Tul ammo
 

With the family and work I can't keep up with reloading for my high volume stuff. 9mm and .223.... I shoot allot of 9mm as it's my duty pistol. And would like to shoot more from the AR as well.. How is Tul Ammo just for practice ammo. I've always heard that it's junk, and even heard that it could damage your gun eventually if you shoot allot of it. I've put a box of 50 through my Glock 17 and it shot well... It's the cheapest stuff online that I can find. SO... am I ok to shoot this stuff through my Glock, or could it potentially cause unnecessary wear/ any other issue. Just looking for cheap bulk ammo.


-Jake

Honestly Jake, it's about the worst stuff you could feed ANY firearm. How the hell they stay in business I have no clue because ANYONE that respects and cares for their firearm won't shoot that crap. I think that American Eagle has 1000 round cases for around $220 or so at various places. ....Found some even cheaper than that but I dunno how much with shipping and such... http://ammunitionstore.com/products/...ound-case.html I've ran a few boxes of that AE through a few of my 9's and was pleased with it's running. And that was through a couple of picky 1911 type pistols with fairly touchy actions. That Glock should be 100% happy shooting it.

What makes it "junk"? Does it have bad bullets, corrosive powder/primers? Are tolerances bad? Never shot or owned any just wandering what makes them dangerous or junk.

It's steel cased for one grinder. The dirtiest ammo I've ever seen. And if memory serves, the bullets are copper washed steel as well. Over all, Tula ammo isn't good for your weapon period.

Thanks! Doesn't sound like anything I would shoot

The steel case isn't so much the problem itself. It kinda compounds the problem. Steel doesn't expand and make a gas seal like brass does, so you tend to get a lot of burnt powder and other garbage that can blow back into the action. Mix that with some really dirty powder, and it can make a real mess of. The deal breaker for me is the bi-metal jacketed bullets. As super_hunt mentioned, its basically just copper washed steel. They are hard on rifling.

The other thing to consider about Tula is that it's literally the bottom of the barrel. Its not related to their handgun ammo, but there was a period when Tula was using super cheap powder in their .223 ammo. The powder created a bizarre pressure curve that, unless you were running it through a relatively over-gassed carbine, it would not cycle an AR.

I've never shot handguns enough to justify buying cheap ammo, but there was a period when I was burning through a lot of Wolf .223 in my AR's. Now that I'm older, wiser, and a lot less trigger happy, I've moved away from the cheap stuff and focused more on accuracy. The last case of Wolf ammo I bought is sitting in the back of a closet, waiting for a zombie apocalypse to start.

Here is an interesting test on steel cased vs brass.
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/bras...el-cased-ammo/

Your Dept doesn't supply you ammo for practice???

Hate to say it, but if it's a duty pistol, it's a common model, and barrels are available at relatively low cost. Eventually, low cost ammo savings buy you a new barrel.

Buy a practice barrel for $150-200, load 'em up, clean it often. It isn't good for you, but hey, either is rum & coke.

I don't shoot it myself, but if you're planning in advance to treat a practice barrel like a two dollar whore, I can respect that strategy.

That's certainly a way to go Mercy but let me ask you this..What is the point of saving money on ammo just to have to use money saved to buy a new barrel because the junk you ran through it ruined it?? Peter paying Paul there right?

Good info, thanks. Jeepkid, no. No department locally does that I'm aware of either. Perhaps some of the better departments in nicer areas do. We go to the range twice a year as a department and they provide ammo then. Which will equal about 150rds by the time they run a few practice rounds then a qualifying round. Not enough practice for my liking obviously. I used to buy bulk through a guy that gave law enforcement a good deal but I can't get a hold of him now. Then I loaded my own for awhile, but with the lady and kids, I just don't have time to spend hours loading bulk ammo on my single stage press. So looking to order some myself online. I'll avoid tula though. Thanks for the advice folks.
-JaKe

Not if the barrel life difference pays itself back in ammo savings. A practice barrel will last many, many years, many thousands upon thousands of rounds. At 5cents per shot saved for Tulammo, a $200 barrel gets paid back in 4,000 rounds, run 10,000 rounds through it and you've saved $300 more on top of paying for its own barrel. I have a lot more than 10,000 rounds through a couple of my pistol barrels, as long as you don't need extreme precision, they'll still shoot qualifying scores for practice.

It's not for everybody, but if we consider rifle barrels to be consumable, why not pistol barrels too?

I've always been of the school of practice with something similar or identical to what you carry. He is talking about practicing with his duty weapon. What you are proposing is changing out the barrel and shooting ammo that wouldn't even be CLOSE to what he is carrying. At least I would HOPE like hell he isn't carrying that junk! And those Tula rounds aren't only hard on barrels, they are hard on extractors and ejectors and feed ramps as well. Steel cases are flat out rough on the whole firearm. Steel on steel at speed is NEVER a good idea.

I would stay away from steel cased ammo in a duty gun also, for many of the reasons SH outlined & more.

I'm assuming you mean with the weapon that you carry. In which case, I agree. I practice with my duty weapon.


If you mean practice with the ammo I carry... It would cost me around $700/1000 rds to practice with what I carry. That's just unrealistic. At least in my opinion. Practice is about drawing, and getting rounds on target in realistic situations, environments, positions, angles, etc. It's about shooting under stress, and learning how to use the weapon in various situations that you end up in. I don't think I need to shoot rds that cost .70 cents a shot to replicate these situations.... I've ran several boxes of my duty ammo just to be sure that it functions properly and shoots well in the gun, but I can't possibly afford to practice with the stuff.


Standard bulk type ammo works just fine. I was just concerned with putting unnecessary wear on my pistol by shooting high volume of what I've heard is junk ammo. And ya'll confirmed what I've heard. I'll be ordering something other than tulammo


-Jake

I don't know about that. Have you ever heard of American Ammunition? My dad had an old box of that for his 9mm. Seemed like standard 115 grain FMJ loads, till I fired one that blew up, blasted apart the grips, and singed my hands. I discovered online that was a distressingly common occurrence when people used American Ammunition in their guns.

Yes Jake I meant the firearm BUT you can get bulk ammo that is probably similar to load and bullet grain to what you carry. Hence why I suggested that American Eagle (Made by Federal). And you really do want to practice with at least a similar load to where your weapon hits at relatively the same point. There is a TON of muscle memory going on in handgun shooting. How you practice will definitely come out in a stress situation as to how you hit! People seem to forget that little tidbit.

I have to agree here that Tul Ammo is rather less than desirable. I bought my lady friend a Taurus Curve for Christmas that she was wanting for another CCW. She bought a case of .380 Tul at Wally World on discount, her mom works there. Almost every flipping time that pistol would hang, jam, fail to load the last round in the mag, something!!! I grabbed a box of Remmy ball round, runs like a quarter horse!!! I put it through my LCP, not much better. I told her that we will shoot it up and get rid of it unless she can push it off onto someone else and that we wont buy anymore. Just quality ammo. I have her carrying Winchester PDX1's for carry ammo. All 3 of our 380's like em!!!!

I don't run steel cases through any of my guns. American Eagle is made by Federal and is cheap enough to practice with brass.

^^^As much as I love to argue with super_hunt, I have to agree with this.^^^

If I was a professional, I would probably be inclined to practice with the same ammo I carry on duty. That said, the word professional has likely never been used to describe me in any way, so take that for what its worth.

It would cost me over $700/1,000 rounds to practice with what I carry. That's just not realistic when I shoot thousands of rounds each year. I also don't see the need, or the advantage, to practice with the same ammunition when regular bulk ammo works fine. I could send around 5,000 rounds of bulk downrange for what 1,000 rounds of duty ammo would cost me. I'm not trying to shoot 1/2 groups here. Just my opinion though. Maybe I'm just cheap.

The thing that matters most is your point of impact. In 9mm I notice very little variance in recoil, at least with what I've used. So point of impact is what needs to be close. I verify that with any ammo I'm carrying or practicing with. Good defensive shooting is something you eventually get a feel for, rather than carefully aiming... Muscle Memory is probably the correct term... Not to say that I don't aim, but if you can put three rounds center mass in under a second, you're really not consciously aiming... At that point it's knowing your pistol and knowing what movements you have to make to draw and get rounds on target.

I had found a cheap deal on tulaaammo. And wanted to see if the rumors I'd heard about it where true. They were confirmed here as being true. So I'll go with a regular brass bulk ammo. Like American Eagle or something similar. So as to limit wear on my Glock.
-Jake

Jake, I wasn't saying practice with your usual carry ammo. I was saying find ammo that is SIMILAR in bullet grain and powder load that will shoot with or very near your regular carry ammo. I'm assuming your main practice distance is around 10-15 yards correct? Muscle memory, as I said earlier, is a very key component to practicing for self defense. Practicing with something that hits/targets, and FEELS way different than your regular carry ammo is the same as practicing with a 600 grain arrow with a Traditional rig and then going hunting with a 500 grain. Just not smart. Your muscle memory will kick in under stress and you will be shooting horribly if you have practiced with something a lot different. Bad practice is actually worse than no practice!

So what is it you carry on duty? Given that info, I'm sure one of us will be able to find something similar in bullet grain and load so that you won't be practicing bad!

Understood. Just out of curiosity, what ammo do you carry on duty?

Currently the Department issues Winchester Ranger T series... it's a 147gr 9mm. As with everything else... that decision is based on who gives the best deal when they're buying. So it can change year to year. But currently that's what is issued.
-Jake

Jake, I don't buy ammo and haven't for many years other than a box or 3 here and there for manufacturer testing. But I did a little searching and found some relatively good deals. Well good compared to what the soaring ammo costs are today anyway.

http://www.luckygunner.com/9mm-147-g...an-1000-rounds

https://www.ammunitiondepot.com/629-...nic-fnfmj.html

This one, click the "select" tab and click to 1000 case. really good price and free shipping! https://www.targetsportsusa.com/fede...9fp-p-661.aspx

You could go cheaper and drop down to the 124 grain without there being TOO much difference but there will be a difference. Since I know you are into archery then I KNOW you KNOW what I am talking about with practicing with the same grain weights. Since my close up vision is pretty much hammered, I primarily shoot defense handguns instinctive. Still accurate enough to qualify in any Dept. in the nation as well as Federal but not anywhere near the accuracy I used to have. Been in a few scraps with firearms and I can tell you from experience that you DEFINITELY want to train your muscles and reflexes to at least similar to what you will be carrying. It is a point that is all too often overlooked by trainers.

SH, agreed. I think budgets and what's cheapest becomes the primary focus for most departments. Rather than what benefits the Officers the most. It can be frustrating.
-Jake

100% agreed. We shoot over 2000rnds yearly with our duty weapons. We carry the same round as what we practice with. We order in 250K in pistol rounds and 100K in rifle rounds yearly. And throw in 25K for shotgun as well. We do practice with Trap loads for the shotgun, but qual with the big stuff when we have to.