Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Hi folks,

Now right up front let me say I'm not looking to stir anythhing up, just trying to get to know some of you here. Ever since I first learned to shoot a bow (12 or 13 yrs old) I've shot a bare bow, no sights, stabilizers, slings or any of the other gizmos and gadgets I've seen people shoot with. I realize archery is a personal thing and I'm not criticizing anyone, but am I missing something? I just don't see the need for all of this stuff. Can someone please fill me in on all this? Why do people feel the need for all the extras?

Thanks,

Vudoochylde

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

I would dearly love to be able to shoot without sights of any kind, but right now I am using a front sight but no rear peep. I just got back into archery after many years away from it and am using a No-peep to help me get consistency with my form. Once I get to the point where I can know without using the No-peep that my form is correct, I plan to remove the front sight and start practicing without it. That said, I do plan to use a release and stabilizer to help accuracy, balance, and quietness in the future. As you said, archery is a personal thing and everyone has things that make them feel comfortable and confident with their shooting.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Jason,
Thanks for the reply, I guess I should mention I'm getting back into archery after an extremly long layoff, 20+ yrs to be exact. But I never could see the need for all the extras.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

OH BOY>>> Well alot of things have changed... I started shooting a bow in 1970... is that old school ??? I dont know. I started with a recurve no sights fingers... and now I shoot one of the fastest and most advanced bows on the market with all the very best toys.
IN 1980 I got a compound bow and was able to break ballons at 15 yards and thought that was great... Well then I went to shoot in Ohio about 40 mins. from my house, called the Ravenna arsanal shoot. You had to shoot 100 points to get into a drawing so you might be drawn to hunt there. This is where the famed Hole in the horn buck came from..Well I made that 100 points but I'll tell you I seen some equipment there.. Those people were shooting around 900-1000 points.. Something I was doing was not as good as they were..I went to a local pro shop bought a better bow,got alot of pratice in and the next year I shot around 600.. Still fingers but I had sights now.. I was alot better.
I am not saying that alot of equipment will make you a better shot.
I am going to suggest that you go to a pro shop, that has indoor or outdoor leagues. Watch some of the better shooters. Look at the equipment they are using. ask them questions why they use that stuff.
In those leagues you will find all sorts of shooting forms--fingers--release--recurve--compound--and so on..
You need to ask yourself ..... how good do I want to be..
If your answer is the BEST I can be. Then the modern archer needs STUFF
I hope this helps
By the way at that Ravenna shoot, if you were in the top five archers you were automaticly able to hunt.. It took a couple of years but I was one of those top five.. and now over 20 years later I still shoot alot of STUFF and love every min.

[Deleted]
 

[Deleted by Admins]

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Like I said before, I'm not trying to stir anything up. I was just wondering if there were other bowhunters/archers here that still shot with a bare bow and nothing else. Shooting the bow always just seemed to come naturally to me and before the layoff, I was able to consistantly able to hit a spot the size of a quarter up to about 30 yards, distances longer than that the spot had to be enlarged to a half dollar but I think my accuracy was more than good enough. Once I get all my equipment checked out and I know it's safe to shoot, I'll have to see if the eyes are still up to par. I can't say because I haven't shot a bow in over 20 yrs. I guess my feelings are like with a car or truck with all the power locks and windows ect... just more things that could go wrong. Murphy's Law isn't a law it just seems to be the way things go for me. As I said before archery/bowhunting is all about personal preference, and I'm not putting anyone down I just wanted to get a feel for what other shooters were doing.

Vudoochylde

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Vudoo.,

I shoot both recurves and compounds.
I shoot 3-D so I have to use the best sights, stabilizers, and rest to try and compete, lol.
I shoot 3" groups at 20 yds with my recurves though which isn't too bad.
The recurves are much more fun to shoot, imo.
Besides, it's great not to have to worry about buying all the expensive accessories for my recurves like I do with my compounds.
Nothing to adjust either; just nock an arrow and shoot.
Another plus, my recurves are beautiful to look at also.


Sag.

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[Deleted by Admins]

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Vudoo:

I have done enough bare bow shooting to know what I can do. The problem is consistency. One day is great, the next is bad enough that I would not think about hunting deer with my recurve. I think it is fairly common for someone, like yourself, who finds barebow shooting to come naturally to assume that it should be just as easy, or nearly as easy for others to do the same. That is generally not the case. I do think that it is important to do enough barebow shooting at a young age to develop the hand-eye coordination needed for instinctive shooting. Went through the whole trad thing including making my own selfbows and arrows. Some days were incredible, but the bad days left me know that something was lacking in my abilities. I'm 50 now, and not likely to suddenly develop any amazing abilities in the future. I now shoot a fairly simple setup. An old two cam compound with a three pin sight (40yd. pin is just for 3D), no peep sight, release aid (for target panic problems) and a flipper rest. Not barebow, but not exactly 2003 high tech either. I have much more reliable accuracy with this setup. Not necessarily to shoot farther, but to be confident that I can hit what I am shooting at consistently.

Avoid the inevitable until it is absolutely unavoidable!

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

I DON'T KNOW HOW OLD SCHOOL I AM BUT I BELIEVE IN THE K.I.S.S. SYSTEM ( KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID ). I HAVE FOUND WERE I AM HAPPY MATTHEWS MQ1 SINGLE PIN SIGHT (IMPACT) NO PEEP NO STABILIZER...IT SHOOTS CONSENTLY 245 FPS AND GOOD TO 40 YARDS WITH NO HOLD OVER (ALUMUNIUM 2314 XX78SS). RELEASE AND ROPE KNOCK...THERE IS NOT MUCH TO GO WRONG AND HAVE SHOT THIS WAY SINCE I WAS 12. I PRATICE WITH FINGERS JUST IN CASE. I DON'T BELIVE IN ALL THE EXTRAS, THIS BOW IS A HUNTER FIRST.
IT IS QUIET QUICK AND APART OF ME AND THAT'S WERE IT IS IMPORTANT. I DON'T HAVE THE NEED TO THINK IT IS NATURAL....THANKS

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

I started off shooting compounds. I enjoyed shooting them, but over the years it seemed the more advanced the bow, the more crap went wrong with them and the more time I had to spend with the thing in the bow press. I also killed my share of deer with them, but always felt like something was missing a little, like I was sort of cheating myself out of an adventure. I admired the rare fellows I would see at our club shooting recurves, and finally decided to simplify life and take on a bigger challenge. If guys were able to kill deer with longbow and recurves 50, 500, 5000 years ago, why couldn't I? I bought a longbow and fell in love. A year later I began making my own selfbacked wooden bows. I enjoy the sense of self-sufficiency that comes with making most of my own equipment, and get a charge out of taking game with bows I've poured my heart into. Despite the limitations of shot distances and the fact that I now hunt mostly from the ground, my bowhunting success over the last 3 years of hunting with selfbows has actually improved quite a bit over what I was doing with compounds. When I set off into the woods with a bent stick and wooden arrows, I carry a comfort and confidence that I'm playing on the deer's level and that anything I choose to shoot will fall quickly to my arrow. Feels good.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Wow. AK that is the most moving testimony I've read on this board. You put it all together.



Cargo

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Vudo, I don't know if I can explain it any better the some of the other post but here is my 2 cents worth. I started shooting bows with the old Bear recurves in the mid 70's. Even then I just didn't get the mystic feeling some guys get when shooting trad. equip. So my bowhunting droped off for about 10 years. Then in 1990 some of my priorities changed and found myself looking to spend more time inthe woods. I picked up my first compound. Within two years I was out of controll. I couldn't get enough of it. I was thinking archery/bowhunting 24/7. I was shooting pretty good with a compound with all the gagets. A guy was talking about trad. shooting and "the arch of the arrow". So because I had such an obcession for the sport I went out a pick-up a Bighorn recurve. I was putting as much time and effort into shooting instintively as I had with the compound. Having fun and shooting ok but not getting the same feeling from it as I did with my compound. After a couple of years I pick-up my compound again and that was it. That recurve is still hanging on my wall. That was about 5-6 years ago and have never looked back. I found that I love the techie part of this sport. Shooting as many new bows as possible every year. always interested in the new material and advancement that come out every year. I tinker way more the I should. Trying different set-ups. Always feeling I can shoot tighter grougs. I started shooting competively a couple years ago and strive each year to better many standings and scores. That's what makes this sport so great. You can go as far with it as you please. When shooting 3-D and competively I shoot in the Bowhunters class so I put a limit to the gagets I use. While hunting I use the P&Y guide lines for limitations on equipment. Like you said this is a great sport and your equip. choose is personal. JERRY

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Thanks to all that have replied so far. The compound bow I can understand, since I actually like to shoot both. Archery seems to parallel another of my obsessions, guitar. Some guys want all the latest technology, while others just go straight thru the amp with maybe 1 or 2 pedals. I think it's great that there's such a variety available for people interested in archery or music. I guess part of me is just curious as to what others were shooting. Having grown up in Mich, I was really lucky to meet and talk to the great Fred Bear and he helped me fine tune my shooting. Certain things I agree with and see the need for, others just aren't for me, this is were the real beauty of archery comes in. It's all up to the individual.

Thanks for all the replies, good shooting,

Vudoochylde

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[Deleted by Admins]

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

JDoyle,
Yes I do understand progress, as a field service technician for a software development company I see it everyday. Maybe that's why I don't to go with all the bells and whistles when it comes to archery and bowhunting. I feel the same way about my guitar too !! I'm not saying it's wrong, it's just not for me in some aspects of my hobbies. Certain aspects I like and use, others I don't. That's what I like about both archery and guitar, I can go as high or low tech as I want.

I'll bet the kerosene guitar gave you the feeling of being down at the juke joint and made you play better<img src=icon_smile_cool.gif border=0 align=middle>.

Have a good one,

Vudoochylde

An Archer likes to see how far he can shoot his arrow. A Bowhunter likes to see how close he can get before he has to shoot his.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
OH BOY&gt;&gt;&gt; Well alot of things have changed... I started shooting a bow in 1970... is that old school ??? I dont know. I started with a recurve no sights fingers... and now I shoot one of the fastest and most advanced bows on the market with all the very best toys.
IN 1980 I got a compound bow and was able to break ballons at 15 yards and thought that was great... Well then I went to shoot in Ohio about 40 mins. from my house, called the Ravenna arsanal shoot. You had to shoot 100 points to get into a drawing so you might be drawn to hunt there. This is where the famed Hole in the horn buck came from..Well I made that 100 points but I'll tell you I seen some equipment there.. Those people were shooting around 900-1000 points.. Something I was doing was not as good as they were..I went to a local pro shop bought a better bow,got alot of pratice in and the next year I shot around 600.. Still fingers but I had sights now.. I was alot better.
I am not saying that alot of equipment will make you a better shot.
I am going to suggest that you go to a pro shop, that has indoor or outdoor leagues. Watch some of the better shooters. Look at the equipment they are using. ask them questions why they use that stuff.
In those leagues you will find all sorts of shooting forms--fingers--release--recurve--compound--and so on..
You need to ask yourself ..... how good do I want to be..
If your answer is the BEST I can be. Then the modern archer needs STUFF
I hope this helps
By the way at that Ravenna shoot, if you were in the top five archers you were automaticly able to hunt.. It took a couple of years but I was one of those top five.. and now over 20 years later I still shoot alot of STUFF and love every min.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>


FLETCHER, I used to shoot in the Ravenna shoot. I think my first time was in 1978 or 79... Holy crap am I that old?...LOL...
I was shooting a Bear Black Bear II with a stick on Bear rest, fingers and no sights and Easton Gamegetter arrows...

Ahh, the fond memories... I would always get my 100 pts. to qualify but barely...LOL...

I got drawn to the hunt once but I didn't go because I was told the club memebers used the people that got drawn as dogs to push the deer to them...

Let's see how does my equipment compare now...I still shoot Easton arrows...A bit more expensive that GG shafts since I'm shooting A/C/C's and soon to start shooting A/C/C Hyperspeeds... Other than that my equipment is not at all the same as it was then...<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

V
Like you said the choice is what makes this sport great. Like alot of people, I had a slow movement to the modern decked out bow. I started shooting with a bear kodiak and a glove, later moved to a compound, flipper rest, no peep and no sights. next bow was a faster compound, same setup. Fianlly got talked into a release, sights, and a peep. 29 yrs after I shot my first bow, Im all decked out, 2002 bow 295fps ect.. But Im glad I started where I did.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

first off fletcher and bow tech...where are you in ohio? im also around 40 mins from ravenna arsanal. so we have to be in eachothers neck of the woods.
now i started shooting in the late 60's w/a recurve like the rest of the &quot;old school'ers&quot;. i think the best way that i can explain my transformation to modern day equipment is simply that i changed w/the times. i use to shoot alot of field and hunter spot rounds and as the times changed, the equipment got more advanced and the more everyone seemed to change w/it. the competition dropped way off in the bare-bow class, so in order to run up against any competition i pretty much had to go where the people were at. i will say this that the first compound bow that i owned my dad and i made it from scratch....so i didn't have all the bells and whistles on it. but eventually i came of age and broke down and bought a manufactured bow and decked it out. wow big difference! so i would say that circumstances have caused me to keep up w/tech and the times. i liken it to getting power everything on a vehicle verses manual everything....what would we do w/o our power steering or better yet what would we do w/o indoor plumbing...LOL



Edited by - nodose on 12/30/2002 21:59:25

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Pat,

Are you talking about Ravenna Ohio ?
Isn't that the area where the &quot;Hole in the Horn&quot; buck was found dead ?
Greatest Whitetail that ever lived!


Sag.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

<font size=6>Yep<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle></font id=size6>

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

nodose, I live in Clyde. How bout you?

Sag., As nodose says YEP! It's the same Ravenna.

There's another really huge buck found not too far from Ravenna in Youngstown OH. It's called the Barnacle Buck. I met the fellow that found this deer and my buddy had him come to his shops open house this past Aug. to display the mount.

I'd say there must be something in the water in that area...LOL...

Here's a link to the story http://www.thewaitegroup.com/dads/ba...k/sidebar.html

and here's a pic of it...

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Hey Vudoo, Welcome back to the club!

I'm am not at all old school. Just finished my second hunting season with a bow...but here's my take.

I would love to shoot a recurve or longbow well enough to take game. I find the &quot;back to basics&quot; attitude very appealing. However my love for venison far outweighs that appeal!
For me the gizmos and gadgets make it quicker for me to learn to put the arrow in the dot. I could do the same thing with a traditional rig(with less KE of course<img src=icon_smile_tongue.gif border=0 align=middle>) but would need 3 times the time to practice...and I want Jerky NOW!

I'll get to the point where I hunt only with a traditional rig someday, but right now I've got the bell and whistles and even break out the cannon sometimes.

For me it's about a quicker return on my investment!<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

Trushot }}------>

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

bow tech i live in vermilion. went to college at heidelberg in tiffin so im very familiar w/your neck of the woods.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Trushot Archer,
While I agree with you on the taste of venison, I've always felt the biggest part of hunting was my interaction with nature. Now don't get me wrong, I not a tree-huggin anti, I just enjoy the whole experience. Some people believe that hunting is all about killing, and that's not where I'm coming from. Consistency (sp?) is the name of the game and I think if I were to not be consistant in my arrow placement, I would be looking for assistance in that department. I've always felt if I couldn't put my arrow in the heart/lung area where it needed to be, I'd probably hang up my hunting bow but still shoot just for my own enjoyment. While I'll never be an &quot;Olympic&quot; caliber shooter, I've always enjoyed archery and I think I always will.

Hope your New Year is a good one,

Vudoochylde.

An Archer likes to see how far he can shoot his arrow. A Bowhunter likes to see how close he can get before he has to shoot his.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Vudoo,
I'm certainly in agreeance with the whole experience and I assure you I'm a better hunter than I am a killer. I also agree with your statement on consistency, however...

A late model bow with the bells and whistles versus a 6 foot long bow with a flipper and wooden arrows...what will take me longer to learn how to use???

Now I love to shoot in the backyard, at the range, at the club,etc...but I'd rather HUNT.

Now after I get a few years under my belt, and have a better understanding of Hunting, bows and whitetails...I'm getting a recurve. As of now, I have strict limitations on myself when in the field beacause I'm <u>NOT</u>that good yet and I HAVE all the bells, whistles and &quot;crutches&quot; on my bow. 20 yards is my max. That may grow to 30 next year, depending on how I shoot.

As for consistency, I'm not nearly as consistent as I want to be...that's why I'm here...Looking for help and learning more every day!




Trushot }}------>

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

I've been dragging a bow around since I first found an old longbow in the corner of the barn when I was 8 or 9. (around 1963 or 64) My Dad got a new string and finger tab for me, and I've been hooked ever since. Shot my first doe out behind the farm at 13 with a Bear recurve and fingers. I've shot both fingers and release over the years in both hunting and competitive formats, and can say that once you put sights on a bow and use a release, (and get properly fitted) I don't know as you will be going back to instinctive shooting, simply because you will become much more accurate, and it is truly nice to be able to have the extra confidence and consistency. Sure, I love recurves with cedar shafts, and I can shoot fingers just as well as the next guy, but it is some satisfying to be able to aim at a little 11 or 12 ring on a McKensie Turkey at 45yds, and KNOW you have the equipment (and skills to use it) that can place an arrow dead center in the middle exactly where that pin is sitting on a consistent basis. Unfortunately, while some may become very proficient with fingers and barebow, you simply are not going to get that kind of accuracy. Scores in major Tournaments by the best Archers to be found anywhere readily dictates that fact.

If you've never tried shooting with peep, release, and sight, I would highly recommend it, if for nothing other than the enjoyment of trying something new!<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle> I recommend to anyone that has never shot a recurve or longbow with fingers to do likewise, for if they don't they can never know how &quot;it all began&quot; and gain the total experience of the entire sport. Good shooting, Pinwheel 12

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Ok Botech_Shooter...
I shot CXL 250's last year, HOYT CYBERTEC IN THE FLAG COLOR,SURLOC SIGHT,SUPER D SCOPE/W .019 FIBER OPTIC,GOOD OLD SCOTTS RELEASE (I have had the same one for 13 years),30&quot; SUPERSTICK, NAP 3000 REST, SUPER PEEP, SAUNDERS SMALL KISSER, and last but not least a CR WRIST SLING&gt;&gt; I think I covered that bow with everything..I shoot in SPM class so I need all the help I can get..lol Heck I would shoot that stuff anyhow because I love it..That CYBERTEC shot a 318 gr. arrow at 299 fps at 60# and at 62#(a little to close to the max for me)306 fps. That bow hits where you hold,with no exceptions!! I have 2 new bows coming.. A 2003 ULTRATEC with spiral cams in the FLAME, and a SUPERTEC for hunting.. Hey nodose I live in Chardon,OH.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Yes, very much old school. So old school that I mostly post in the traditional forum now instead of here. I've tried all the latest, greatest stuff over the past few years, but found absolutely no enjoyment in it. Still got a couple of compounds, round wheelers wearing nothing but flipper rests and stabilizers, but they haven't been shot in months. I've mostly gone back to my roots with traditional gear.

I'm in the process of making my first laminated longbow and have hacked out a half dozen or so functional selfbows. Fine woods, leather and feathers instead of metals, plastics and carbon composites. Like the difference between a snifter of old brandy vs a bottle of lite beer, archery is something to be savored rather than chugged.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

ArthurP, I would really like to do something like that one of these days. I guess after seeing some of the posts here I'm more of a &quot;mutt&quot; shooter combining a little of everything when it comes to archery. I like my compound but I don't get carried away with all the technology, I like my recurves but I use aluminum shafts for my arrows.

So now I hope you guys are happy, because I'm absolutely confused<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>. I had thought I was an &quot;Old School&quot; shooter and now some of you guys come along and say how you're making your bows, arrows and accessories.

Have fun,

Vudoochylde

An Archer likes to see how far he can shoot his arrow. A Bowhunter likes to see how close he can get before he has to shoot his.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

vudoochylde I took a 20 year step forward in bows less than a month ago. I had an 20+ year old Bear Black Bear, the only extra it had was front pin sights that came with it. I bought a Browning Ambush which I beleive is made by PSE. My local archery shop tuned her up for me and at 20 yards within 4 shots I cut a bull. It has fiberoptic sights, a peep, a stabilizer and some other fancy things!

The difference between the two bows is like night and day, it shoots way faster and is far more accurate. If you take a step forward you will be shocked at how much easier the new bows with the whistles are.

The Tazman aka Martin Price
Founder and President of
Virginia Disabled Outdoorsmen Club

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Tazman,
I have been looking at the new bows only because I'm curious as to whats out there and like the Renegade Nontypical XL, and some of the Darton bows, but I haven't gotten the chance to shoot any of them. Maybe after I shoot some I can make a choice.

Vudoochylde

An Archer likes to see how far he can shoot his arrow. A Bowhunter likes to see how close he can get before he has to shoot his.

RE: Any "Old School" shooters here???
 

Hello,

I started bow hunting around 1967 with a fiberglass recurve called a Locksely.Then in 1971 I bought a Howatt Hunter which I really loved.I didn't get a deer until the following year 1972.This of course was all bare bow or instinctive shooting as they say.Then I got talked in to putting a sight on it.In 1979 I bought my first compound,a Martin Warthog.Then in 1985 I bought a Proline Typhoon XT with the speed cams.Now I'm real high tech in 1997 I got a Mathew's Conquest Pro with all the goodies.As of now I'm in no rush to buy another for quite awhile.