Precision and Long Range Shooting Living the Long Range Precision Life: gear, rifles, reloading, tricks, and tips.

now this is long range!

Old 09-20-2022, 04:17 PM
  #1  
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
 
bronko22000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 12,618
Default now this is long range!

https://allposttimes.com/world-recor...usted-tuesday/
bronko22000 is offline  
Old 09-20-2022, 08:15 PM
  #2  
Nontypical Buck
 
Nomercy448's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,842
Default

These exhibition shots as “world records” are exceptionally poorly regulated, and frankly, in the instances of the last few “records,” they’ve largely been fabricated. This shot, for example, connected on the 69th shot on a 4ft x 8ft target, and no further shots were taken (meaning they weren’t walking onto target, and they didn’t even attempt to repeat the shot to confirm capability). Wholly coincidental that it hit near the orange dot. Not just any Joe blow with a super magnum rifle could EVER hit these targets, but this game of 69 shots to connect is just playing probabilities - a couple good spotters, time, and ammo. When it happens, we don’t gain knowledge and don’t advance in the ELR culture - we simply have a new coincidence happening where the right lottery numbers were chosen.

Also this week, a properly regulated cold bore world record was also broken - cold bore + 2 (which was actually +3, as he went 4 shots in a row at 2585yards on a 36”x36” plate, in competition, on the clock. Derek Love of Severance Training Center, on Team Cutting Edge Bullets shooting a tweaked 416 Stroker he calls the 416 STC set this record at Spearpoint Ranch in Kansas this weekend at their year end ELR Series Finale.

Derek beat out another shooter at this Finale match which ALSO set an ELR record last spring at the same range. Ryan Cheney connected on the farthest ELR shot in competition history at 4134yrds on a 72” square plate - also hitting 2 out of 5 shots taken at that range.

Two of these records were sanctioned and legitimate, demonstrating repeatable performance - the other is simply a statistical probability which occurs when enough shots are slung at a target with even the most moderate skill.

Last edited by Nomercy448; 09-20-2022 at 08:24 PM.
Nomercy448 is offline  
Old 09-21-2022, 12:23 PM
  #3  
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
 
bronko22000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 12,618
Default

NoMercy the bullet actually hit the 8" orange dot. I agree anyone with decent shooting experience can likely duplicate this feat provided he had the right equipment and enough of ammo.
bronko22000 is offline  
Old 09-21-2022, 03:52 PM
  #4  
Nontypical Buck
 
Nomercy448's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,842
Default

What does the random possibility of hitting the 8” circle prove? At 7700 yards, he couldn’t see that spot in his scope, I can tell you that for certain, and if we try to pretend hitting the dot was any kind of intent, rather than a simple matter of happenstance, then why did all of the other 68 rounds completely miss the target - 6x by 15x larger than the dot? He didn’t walk onto an 8” dot. He threw enough rounds at a big white piece of steel, and it happened to hit a part of the target which was painted.

Not so dissimilar than when we hit a hanger bolt head on a full sized IPSC at a mile. Ooh, aah… no wait, did we purposefully hit an inch and a half bolt head at a mile, or did a shot hitting within the area of an 18”x30” target happen to hit on the bolt head.

Missing a white 4ft x10ft target 68 times in a row then accidentally hitting it - let alone accidentally hitting the painted circle doesn’t suggest hitting the dot was done by skill or intent. That dot is smaller than the center dot of the reticle in the scope he used, with almost 8,000 yards of atmosphere distorting that image to nothing at all by the time it bounced through his prisms.

Scott and Shepherd have been open about what this exhibition was - just silliness flinging bullets until they maybe ran into something. He’s certainly a skilled ELR shooter, but not sufficiently so to justify this as within his repeatable capacity. Paul Phillips’ record before this one was just as much a gimmick - Paul also being someone very skilled in ELR shooting. But these are like those 1 mile milk jug challenge videos using 223’s, or Uncle Jerry shooting an IPSC at 1000yrds with a 9mm revolver. It’s not really the point of the spear in long range marksmanship, it’s just a statistical certainty.
Nomercy448 is offline  
Old 09-22-2022, 06:23 AM
  #5  
Boone & Crockett
Thread Starter
 
bronko22000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 12,618
Default

Not arguing with you Nomercy. I agree. Even the article says it is not scientifically repeatable...Well no kidding! But I guess that depends on what you consider repeatable. Now that the shooter was "in the ball park" maybe he could hit it repeatably once every 50 shots or less.
But what this "record" does show is that a bullet is dangerous for a distance of almost 5 miles and can kill someone who just happens to be in its path.
bronko22000 is offline  
Old 09-24-2022, 06:06 AM
  #6  
Nontypical Buck
 
Nomercy448's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,842
Default

“Repeatability” is largely “predictability.” If we can do something once, can we predict that we can do it again? Predictably, if you have the skill to ALMOST achieve something, then in many cases, just doing it enough times will yield achievement. Contrarily, a word record for deadlift has no opportunity for statistical certainty - either you can lift the bar, or you can’t. But just like shooting groups at 100yrds, USUALLY our first bullet won’t hit perfectly center on the bullseye, but every now and again, with enough groups fired, it does. We’d tend to call it “luck” or “coincidence,” as it’s not something we can predictably do. For these 7000+ yard records, that’s largely how they are achieved. They have the skills and gear to rain shots on the area, and in doing so with enough shots, one WILL hit.

These records out in the grey space, off of the edge of the page of the capability of current gear, knowledge, and skill represent what WILL come in the future. Guys like Derek, Ryan, and Rob (who are all competing this weekend in King of 2 Mile) will eventually be shooting competition records at that distance, and eventually shooting that distance as a standard of competition. The page will grow into this grey space, and then the exhibition records still beyond that will grow from 7000 out to 10,000 or 12,000 yards.
Nomercy448 is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.