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brace height, riser or ATA

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brace height, riser or ATA

Old 11-30-2005, 11:58 AM
  #1  
Fork Horn
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Default brace height, riser or ATA

What is the MOST important thing to concider for forgiveness brace height, riser height or axle to axle length?
Matthews just lowered the ATA on their switchback but increased the brace height.
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Old 11-30-2005, 12:06 PM
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Default RE: brace height, riser or ATA

I say riser length.jmo
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Old 11-30-2005, 12:28 PM
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Default RE: brace height, riser or ATA

For me ata , I can shoot a short brace , long ata bow fine , but a high brace short ata gives me fits .
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Old 11-30-2005, 01:12 PM
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Default RE: brace height, riser or ATA

For real forgiveness it boils down to a combination of ATA and brace height. No one thing can do it all. But I personally find that ATA is more important. I have two Martin bows with identical cam setups. Mt SlayR is 37 3/4" long (long riser) with a 6 1/2" brace height. My ShadowCat SE is 32" with a 9 3/8" brace height. The SlayR is the more accurate of the two by far all things being equal.
All this being said I just ordered a new P3 Elite at 38" with an expected brace height of about 7 1/2" to 8". This should give me the best of both statistics and be more forgiving than either of the others. This will end up being a target/3D bow, giving up a little speed for more accuracy.
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Old 11-30-2005, 05:44 PM
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Default RE: brace height, riser or ATA

Brace height isone ofthe last things I'd consider when evaluating a bow. Of course, if I had bad form, it might be higher on my list.

One thing that is extremely important, but which is hardly ever considered (except by Hoyt), is deflex/reflex geometry.
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Old 11-30-2005, 09:27 PM
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Default RE: brace height, riser or ATA




This is how it seems to work. Riser length is great for lateral stability. Brace height adds up to forgiveness of form. Axle to axle is a matter of fit. Find the right combination for you and you've found your perfect bow.


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Old 12-01-2005, 07:00 AM
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Default RE: brace height, riser or ATA

Riser length can also be a hindrance on some designs. Because of the increase in 'mass' above the grip, smaller torque problems can be amplified.

To partially correct this problem, heavier stabilizers and the unique use of offset brackets may be warranted. With higher reflex and increased riser length, stabilizers used behind the riser, rather than in the conventional location, is sometimes required to get effective balance in the 'X' and 'Y' dimensions.
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Old 12-01-2005, 09:23 AM
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Default RE: brace height, riser or ATA

Brace height is one of my primary considerations. I often hunt in very low temps, with heavy clothing on. Shots are often at odd angles, where perfect form is impossible. This is the nature of hunting in Northern climates in dense forests. Therefore, string clearance on my jacket is essential. No matter what arm guard you use, a heavy jacket will increase the amount of brace height needed. Add in the occassional odd angle, and you have a huge forgiveness factor with a high brace height.

We're not talking about indoor target shooting, where you can shoot a 5" brace without problems if you want. Forgiveness has a lot more meaning than just bad form. It has a lot to do with hunting conditions and what bow features allow shot opportunities.
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Old 12-01-2005, 09:45 AM
  #9  
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Default RE: brace height, riser or ATA

My thoughts on brace height... It's not so much the higher brace height as it is in how that brace height is achieved. If brace height is increased by changing the riser design from reflexed (the deepest part of the grip is behind the limb butts)to straight (deepest part of the grip directly under the limb butts) the straight riser will be more forgiving. If they go beyond straight and into a deflex pattern, with the deepest part of the grip in front of the limb butts, that's the most forgiving riser design.

When your grip is in front of the limb butts so when you pull the string, everything is being pulled in the same line. It's extremely hard to torque a deflex riserbow because your hand has very little mechanical advantage. With the grip behind the limb butts, you're pulling the string in one direction and trying your best to push the limb butts forward in the same line. With the grip in between the string and limb butts, your hand has a lot of mechanical advantage and makes torquing the bow very easy. Your shooting form is much more critical with the reflex riser. The straight riser is a compromise between the two.

Now they are making nearly all reflexed risers but increasing brace heights by making the limbs come off the riser at a flat angle. Increasing brace height by doing that doeshardly anythingto make a bow more forgiving, IMO, except to give you more bow arm clearance.

Decreasing the limb angle also decreases the ATA so, that only leaves riser length. But then, parallel limbs with a long riser also gives you a longer ATA than you'd have with a short riser.

I'm confusing myself.[8D]


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Old 12-01-2005, 06:04 PM
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Default RE: brace height, riser or ATA

When I refer to form, I always talk about 'hunting' form. I don't do any tournament archery and hunt on the coldest of days. Clothing is layered to an extent that most would find uncomfortable and impossible with whichto get good movement.

Still, good hunting form must still be practiced and the need for higher brace height is more a result of incorrect draw length or bad form. This is a general statement and there are, of course, exceptions.

A few years ago,on a 15 degree morning, with a maximum amount of clothing, and with a veryawkward shooting position (try leaning out a treestand, shooting a left-handed bow right-handed, with a 40 yard shot), I only use a 6 1/2" brace height bow. I can recount many such situations, but that one was rather unique. Davidmil, a friend and I were hunting on the last day and my friend said that he needed venison. I obliged.
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