Cougar Mag

I have yet to shoot a batch of all carbon arrows where at least 1/2 of the dozen didn't lose their original qualities. With ACC's or A/C Superslims I have to do some heavy duty abuse to bend or break one.

Shootem up870

i would have to disagree with you...... although ACCs can and do bend, this takes a lot of abuse. my experience is that maxima are a tough arrow, probably tougher than an ACC, but we are constantly getting them from the factory with an enormous amount of wobble.

all around i believe ACC is the best arrow for holding tight tolerances after repeated shots, but the maxima do seem to take abuse better, the only problem with them is finding a dozen thatis straight

Dirt2

Thanks for all the replies. I continue to be very frustrated with arrow manufacture. I'm to the point that if I had known the frustration I was headed for, I might not have started with archery in the first place.

In my short archery career - 8 years - I have owned ICS Beman carbons and Easton ACCs. I shot NAP Thunderheads, then Muzzy 3-blades, then G5 B-52s. My latest batch, the "bent" arrow batch is Easton ACCs and G5 Montecs. I will have a dozen arrows made up at a bowshop, then match up the "best" half-dozen with broadheads and have the bowshop "tune" them. Then I go out and shoot them for a few weeks, keeping records on how each arrow shoots (I have them numbered).

I've never seen a batch of 6 broadhead/arrow combos where more than 3 of 6 flew to the same spot. Typically, the other three will fly to a unique spot 2-4 inches out of the group. I can usually get another arrow or two that flies in the group by randomly mixingbroadheads and arrows untilI find a combo that flies without tuning.

I assure you my bow is well-tuned. Questions:

1) Is this more likely a manufacturing problem or an arrow-building problem?

2) If I built a 900 grain arrow that flew at 100 feet per second, would that take care of the problem? I keep creeping up in weight, I've gone from 420 to 440 to 470 to 495 (currently). I am seriously considering going to a rhino-hunting shaft and going for 600 grains to try to iron out the problem. P.S. I don't care about speed.

bowtech die hard

yes sir

IL-Cornfed

I shot ACC's for many years and I loved 'em but it was never any big deal to bend one. You shoot an alum core arrow, you should expect it.

Dirt2

I just went out and shot my "bent" ACCs alongside my beautiful, straight, tuned-by-the-bowshop arrows. I have three of each. Once the bowshop told me they had tuned the three straight ones, but not the "bent" ones, I realized I had a real opportunity, so I took the arrows home for a little test.

I'm not done yet, and I'll keep you posted of my final results. Probably I'll start a new thread. All I've done so far is shoot each arrow three times at 15 yards, just to make sure none of them fly too crazy to keep on the block target. Of the six, five fly in consistent groups with one flying all over the place. Anybody want to guess whether it's a "tuned" arrow or a "crooked" one? Yup, it's one of the "tuned" ones. So far, I can say that the crooked arrows seem to fly as true if not truer than the tuned ones do! At the end of my session, I shot the three crooked arrows into a sub-one-inch group at 15 yards. No way were the tuned arrows going to do that, since one won't fly consistently and another flies decidedly low (2 inches below all the others).

I had heard the opinion that broadhead tuning was a waste of time, and I'm beginning to wonder.

Paul L Mohr

Just spin the arrows with a broad head on them. If they are not straight you will see it. Look at the arrow itself, the head/insert and the nock. All of these should spin true with no wobble to them.

ACC's are hand picked arrows, which is why they cost so much. You are not so much paying for production differences but for quality control. Same way with many high end carbon arrows. The expensive ones are hand picked and matched. Although the production of ACC's does vary from the norm since it is a hybrid arrow. I highly doubt they came to you bent, if they did have the shop give you new arrows or refund the money. It is more likely they got bent while shooting them or in the shop before you recieved them.

As far as problems with arrows, I shoot cheaper aluminums, even Jazz youth arrows sometimes. Never had a problem yet, they are as straight as... well, an arrow. I have never shot ACC's because I just can't see spending that much money when what I have works great. I know others that do though.

Also keep in mind it's relatively hard for someone else to tune your bow for you. The whole point behind tuning is to adjust the bow to be as forgiving as it can be when YOU shoot it. That is kind of hard for someone else to do. They can set everything square for you so you know you are starting out in the right direction, but if you don't have perfect from, grip and execution some tweaking may be required.

Don't just assume that because some dude at your local pro shop shoots a few arrows through some paper at 5 yards (or closer) and it shoots a bullet hole that you have a precision tuned hunting machine. That's a nice starting point, but hardly the end. Especially when you are talking about using fixed blade heads.

I have several opinions on tuning in general and broad tuning that I don't have time to go into now. But in the end they are merely my opinions and nothing more. I will say that the first step to tuning a hunting arrow is spinning the arrow to make sure everything is straight. If you don't have an arrow spinner, get one or make one. They don't need to be expensive or fancy. A board and a few nails will work in a pinch. Something with bearings is really nice though. Heck I have even cut some V notches in a cardboard box before and used that.

Paul

Paul L Mohr

I can almost assure you your bow is NOT as tuned as you think it is. A properly tuned bow with well matched arrows should be shaving the fletchings off the other arrows with broad heads. They may not impact in the same spot as the field tipped arrows, but they should group in the same spot shot after shot. Especially with ACC's and quality broad heads. Providing the arrows, heads and nocks are true.

What you are seeing is usually caused by weak spined arrows, fletching contact, poor form or a missaligned rest and nocking point. Again, this is providing your arrows are straight and true.

Oh, not enough fletching can wreak havoc on arrow flight and broad heads as well. Adequate fletching and FOC are a huge help in fixed head flight.

Paul

Cougar Mag

It certainly is not a waste of time! I don't care how well a bow is tuned using field points, sometimes changes must be made to have your broadheads fly as well. Usually small changes, sometimes none at all.

Dirt2

Thanks for the replies, both you and Cougar Mag. Let me repeat, thanks for the replies! I value other people's opinions on this topic, feel free to let'em rip. I am trying to learn this stuff, and don't know any other way to draw people out than to put my own feeble opinions out there and provoke replies. I'm not trying to be a know-it-all or make other people listen to me, 'cause I really don't know smack about archery. This website is filled with really knowledgeable folks, and that's really the value of the site, is trying to get people who know 1,000 times what I do to open up and spill some of what they know.

By the by, I do the actual shooting through the paper tuner at the bowshop, with the bowshop people looking over my shoulder and interpreting results. They resist shooting broadheads, so we only use field points.

It may well be that I have some form inconsistencies, as I'm entirely self-taught.