Major Snag!
 

I'm working on reloading some shells for one of my family members 243 win and I've ran into a snag. I reloaded up a batch of shells to go check at the range and i've ran into a bolt stick i have my coal set with a federal factory load that chambers fine in the gun. Upon inspection of the casing right at the base of the neck i noticed where it seems like it pushed it out it's like a small ring the whole way around the base of the neck like it bubbled out. I have my dies set properly and i've reloaded for many other calibers and never ran into this problem. Any ideas what it is or how to fix it?
I'm using rcbs group A Full Length resizing dies. The problem seems to be coming from the sizing die.

RE: Major Snag!
 

A picture would be helpfull. It may be the sizer is not fully sizing the full length of the case, if the neck expands some from firing and the case is not going into the sizer all the way it could leave a bulged ring around the neck.

RE: Major Snag!
 

From the looks of that picture, it appears that your sizing die was not set all the way down. When you set it, did you have your press ram up at its highest point, screw thed die down until it contacts the ram (with shellholder), then lower the ram and screw down an additional 1/4 turn. This causes the ram to 'cam over' against the die ensuring the entire case gets sized.
If you did as above, it is possible that the die is not machined correctly. Is this the first batch of cases you reloaded with this die?

RE: Major Snag!
 

I have the die down 1/4 turn so it will cam over thats whyI cant make sence of any of this. I guess ill call rcbs and see what they have to say.

RE: Major Snag!
 

I agree with BRONCO..it looks like you die is not down far enough..your only partially sizing the neck and if you have a tight chamber and shooting high pressureloadsit could be causing it to hang up or stick.. I actually do this in my varmint guns, they seem to shoot alot better and as a matter of fact I only size them to the base of the bullet..but I shoot well under maximum pressures and have never had a problem with them sticking..maybe the die is not cut correctly??...borrow anyother die and see what happens when you place the bottom of the die flush with the top of the shell holder...

RE: Major Snag!
 

The expander ball is not the correct size.......

RE: Major Snag!
 

To me it looks like a case neck 'donut.'

The brass in the lower part of the neck and shoulder is thicker than in the upper part of the neck. When firing, especially with hot loads, the brass flows from the thicker shoulder to the neck and the brass becomes thicker at the jucture of the neck and shoulder. The problem becomes worse when you FL size the brass by RCBS instructions that tell you to 'cam over' the sizing die which sizes the brass back to SAAMI specs rather than something closer to the size of your rifle's chamber. When the brass is fired again, there is even more case stretching and flow into the neck until the neck is actually constricted and you end up with overpressured loads on your next firing.

Back off on your sizing die- size your brass just enough that it chambers easily, no more. I would start about 1/2 turn or more off the shell holder and size the brass down in 1/16th turn increments until it chambers easily and the sizing die completely resizes the neck portion of the brass. You might have to bump the shoulder back a bit before you get to both considerations, especially if you have a tight chamber on your rifle.

I would just dump the brass with the donut necks in the recycling bin and start over with new brass. You can neck turn them to remove the neck donuts, but the time and expense really isn't worth it for a common chambering with readily available brass like the .243.

RE: Major Snag!
 

I would like to hear the outcome of this. I have never seen such an issue. But I generaly only neck size or collet size. Wonder how many times this brass was loaded.

RE: Major Snag!
 

I had a couple come out of a seating die that way . Idiscovered a trim length problem . Out on a limb possibly a length of chamber vs case . I think thats a reach . Ive never seen thick necks save for LC Match or formed brass ie 22-250 from 308 .

RE: Major Snag!
 

Issue resolved thanks for you're help fella's. I ended up screwing around with it for quite some time but I solved it. I talked to a few of my buddies who reload and one of them suggested like briman to back the die out 1/2 turn and try it so i gave that a shot it still didn't quite solve it so i ended up backing out 7/8 turn and bingo the donut went away and now they chamber fine. Seems a little odd to me but its working. I threw all of that brass away. The brass i was using was once fired remington factory brass what struck me as odd to begin with is that once fired 243 brass needed trimmed they were right at max thats the first i ran into that coming from a factory load. Any who i loaded up a couple combo's and the gun really seems to like 41.5gr of IMR4350 book max after building up of course with CCI 200LR primers. I was able to stuff em in right around 3/4" at 100yd which pleased me for only tring 3 different loads. I'm just glad to have the whole issue outa my hair. Thanks for you're help.

RE: Major Snag!
 

I always suggest reloaders invest in a head and shoulder gauge. Measuring the shoulders of fireformed brass compared to what your die is doing is invalable to me. If I find a sizer is pushing the shoulders too much, I will call RCBS for replacment or have my headspaced checked. I have modified sizers too, to match a gun.

RE: Major Snag!
 

I always suggest reloaders invest in a magic marker, and then properly adjust their sizer die....

Can't imagine charging and seating without first making,inspecting, and chambering a dummy round to verify all is well....which it seems, is the way it didn't happen here. To create the bulges on these .243 win cases as a result of the sizer die being out of adjustmentwould likely have produced an out of norm effort with the press and that should have beenthe firstsign that something was wrong. This issue should have been recognized andresolved long before the first live round was even made. A visual of the very first sizing attempt, at the very least,would have showed the problem...

Personally I've never reloaded new or once fired brass without first checking fordiscrepencies in case length, if that is actually the culprit here in tandom with a die set too far down. I ALWAYS trim everything to a consistent length as part of initial case prep. I guess there's folks out there who don'tthink that's important.

Never saw an RCBS FL die that didn't take max length brass, 'course I don't set up with a cam over either.....

RE: Major Snag!
 

Partial full length sizing can and will cause excessive neck runout. Even with squaring dies.I have showed many people whodo too much reading from people like John Barsness. I much prefer to actually size straight ammo.

The culprit is usually draggin the expander ball back thru. I find excessive neck runout even if you raise the expander ball all the way up to be dragged while the die is supporting the case. Also have tried it John Barsness way of pushing the expander ball thru after sizing. All help some and is ok in my opinion of typical hunting ammo.

This is the benefit of collet dies and redding competition bushing neck sizing dies.

RE: Major Snag!
 

Not everyone was born with vast knowledge of reloading techniques like you were that allow them to make snotty comments towards people trying to learn. Some people had to learn the hard way by trial and error, often with help of people who had experienced the same problems in the past. It doesn't help the new reloader either that RCBS packages instructions that are fundamentally incorrect with regards to sizing die adjustment with their die sets.

RE: Major Snag!
 

Is it possible that the expander ball is not adjusted in the die properly? IIRC on the RCBS die the tip of the de-priming pin should be 3/16th below the bottom of the die. This sets the EB to the right position.

early

RE: Major Snag!
 

Ah yes, the "snotty post police" don't miss a beat.....

Get a life Briman...........

RE: Major Snag!
 

RE: Major Snag!
 

Don't speak your foreign language, but maybe you speak mine.......

RE: Major Snag!
 

Oh my gosh, your children are so lucky to have a father like you. I can see it now.

Wilds goes home and his son asks, "Dad what did you do today". Wilds replys, "I spent all my day trying to get banned so I can go to other websites and brag about it, and son, you should have seen it, I put up a cartoon mickey mouse that had the middle finger up, I am so cool son". Son looks at him perplexed, and says, "dad, I think you need to get a life, and grow up and take some maturity lessons from me, because your acting like a 12 year old". Mother is sitting back with a big smile saying, "I agree walker, how old are you again?". grin..grin

RE: Major Snag!
 

You may not be fluent, but you appear to have gotten the gist of it...

RE: Major Snag!
 

I can't see that being the issue. As I set my expander all the way up and use a universal deprimer.

RE: Major Snag!
 

Oh my gosh, let me go back and see if I was talking to you...










Nope, I wasn't.........




You got a beef with mebigcountry that's just fine, I got some pretty thick skin and have suffered waybigger azzholes than you, but draggin' someone's family into your little pompous holier than thou tirades just proves what kind ofdikhead you really are........

RE: Major Snag!
 

[/quote]

I can't see that being the issue. As I set my expander all the way up and use a universal deprimer.
[/quote]

Thats good info for me (in case of future need)
I hope he gets the problem fixed at any rate.

early

RE: Major Snag!
 

Uh oh, I can now see by your response I was right. So explain to us all walker, how its mature for a 45-50 year old grown man to post a mickey mouse giving someone the finger? How does this make you a better father? Or person? Simple questions. I bet you don't have a set to answer either. A grown mature man does not act this way. Nor does a mature man go around spending his extra time trying to get banned and then going to other pages to brag about.

RE: Major Snag!
 

I have also seen such things happen when one seats a bullet on a heavily compressed load. But this pic doesn't look like that's the problem........ I have seen the too-thick case neck problems appear using .308 brass necked to .l243 and not properly neck-turned after squeezing them down. But of course, when this happens, the whole neck is too thick, not just the bottom part into which the brass has flowed on previous shots. I know of no othe round that evidences such an effect to this extent-perhaps the .300 H&H and the .270 Win. ? I can see why some consider reloading the .243 Win. to be "touchy".