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The utter immorality of the War on (some) Drugs

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The utter immorality of the War on (some) Drugs

Old 04-04-2013, 11:47 AM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by brewman555 View Post
Like I said....just don't ask me or any other taxpayer to take care of you when you burn out....
Ok... when should I expect that to happen?

It's been 10 years... I am the same, and actually gained much more knowledge with age.

The propaganda that you've heard on the subject is just that.

Now, if someone smokes every day, watches TV and never goes out and does anything or learns new skills, then I suppose one could "burn out," but it's not from the herb alone.
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Old 04-04-2013, 11:54 AM
  #12  
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Legalize it all I say. Drugs are kind of like abortions i.e. people are going to do it anyway.
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Old 04-04-2013, 12:00 PM
  #13  
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The war on drugs should continue for drugs that can kill in one use, cocaine, meth, ecstasy, etc. etc. Don't end the war on drugs, end the war on harmless medicine.
That's one of the major excuses that gets tossed around--the "War on Drugs" is wasteful, hasn't been effective, will never work, etc. etc. etc. so end it. Legalizing pot won't fix anything.

Pot isn't "harmless medicine". It may have legitimate medicinal purposes--if so, I have no problem with that. I know you aren't an idiot, and that's what you would have to be to think people would only use it for medicinal purposes.

So, suppossedly you can't o.d. on pot. I guess you can't get high and do something stupid and get yourself killed, and/or kill others in the process?

What good could possibly come from making it legal?
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Old 04-04-2013, 12:13 PM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by LBR View Post
What good could possibly come from making it legal?
assuming a serious question... fewer of our fellow citizens jacked up & locked up, or worse. Fewer dogs killed by JBTs. Police can spend their resources on other things

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berwyn_...ence_drug_raid

It'll be hard to achieve, though... lots of pensions & careers at stake, and some LE orgs will lose out on forfeiture booty. Plus, we've got lots of self-righteous types who only approve of freedoms they approve of, and who like to tell their fellow citizens what to do.

Last edited by Catus Magnus; 04-04-2013 at 12:15 PM.
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Old 04-04-2013, 12:17 PM
  #15  
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Originally Posted by LBR View Post
That's one of the major excuses that gets tossed around--the "War on Drugs" is wasteful, hasn't been effective, will never work, etc. etc. etc. so end it. Legalizing pot won't fix anything.
Do you know how much money would be saved if Game Wardens/Conservation officers, Local Police, Federal Agents, DEA, etc. etc. stopped targeting marijuana consumers and producers?

I don't, but I'll bet it's a hefty sum... couldn't we spend that money on, I dunno, education? That's one that comes to mind.

The War on Drugs should remain the "war on drugs." Focus efforts on actual drugs that actually harm people and are highly addictive in nature.

Originally Posted by LBR View Post
Pot isn't "harmless medicine". It may have legitimate medicinal purposes--if so, I have no problem with that. I know you aren't an idiot, and that's what you would have to be to think people would only use it for medicinal purposes.
What qualifies as a 'medicinal purpose?'

I'm no fool, and know you aren't either, but there are much worse LEGAL medicines that are being abused by recreational users.

Oxycontin and other opiates readily come to mind.

Originally Posted by LBR View Post
So, suppossedly you can't o.d. on pot. I guess you can't get high and do something stupid and get yourself killed, and/or kill others in the process?
The same could be said for booze... drunk drivers kill themselves and others non-stop. We're not going to make beer illegal.

On the other hand, I'd like to see someone cite a reference where someone used marijuana and killed themselves or others.

Originally Posted by LBR View Post
What good could possibly come from making it legal?
At the very least... lower prison populations, increased tax revenue and better music.
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Old 04-04-2013, 12:55 PM
  #16  
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The biggest problem i have with it being illegal is the huge number of people who are incarcerated for a simple possession and those that grow for personal use instead of funding some cartel in Mexico are looking at the longest sentences.

I dont really have as much of a problem with a states making it illegal, at least not anymore than i have a problem with them having dry counties or banning 190 proof EverClear.

The biggest problem with complete legalization is drug testing. Pot stays in your system much longer than most drugs. Get in an accident at work that requires testing and you can test positive even after a month. A DUI test would look the same whether you were guilty of used days earlier.

Last edited by Gm54-120; 04-04-2013 at 01:06 PM.
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Old 04-04-2013, 01:08 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by Gm54-120 View Post
The biggest problem i have with it being illegal is the huge number of people who are incarcerated for a simple possession and those that grow for personal use instead of funding some cartel in Mexico are looking at the longest sentences.
Exactly.

Originally Posted by Gm54-120 View Post
I dont really have as much of a problem with a states making it illegal, at least not anymore than i have a problem with them having dry counties or banning 190 proof EverClear.

The biggest problem with complete legalization is drug testing. Pot stays in your system much longer than most drugs. Get in an accident at work that requires testing and you canl show positive even after a month. A DUI test would look the same whether you were guilty of used days earlier.
Emphasis is mine.

To me, the old saying applies "it goes with the territory."

If you work in a position where you could possibly be injured while on the job and you KNOW that it will lead to a drug test, then you probably shouldn't risk using it. Right?

It should be a personal choice, but right now, it's not.
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Old 04-04-2013, 01:13 PM
  #18  
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Do you know how much money would be saved if Game Wardens/Conservation officers, Local Police, Federal Agents, DEA, etc. etc. stopped targeting marijuana consumers and producers?
No idea. How much?


...couldn't we spend that money on, I dunno, education? That's one that comes to mind.
Kinda' off topic, but we've already seen proof that throwing more money at our education system doesn't work.

The War on Drugs should remain the "war on drugs." Focus efforts on actual drugs that actually harm people and are highly addictive in nature.
Tobacco is highly addictive and causes a lot of harm.

What qualifies as a 'medicinal purpose?'
I dunno. Maybe prescribed by a legitimate M.D., after it's ok'd by the FDA?

...there are much worse LEGAL medicines that are being abused by recreational users.

Oxycontin and other opiates readily come to mind.
No argument from me.

The same could be said for booze... drunk drivers kill themselves and others non-stop. We're not going to make beer illegal.
So...make another substance that could do the same thing legal? Why is that supposed to make sense?

I'd like to see someone cite a reference where someone used marijuana and killed themselves or others.
Would it really matter to you? Honestly--no sarcasm intended.

I have a good friend that just retired from working as an LEO. His personal experience is that stoners aren't just laid-back, mellowed out, harmless types, anymore than drunks are like Otis from Mayberry RFD. Different people react differently.

At the very least... lower prison populations, increased tax revenue and better music.
Who goes to prison for pot? Increased revenue...and increased expenses. Same failed argument used for cigs, booze, lottery, casinos, etc. Better music???? It hasn't helped Willie Nelson or Bob Marley.....
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Old 04-04-2013, 01:14 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by Psylocide View Post
It should be a personal choice, but right now, it's not.
Loaning your rifle to a pal, and buying an AR are both personal choices, in most of the country - but they're trying to make that illegal, too.

The business of the law is to make business for the law (& LE). The War on (some) Drugs is good business, for some.
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Old 04-04-2013, 01:26 PM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by LBR View Post
No idea. How much?
http://readersupportednews.org/opini...lion-each-year

Some quick figures there... don't have time to do much more today yet, I'll look into it more later.

With taxed and regulated marijuana, federal and state governments would suddenly free up $26 billion spent annually on the failed drug war. And the additional tax revenue taken in, assuming the states regulate and tax the sale of marijuana, would mean an additional $46 billion in tax revenue every year.
Originally Posted by LBR View Post
Kinda' off topic, but we've already seen proof that throwing more money at our education system doesn't work.
More musing than going off topic.

Originally Posted by LBR View Post
Tobacco is highly addictive and causes a lot of harm.
Sure is... can you say there isn't a war on tobacco in this country?


Originally Posted by LBR View Post
I dunno. Maybe prescribed by a legitimate M.D., after it's ok'd by the FDA?
Too many high-powered anti-legalization groups in the mix to let that happen. The FDA will ok it when they are allowed to.


Originally Posted by LBR View Post
So...make another substance that could do the same thing legal? Why is that supposed to make sense?
People are still going to do it. People are still going to drink.

No one should drink and drive, it isn't legal... but every day someone gets behind the wheel. It doesn't have to make sense.

Originally Posted by LBR View Post
Would it really matter to you? Honestly--no sarcasm intended.

I have a good friend that just retired from working as an LEO. His personal experience is that stoners aren't just laid-back, mellowed out, harmless types, anymore than drunks are like Otis from Mayberry RFD. Different people react differently.
I've never met a violent/crazed person that only did pot... a mixture of things though. But, I haven't met everyone, so you've got me there.


Originally Posted by LBR View Post
Who goes to prison for pot? Increased revenue...and increased expenses. Same failed argument used for cigs, booze, lottery, casinos, etc. Better music???? It hasn't helped Willie Nelson or Bob Marley.....
There are scores of people in prison for pot, revenue would increase undoubtedly in my mind, but I can't prove it will. You can't prove it wouldn't.

I love Willie and Bob... that's just a matter of personal opinion though.

Either way, it comes down to personal freedom... I'm not going to stop, but I'd like to see it legal. I'm not a criminal.
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