Nomercy448

Just a curious question, why 18" max for AR's? I've heard a lot of guys say this in the past, but I've never really understood it myself, so I figure I have to be missing something.

I like to run 22" or 24" for all of my .223's. Of course, I have a few longer, and a few shorter, but in general, 22-24" is where I'm seeing the best muzzle velocities. Cutting back to 18" is giving up a LOT of range for an AR-15. No, it's not fun to run and gun with a 24" heavy barrel in 3gun matches, but for predator hunting at 600yrds, it's nice having a bit extra punch (I run the same load in 2 of my "coyote rig" AR-15's. One is a 16" lightweight carbine, the other, a 24" heavy barrel (0.920"). I'm pushing hot loaded 50grn pills up over 3400fps. My 16" barrel is lagging down around 3000-3050fps. It may not seem like much, but it's about a 20% difference in energy, and about 40" more drop at 600yrds.

I'd assume you're talking 18" for the handling and portability, which I'd tend to agree that 24" AR's are just plain heavy and unweildly, but even a DPMS Lo-Pro has a heck of a lot of weight to it, and it's only 16" (heavy barrel carbine). A "half heavy" 0.750" block 24" barreled AR doesn't weight THAT much more than a full heavy 16" or 18" 0.920" blocked barrel.

I WILL admit that when we're rolling the coyote wagon out across pastures, it's a lot easier to get a 16" barrel out the window faster than a 24" barrel (legal in KS as long as you're not in a roadway), but I don't usually make my gun purchases based around THAT type of hunting.

Sheridan

Nomercy,

"I'd assume you're talking 18" for the handling and portability....."

100%



No doubt a 24"-26" barrel will get you the max MV; but I have plenty of guns to that with when I am making stands.


Hung on a one point sling, the AR platform is far quicker to use as a walking stick (if designed well - weight wise).

IMO a 18" barrel gives you the best balance of handling and accuracy out to 300 + yards.

When I think AR, I'm looking to still hunt with it.

It's my spot & stalk rig, because sometimes you need to react quickly (50 feet to 300 yards).


600 yards - I need to be prone using one of my boltguns (22"-24" barrel) with attached bi-pod or over my pack to feel comfortable making THAT shot ......................I guess I'm just not that good yet !

A11en

You can't go wrong with Bushmaster. However, I just went through a very similar decision making process. I've been looking for an AR15 to hunt predators (mostly coyotes), but also plan to thin out the hog population. After a ton or research and conversation with gunsmiths, I went with a Rock River LAR15 - with a 16 inch barrel. I'm consistently shooting tighter groups than my friend who has a Bushy. With the 2 stage trigger, it really does shoot MOA as advertised and I paid less than you're planning to spend.

Nomercy448

One comment I'd make about this.

My brother in law couldn't outshoot me even if I had a sling shot and he had a palma match rifle.

The standard "mil-spec" bushy triggers, like any mil-spec triggers, are heavy, and rough. A $60 JP spring kit and you'd be amazed how well the factory hardware can run. On the other hand, the two stage bushy match trigger is fantastic. Out of the "factory" triggers I've ran, the bushy 2 stage is tops (obviously not a Geis, but it also ain't $200 either).

The RRA's are very nice rifles, and very accurate but I wouldn't say I've ever seen them be consistently more accurate than bushmasters. Honestly, either of them should be shooting better than 1MOA. My 16" bushy lightweight carbine (XM15-E2S) is a 1/2-3/4MOA rifle. The only thing I've done is find the proper COL for my chamber, and swap out the trigger to a Geisselle 2 stage. This was a $750 rifle. I'm not saying that the Bushy is necessarily better than the RRA, other than resale value, but I definitely would not expect better accuracy from an RRA than a bushy. The same accuracy, yes, but better? No.

Nomercy448

Definitely understood. When I'm on the move, I carry a mid-weight barreled 16" carbine (fluted half heavy with a .750" block), when I can sit down somewhere, I run a 24" full weight rifle. Mounting that light weight carbine is easy and fast, and it's easier hauling it single point at low ready than a 15lb rifle.

But in general, I don't like to move very much. I spot and stalk quite a bit, but I usually stand hunt. Even when I spot and stalk, I try to move to a "set up" where I can get stable, get low, and get some support under my rifle.

I'm also a big proponent of Primo's Trigger Stick's. I do very well off of their mono stick, my wife prefers their bipod. No, it's not a precision system, but it's a heck of a lot more accurate than off-handed shooting. I walk with the stick in my left hand, right hand holding my AR low ready on the single point (or sometimes off of my hip, somewhat "holstered"). It mounts very quickly, and the trigger stick lets me adjust anywhere I need to go.

My stick goes with me everywhere when I'm hunting, whether I'm planning to be moving around or not. You never know when you might get an opportunity while you're moving in or out of your set, so having an impromptu support ready at hand is a benefit.

nathanaf8388

I recently purchased the varminter. Great gun very well made and I did tons of research it is a little heavy but that is both an advantage and dissadvantage so that said... I like the fact it doesn't have a front site and mine came with riser for a scope mount which I bought a bushnell scope with illuminated reticle to mount on it... I only wish it had more of a matte finish but the 24 inch barrell is nice if you have any questions feel free to email me at [email protected]

kemster99

This is my varmint set- up. 20" heavy barrel Bushmaster upper, sitting on a lower that i built. With ATN 5x night vision scope.

Nomercy448

I sure wish Kansas would allow night vision (or at least LIGHTS) for coyotes at night. Kansas had a bad run a long time ago with guys keeping a dead coyote in the bed of their truck, then using lights at night to spotlight deer. Rather than have a reasonable yet perceivably inconsistent set of rules, they just blanketed everything down to prevent spotlighting of any kind. Calling coyotes at night is legal, without the use of lights, and hunting furbearers over hounds with rimfire rifles WITH the use of lights is legal, but centerfire rifles or shotguns and lights don't mix.

The rules are so tight in Kansas that if you get pulled over, even by a State Trooper or county Sherriff's officer, and you have a "spotlight" and a centerfire rifle in your truck, you can get charged with spotlighting. EVEN DURING THE DAY. I found this out the hard way about 10yrs ago. During deer season, I hunt deer all day, then run hounds for coon all night. I used to keep my .30-06 (deer) and my Marlin 60 .22lr and a bunch of lights (including two 2million CP lamps) in the back seat of my truck. Got pulled over for speeding on the way home from lunch after church (mid-day) and ended up spending several days and several thousand dollars over the next few weeks in court defending that both are legal equipment for legal game species at that time. They had confiscated my rifles, lights, gear, and impounded my pick-up. I got out of it and got my property back, but the law didn't change, so basically, it was just a warning for ME to remember to never have the two sets of gear in the same truck at the same time.