Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I was just wanting to see who uses a chronograph. What make/model etc. In your opinion is this a necessary piece of equipment for testing your reloads?

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I have a simple Chrony and also a Pact unit. They are absolutely necessary if you reload and even if you use factory ammo. Your only SWAG if you you don't use one.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

Nope, not necessary. Been reloading for 10 years without one, and never have had problems with putting together a safe accurate load. Not saying that I don't wish I had one, as I will get one sometime in the future, but they simply aren't a necessity.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I have a Shooting Chrony Alpha Model. They are a must for someone who reloads. They can tell you how consistent your loads are especially, which I think is the most important issue. If you do not have consistent loads, a chronograph should answer most of the questions regarding group patterns and many other issues.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

No not necessary at all unless you are trying to develop loads with a specific velocity in mind. I take anything I read in a reloading manual with a grain of salt. In our sue crazy society sadly they have also been impacted. You have to remember that most of these manuals come with test barrel info and not loads created in real hunting rifles(with a few exceptions) and the velocity variation between printed and actual will be huge in a lot of cases and rarely matches up to the manual. I have witnessed it with certain cartridges and the differences at long range had I used published trajectory tables for that specific bullet/load would have been tremendous.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I have a Beta Master Chrony and I think it's an important tool for reloaders. Once I develop a good hunting load, I run the figures through a Ballistic Calculator. This then gives me a print out which tells me my bullet drop at various ranges. I have these calculations sealed in platic. When I go hunting I review the bullet drop at various ranges and in conjuction with my laser rangefinder I believe I can increase my chances of a good shot.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I've got the Beta Master Shooting Chrony also. I suppose it's not absolutely necessary, but I wouldn't want to be without it now. Since velocity is a direct result of pressure, I want to know what my loads are doing speed-wise. If I'm getting substantially more velocity than reloading manuals suggest I should, then I probably got an over-pressure situation and I want to know about it.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

While bullet drop tables are better than guessing, the only way to determine the true trajectory for a given load is to shoot it at the distances in question.I use a chronograph because I like to know my velocity even though I did reload successfully without one.I find that a chronographs greatest use is when you change lots of components such as powder.If the velocity suddenly changes dramatically with a new lot of powder it lets you know that you should re-develop that load again.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I gotta agree that published velocities have little bearing on reality.
For me, I rarely take shots longer than 300 yards at the range, and while hunting my ranges are much shorter, so I don't need to use any ballistic tables to try to estimate where a bullet of a certain velocity/BC will land, because I already have the dope on the ranges that I'll be shooting. Experiences and distances with other will certainly vary.

As for determining high pressure, velocity isn't the best way to judge it. Some rifles are going to give higher or lower velocities than others or test barrels. At the top end of the pressure scale, pressure will increase pretty dramatically for small increases in velocity. measuring the fired casehead expansion with a good micrometer is a far better method of detecting high pressure situations.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

It is certainly NOT NECESSARY to use a chronograph! However, if you are like me, you'll want one just to really find out how fast your reloads are going! I bought my first one as soon as they were within my price range. My first one was an ITCC brand, which used wires for starting and stopping the counter. Then I bought a low-end Sky-Screen Oehler, which I still have, plus a Chrony "F" model.

One of the things I learned was that velocities predicted in the reloading handbooks in the '60's were a lot closer to the truth than a lot of what is being printed today! There are a couple of brands of current reloading manuals whose figures are inflated by as much as 200 FPS over what I am getting! This was not so true years back. I could "guesstimate" a probable MV for a load, and find it very close when measured. I think "liability-itis" has infected some of the publishers too much!!

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

What do you think of the F1 chrony ? Is it reliable and accurate?

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I now own a PRO CHRONY, and I feel it is a necessary tool for the serious handloader. I have been using a chrony for over ten years, and I use it every time I shoot at the range. Good luck.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I think it is as necessary as any piece of gear for the reloader just as dies and bras bore brushes. One truely doesn't know the velocity unless you measure it. We fret over .002 in COL or Trim to length. We as a group are looking for the velocity and accuracy, which is driving the Magnum craze.

My brother bought a Chrony F1 at a gun show for 80 dollars. Cheap. It may not be as accurate as a high price model, but you have some idea of trends. If you check the Firarms review forum for a thread "Ruger Accuracy" you will see the accuracy results for my .308 loads. But we Chronoed the loads of 5 shots average for a .308....2860 fps. That was not what excited me, all the shots were within 15 fps of each other!!!! THAT is consistancy. NOW does this mean I have a rifle/load combo to take on the 7MM and 300 Ultramags? No. The main issue is I have a consistant load. And working backwards on a measured range with drop (center averaging) we have varified the chrono reading by equation. Straitghforward math really.

The chrono is a tool, and with todays technology and as cheap as they are ther is no reason for a responsible reloader not to have one.

Had a guy at the range at the same time and he had a "real scorcher" 25-06 load. We put it on the chrono, shot 5 shots. He was more than a little concerned how his 120 g 25-06 was shooting slower than a 165 g .308. It was is the same issues of accuracy, I have tried lots of combos and I am not a velocity nut, I am a consistancy nut. I have a very good match of combinations. He on the other hand has to do a little more work, and that is not a bragging situation, the guy didn't know. The chrono clears up foggy estimate of the velocity, and calls BS on unrealistic claims. I have heard many times there is NO WAY to get more than 2700 fps out of a .308, well, that is not true, but before the chrono I believed it.

LAST POINT. The gun manufacturers KNOW you don't have a Chrono and you probably are not going to get one. SO, you believe everything stated about a brand new cartridge, but there is no verification. Truth of the matter, I M only 200-250 fps slower than most mags. I don't think the trade off of higher recoil, increased cleaning frequency is worth the small amount of increase in velocity (which is not the same as increase in accuracy) is worth it.

As a reloader I have done EVERYTHING wrong. I use RP brass, I use IMR3031, I moly coat my bullets (with spray), BR CCI primers, didn't worry about clean cases (I now have a trumbler though) or tight tollerance of Trim to length.

I have a .308 shooting 165 g GK 2860+/-15 fps, and it shoots a .375 moa at 200 yds. This is through a 26 in barrel, and the last wrong thing a Ruger no less.

CHRONOGRAPHS just give you knowledge on what is happening. When you measure BS walks.

Dana

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I use a CED Millinium when testing loads or working with a wildcat or cartridges that have little published load data or, a powder that is not listed in that data.
Being a paper puncer with a max range of 200 yds. I'm not as concerned with velocities as I am with accuracy and consistency. The 1st thing I look at is the standard deviation.

However, when working with the above mentioned cartridges the velocity readings at least let me know if I'm in the ball park with the load combo I'm using. If readings are irratic or running a little high/low it gives me an idea of where I'm at and what I should look at when I get back to the loading bench. It's better than taking a guess and a chance when working with something that has the potential to cause damage.

Then again, when publishing a test people want to know all the detail possible and that includes velocity, extreme spreads and standard deviations. Besides, who would give up the opportunity to play with new toys:D

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I guess i bought my first chronograph about 1980, and i find them to be very handy to have around!! I wouldn't say it's a "must" though. I guess it depends on how serous you are about knowing what "your rifle" is doing with the ammo you have for it!

Drilling Man

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

Could you maybe explain "standard deviation" ? Is this the average of a group of numbers subtracting the lowest and highest value?

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

When using a chronograph, you shoot a string of shots, (usually 10 rounds), and get an average velocity. The difference between high and low is the extreme spread. The difference between each shot and the average is the deviation for that shot. The standard (or average) deviation is the average of all of the deviations. The smaller the number, the better. I read somewhere, (would have to look it up to find out where) that the extreme spread of a load should be no more than 2% of the average velocity, or vertical stringing could become very noticable at the longer ranges.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I have only used one of them, mine, but have checked it against my Oehler. It is accurate and reliable, and A WHOLE LOT EASIER AND FASTER TO SET UP!! All you need is one camera tripod for it.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

Thanks for the info. I think I will purchase from Midway. They have the F1 for around $75.00

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I second this sentiment! Here is the best buy on the market right now on chronographs, I really like mine...

I wouldn't go to the range anymore without it!

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I have the F1 chrony for both guns and archery. It is very reliable and accuurate!

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I got em a shoot chrony. For average reloaders and shooters that don't shoot far and only want reliable handloads, they will never need one. For people who plan to shoot really out there, they are invaluable. For a shooter that has wildcats, custom throats or plays around with different coating on bullets, they really shine.

I really love mine for archery where speed is very important to me.

They ain't much. Give em a try.

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

I never thought of the archery usage until you mentioned it now....although I remember an article that talked about it for working out the best tuned set-up

RE: Who uses a chronograph ?
 

Just received the sale flyer from Midway. The F1 Chrono is on sale for $69.95:D:D. I just ordered mine.:).

Chrony
 

I have been using a $100 chrony for 10 years. Factory ammo is not close to the FPS. they post. It is also hard to match the velocity the loading manuals publish. I hunt Colorado sometimes out to 400 yards so I need to know the trajectory of my bullet. I know my gun and what it can do thanks to my Chrony. I have not found most of the new powders to be any better then the old ones. Reloader 17 is faster when you load max, but not consistent in my guns.

Holy cow, this thread was brought back from the dead.

A fleshless corpse was resurrected.