Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

Been through the Easton tuning guide several times over, had new string put on, moved nock pnt. every wich way. They just will not cooperate.[&o]
I'm getting very tight groupswith bothbut the Bhs are 4" high.
I'm giving up.[>:]I guess I will just have to move the sight upbefore hunting.
Anyone else have the same problem ? ,Or any advice.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

Where in NY do you live? If your close to me I bet I can help you get this done. I know a lot of people have different opinions on broadhead flight on this site....I personally tune my bow so they hit together though.

What is the spine rating on the shafts your using, is your setup exactly as described in your signature? Assuming everything is spined correctly, and centershot is true....moving your nocking pointup 1/16" at a time should slowly bring that group together.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

RJ, I'm near poughkeepsie. I'm shooting the x weave 300's. Was shooting the 200's, switched arrowsto get good bareshaft results.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

Well if your willing to come up to Albany sometime....Ihave access to a beautiful range and can probably get you sorted out and fixed up pretty quick. I plan to shoot Tuesday and Wednesday this week.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

I have different feelings about this. If your arrows are flying right and you have no other problems why not just move the pins when hunting season comes. You keep messing with your stuff and you may find you have more problems to deal with. I say if it ain't broke don't fix it. Thats just my 2 cents. but I.m just an oold deer hunter what do I know?

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

Where is it written thatall broadheadsshould group exactly with field points? This doesn't make sense to me. You are totally changing the aerodynamic characteristics of your arrow. Of course they are going to be a little different. I've seen testing where a perfectly tuned bow shot out of a machinecan put one broadhead into the field tip hole. Switch broadheads on the same bow / same arrow and you miss by 5 inches. Does this mean the bow is out of tune? No. It just means that broadheadsfly different! Different from each other and different fromfield points. As long as your broadheads shoot tight groups I'd be happy

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

I agree with you qzq38b,

IMOit's better to tune using the bow and arrow combofor what the bow is intended to be used for. If it's hunting, tune with broadheads. Don't worry about the POI of a different arrow/point combination.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

I've gone to the extreme of having two seperate sights. I tune and sight in for broadheads with one and then change sights when I want to practice with field points.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

Myself, I have have seen the opposite as alot on here. I have bareshaft, paper, and fine tuned bows, and found the broadhead tuning is the best for both tight groups and actually in tune. Thats if you stick to good simple broadheads like muzzy 100 and thrunderhead 100's. You start getting fancy, things change.

My last bow I got, the dealer said it was tuned up, and I shot it thru paper and it was bascially bullet holes, bareshafted and they hit pretty well same place. But didn't group well at all for what I am used too. As soon as I put my BH's on, picked out the straightest arrows, and matched the broadheads and arrows for simular spine and spin test, I gotgroups 4" low. As soon as I raised that knock up, my groups got smaller instantly with both tips and BH's.

I have seen it so many times where pro shops swear the paper and bareshaft is the only way to go. But I prove wrong. I have a feeling I know why, its easy for them to do and they don't have to have alot of space for it and not near as time consuming as BH tuning, dont' tear up targets near as much.

Sure different broadhead might hit differently, but I bet 90% of the time its cause some plane more than others or have more bearing surface to plane and this shows form problems, if the BH are straight and the blades are, best bet is BH tuning.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

I used to feel the same because I thought that unless they did there was something wrong even though the 2 arrows were there staring me right in the face. They are not the same so I don't make them be the same. To do so is IMO a comprimise. As long as they hang out, BH's with BH"s and FP"s with FP"s I have no problems. I'm with the others on this.

There is a guy right in your area that would jump at the chance to help out, (he does like them to be together) goes by the name of Bowtec and can be found here. He thrives on helping out.

http://btreviews.proboards57.com/index.cgi#general

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

hey i had problems with bh and i changed to a heicule from strait fleching and it solved my problem!!!!!!!!!!

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

Could you tune the bow to shoot BH's and FP's closer together before you had the new string put on? Perhaps the cam is not in the right position now. You stated that the broadheads are 4" high. Is that at 20 yards, or how far? If I was planning on hunting any time real soon, I would probably just sight in for the broadheads and leave it at that. That said, your signature lists 2 broadheads that are known to be great flying heads which have the reputation of shooting right with field points, so 4" seems like a lot. Are you using a string loop, or shooting directly off the string? I ask because in '04, I was shooting a Darton Tundra off the string with a drop away rest. I was also getting broadheads flying a little high. Slick Tricks were closest to field pts impact, then Muzzys, finally Phantoms were hitting highest, about 2" at 20, 3" at 30, etc. with Slick Tricks maybe half that much off. I could not cure this with nock point or rest height, but did cure it by advancing the top cam by 1.5 twists of the control cable. Bingo, all 3 heads now shot the same, and also the same as field pts. out to 40 yards, and grouped well enough that I lost a $10 ACC arrow that I sliced with a broadhead by being too lazy to walk the 40 yards to shoot one at a time. In '05, I used a D loop, and did not have to advance the cam to get the same end result. I'm not sure about the cam on the Stingray, but the last 3 single cams I've tried to tune broadheads with were tough to get the way I wanted. All 3 seemed to pull the nock end of the arrow down into the rest, which would cause the high broadhead impact you are describing. I got high broadhead impact with drop aways, and low impact with a Whisker Biscuit with these bows. I got rid of the problem by going to a shoot through rest, which seemed to tune better than either the drop away, or the Biscuit with these single cam bows, none of which were a level nock travel single cam. If you are pleased with the flight and accuracy, you may want to leave well enough alone, but I do think 4" difference is a lot with those low profile broadheads.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

Thanks for all the reply's! I was a bit frustrated when I posted this thread, I am going to try some tinkering again next day or 2. See what happens.Thanks again for all the suggestions and advice.
NYH

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

The answerer is a easy one.
If there is so much controversy whether to make both impact the same point by tuning,or simply adjusting your sights.
End it all and purchase mechanicals,they are a lot better made then those of yester year.
take the hypershocks for instance,one look and it got to make you think.
Plus you can forget about that noise coming from your arrows as if you just launched your wifes duster

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

Two of my shooting buddies had the same problem and tried everything they knew of and nothing helped. I took one of my Slick Tricks and put it on his arrow and that fixed the problem. Dont ask me why but the Slick Trick was the only B/Head that would group with the field points.
The problem is somewhere in the tuning. My Hoyt Protec shoots same hole groups.
Im not in the business of selling broadheads Im just offering a suggestion. Hope you get it fixed.

GGBH

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

EXACTLY!!!! Sometimes it ain't the bow - it's the broadhead. Even out of a perfectly tuned bow from a shooting machine, different broadheads will impact different spots on the target. Look at this test from a shooting machine with a well tuned bow. Notice how the point of impact varies just by switching broadheads. This is also true for mechanicals but to a lesser degree....
http://www.mucc.org/BroadheadTest.htm

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

I have always had them impact the same. I bareshaft first then switch to broadheads. I add weight to the arrow and keep a high foc until the bow shoots around 250 fps. That seems to be the magical number to get all heads to fly good. The difference betwen a 400 grain arrow flying at 280 fps and an arrow that is 505 grains flying at 250 fps is only 3/4's of an inch difference shooting a 30 yard target for 25 yards. If stand hunting orbear hunting over bait, I know the yardages. If I am setting up on a bull, I range the trees rocks etc, before I start my calling sequence. Watch out using mechanicals, some states it may not be legal. It may take a little work, but I beleive that all bows can obtain the same point of impact with broadheads and field points. I have taken more animals than I can count with the bow, and only one has been over 20 yards. For me I see no neeed for a bunch of speed. If you can see where I am going with this you will see that with speed comes a greater chance of planing, and tune and form becomes more critical. I know some of you can get a tune and shoot with good form and have no problem getting good flight with fixed heads and high speed. But over the grand scale, most archers would be better off shooting slower setups that are more forgiving instead of trying to be the guy who shoots lightning fast withpinpoint accuracy.Usually, from what I have seen in the average archer, with increase in speed, comes an increase of problems.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

http://www.broadheadtests.com/TUNING.html
Read through my link as well. It could/can be a lot of things.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

Not a well tuned bow , They are WAY underspined . Bad example . Groups like this should not provide "advise"

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

I would have to agree with iJimmy that the arrow used for those tests should have been a 340, not a 400. Still, you could see that the low profile heads (Nitron, Turbo, and Sonic) did better with an underspined arrow situation. That's why when NY said his broadheads were 4" off, it seems like too much for those particular heads. IME, the Slick Tricks will shoot very close to field points even when the bow is not tuned really right. NY Harvester, I would say try 5-shot's link. He has really put his time into broadhead testing, spent loads of money on heads to test, and shares that info with us.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

I took a brief look at the test, and I would just add that arrow charts do not necessarily provide the exact correct arrow for the situation. What I'm saying is that an arrow chart should get you close, but not necessarily right on. For example, the proper spined (after personally tuning) arrow for my Darton is a 2216, however, if you look at a chart, this would be a very weak arrow for the setup. Now I believe this is due to the level nock travel, and the fact that I am shooting it at the exact centershot of the bow. But the chart will not even show a 2216 as an arrow to use. Longbow and recurve charts are not even close, I use a chart from a traditional website for that, and even then I have to experiment.

I can't say for sure whether the arrow they used was right or wrong, but I wouldn't use a chart for the "end all" descision on what size to use.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

My broadheads were shoting high and to the right. I then read several places that mechanical broadheads fly more like target tips, so I tried them out. Sure enough...one shot and dead accurate! From what I understand, the razor blades act like "wings" and can have an effect on arrow flight. Mechanicals help imporove this problem because of the compactness. There are, however a few dis-advantages as well to the mechanicals. Might have been a coincidence, but worked for me. Just my two cents worth.

RE: Cannot get BHs & FPs to hit the same
 

I shoot a single cam bow with fingersset at 68# with a 30" draw. My arrows are Easton Epic 300's cut at 30.5" with 4" Bohning Vaneson a2 degrees straight offset and 125 grn tips. I have been shooting for 40 of my 50 years and have never paper tuned or shot a bare shaft out of any of my bows, just adjusted until the "wiggle" was out of my arrow. I have Thunder Head 125's that up until now have only been on myarrows to walk in the woods, never shot. A couple of months ago I decided I would see how my broadheads grouped with my field tips. I first shot six field tips into my normal 2" group then shot six broad heads. Needless to say I had to refletch a bunch of arrows because they hit the same spot. I am not saying that I am that good, just lucky to have picked a broadhead that works with "my setup". So, maybe instead of going back and forth trying to get your setup to work with your broad heads, you should try getting a broadhead that works with your setup. I know, there are tons of options out there, but witha little research on web sites such as this, you could narrow that down quite a bit. You should also make sure that with that 75, 85 or 100 grn tip your F.O.C. is still proper. This has a grreat effect on how the arrow "lets" the broadhead be in charge.