, and for good reason. It' s how you make your living, and Mathews is taking a big chunk of the market. I would also take offense to the " top dog" slamming my product, and like I said, it' s common for the smaller companies to all gang up on the main rival. My point is, the average bowhunter doesn' t care. Once again, if they did, the advertising wouldn' t work.

Personally, I don' t shoot a Mathews and never have. The ads mean nothing to me. If anything, they are entertaining. For me to get offended by the ad, would be silly. Mathews is doing nothing to offend me! It would be like getting offended when Coke makes fun of Pepsi (or the other way around). The consumer doesn' t care. It' s entertainment to most of those on the outside of the industry.

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

if there so inavated and the solo cam sales so much why every chance they get is to bash hoyt....... i shoot hoyt and wouldnt switch. Hoyt might of lost tWO archer but they still got the best dave cousins!!!!!!!

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

WOW! Seems like another Mathews bashing post! :( Sorry to hear about all you shooters who are having trouble. I must of gotten the only good Mathews bow in the world.[:-] I' ve shot thousands of arrows out of my Legacy. Roller guard seems just fine! Yup, I' ll have to replace the string next season but will add a couple more thousand shots to it in the mean time.

Are Mathews bows perfect? Naw, but none of them are. I hope all of you out there get your dream deer with the bow of your choice.[8D]

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

Ive shot mathews bows and they are fine bows, I have shot (and owned) Hoyt bows and they are fine bows, right now i am shooting a jennings buckmasters and guess what they kill the deer just as dead as the mathews or the hoyt does,

I actually planned on buying a mathews next spring but i feel intimidated everytime i go in the shop, the dealers of the mathews around here are just so cocky, i might look at the hoy or bowtecs

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

I know a Matthews pro shooter personally and he has the same attitude that Matthews ads show.

Personally, I shoot a Hoyt because I shot one and I liked it.

Matthews sales are always going to be higher, because everyone that buys one likes it but doesn' t like it too much, so when the new model comes out they just have to have a new one and wouldn' t dream of buying a different brand.

Just like Trucks. Ford has the highest sales every year, but Cheverolet has the highest custome satisfaction and longer life. Ford sales more because their customers want a Ford and always do, even when it breaks they buy another one. Or they just have more money than sense and buy a new one every year....

RE: Got a response from mathews
 

Only got one thing to say and I don' t shoot either a Matthews or a Hoyt!!!!

My local shop who sells both brands plus some others confided to me that his Matthews rep apologized for the manner in which Matthews tried to rip Hoyt, specifically on the cam-and-1/2.