Mustad I thought Labs dont point????:action-smiley-099:
Awesome pics and posts guys!! Pike

not quite as impressive of a pose, black dog had to wait for the white dog to come down. He had been holding (without whoa) for a couple minutes. I did softly whoa him as she got close so that they wouldn't "compete" for the bird. But she locked up on her own and then they both held for the pic....





So mustad which are you?

GSP is good one for reasons you said.they do shed less than toby my lab.they point naturally but dont flush.i was out with one in snow/high winds 3 yrs ago and he was cold. toby was not.
i never tested GSP on bear/bobcat/coyote/fox but i did on toby the lab and he handled all very good .last GSP we had ran for truck at site of coyote,toby puffed up,curled his tail ,hair up and like robot slowly stomped towards the coyote with me next to him.
i would of liked to be able to test a GSP more but i dont have one to do it and not many have GSP ,most have labs/springers/setters/brittanys for hunting.

but i like what i see with GSP .only thing i see in lab that is concern is you have to condition one as DOC E said.their bone make up and heavy coat is a big problem when temps are not cool.you have to start early on it.

but heat is brutal on lab.GSP will go for longtime,way past most labs.i even thought about shaving hair off toby for grouse season but i dont think it would look very nice for people to see that .so i hunt in morning and only for about 1 and 1/2 hrs.

biggest problem with lab is HEAT...........

In the words of Michael Corleone: "Right when I think I'm out... they pull me back in."

Doc, I'd say something stupid, but I think you beat me to it. BDC? Puleeze. I have listened to you ranting about this and that on the pointing lab falacy. We have even had private conversations about it. There are many things I respect about you Doc. I think you are an uncomprimising person when it comes to making sure the health of a dog is proven before any breeding takes place. I think you have a fair amount of knowledge in nutritional aspects of canine care; although I don't buyoff on your supplemental notions. That said, there is no such thing as a pointing lab. You sent me to a pointing lab breeder. I saw some dogs that came from him. Guess what. They didn't point.

Someone said that some labs point. OK, I will concede to that, just as I would concede that some pointing dogs don't. Genetic traits aren't always passed. Even a blind donkey will find the trough once in a well; well exemplified by Doc's ribbon.

I'll bring it back to my initial statement... How many labs have passed a NAVHDA test? Zero. Repeat ZERO.

OK, Doc, before your veins pop out the side of your neck, I know where you are going. NAVHDA won't allow labs. So I ask this. How many have passed a VHDF test? I remember two or three years ago all the pointing lab folks going ape over the notion that the VHDF would allow labs and how this would be the venue that the lab would finally be able to be acknowledged as the pointing dog it is. Guess what? it hasn't happened. Why? Because labs don't point.

I have spent a fair amount of time speaking with a leader in the pointing lab falacy... One of the pioneers and based on it, have come to a clear conclusion that the lab that points is the exception, not the norm; and there are very few of them.

This conversation is so boring to me, I really wish you all would just get over yourselves. Please just accept your fantastic dogs for what they are; go out; and hunt.

i was talking to greg at BORN2HUNT breeder here in coudersport,pa.he sells top labs but no pointing ones.
he went and got puppies from top pointing lab breeder,had all kinds of ribbons etc and did point.both sire/dam pointed.

none of puppies he got POINTED, not one.
he said he was very mad as he paid some big money for those puppies.i mean big money as he was going to start breeding POINTING LABS....
yet a lot do point.i may get to see one point this year by a gentleman named PACO.

Paco's, Gator and his son Smokey.

Gator, high on both ends

Smokey, like father like son

Who cares???
Best breed for a family dog= Lab
Best breed for waterfowl hunting=Lab
Best breed for antler hunting = Lab
Best breed for dock diving = Lab
Best breed for all around sporting dog = Lab

For myself I still have to say the Irish Setter.. But as for all the hunt test you can throw up it still boils down to what you want in a hunting dog that really matters. We all have our differences with this respect. Mine is a watch dog as well as a family dog and hunter. He does very well at each. My female is a great hunter as well and locates all the birds I need to find. Both enjoy a good swim in the water as well. My male retrieves the best and that is from land or water.. Enough said from me on this subject..

setters by far have better nose than lab.they will find more birds than lab.they handle heat better.
lab swims better,their hair is shorter and smaller in size than irish setter.

both dogs have great brains,they retrieve,good with kids mostly.

i said it before, lab is best for ducks/pheasants that run and setters are best for grouse.
pointing lab is something i am looking at closely.i would like to see one and may this fall.his owner is PACO and dog is GATOR.....

boy, gator he looks like toby, bent tail and all:lolabove: