CalHunter

Defense can call for an autopsy. If the findings are similar, it wouldn't make a difference. If the findings are different in the 2nd autopsy, it could obviously make a difference. Regardless of what underlying medical conditions exist or don't, however, the cop is still stuck with video footage of him using what most agencies would call an unauthorized use of force tactic and failure to render appropriate and timely first aid when a restrained subject told him numerous times that he (the black guy) couldn't breathe. The cop's attorney(s) could argue that obviously the black guy was breathing if he was talking but that isn't the essential point--the black guy was having difficulty breathing and the cop failed to render any first aid and continued with the tactic that created that situation in the first place.

Bocajnala

I don't want to minimize what happened in this specific situation. And Cal, I don't know if you're experience is similar to mine as I know you've been off the road for a while... But "I can't breathe" has become a very popular phrase and I hear it fairly often.

It's not just a t-shirt that people wear. It's also something they yell when being arrested or restrained.

Again- I'm not defending the officer in this specific instance. But if I stopped doing my job every time somebody said "I can't breathe" or every time a bystander said "they said they can't breathe!" I'd get nothing done.

The "protests" hit my area today. So far nothing more than thrown water bottles and some people climbing on City trucks blocking roads etc... But it's coming.

-Jake

Oldtimr

Absolutely, common for a suspect in custody being placed under control to say they can't breath. If they are talking they are breathing. Many times they are putting on a show for bystanders and wittnesses.

Valorius

Perhaps it is worth considering that the types of restraints and techniques you are being taught make it very hard to breathe (which would not surprise me, as I have a generally extremely dim view of modern police procedures and polices in this country)

It is also worth noting that modern Americans are generally in terrible shape, so it is not exactly a shock that most of them have a hard time breathing in traumatic situations with someone sitting or kneeling on them.

Finally, you can kill someone by compressing their carotid while kneeling on their neck, even if they can breathe.

Valorius

The Gentleman that was murdered in Minn was talking the whole time he was being slowly murdered by the cop that was choking the life out of him with his knee. As I pointed out above, you can cut off blood flow via the carotid artery by kneeling on someone's throat- in which case they would still be able to talk as they were dying.

Oldtimr

You put pressure on the side of the neck to pinch off the carotid artery not on the back of the neck. Quite frankly I watched the video and if you look closely you will see that the officer's knee was on the head and shoulders of the suspect as well as the neck so you do not know how much pressure was on the neck. I am not ready to call it murder because all of the facts are no yet in.

Valorius

Floyd's head was turned to the side, so it is the carotid that was being pressed against the pavement.

The facts are in, they are utterly incontrovertible. This was murder. Full stop.

CalHunter

Mmmm. I wouldn't call it murder Valorius. That presumes Officer Chauvin pre-planned to kill George Floyd. So far, I haven't seen anything to indicate that was the case. You could argue about what level or degree of manslaughter occurred which is an unlawful killing of another human being. But a murder charge isn't supported by any of the evidence I've seen or read. Apparently the DA agrees with that based on the complaint filed which charges Officer Chauvin with manslaughter.

Oldtimr

Look at the video, the knee was on the suspects back and on head which pretty much relieves most of the pressure on the neck. Open your eyes and stop making premature judgement. You are seeing what you want to see.

Champlain Islander

Regardless of a video the defense can bring in their own experts and hire crackerjack lawyers to create a reasonable doubt as to whether the cop used excessive force or had a callous disregard for life. Watching the OJ trial taught me that when someones case is put forth for a jury of their peers anything can happen. If the cop ends up walking it will be a war that makes the Rodney King period look like Disneyland.