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CA Students Sent Home For Wearing US Flag

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CA Students Sent Home For Wearing US Flag

Old 05-08-2010, 10:56 AM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by vc1111 View Post
bernie:


Maybe. Or maybe appropriate discipline took place against a handful of kids who got together to purposely stir up trouble at some podunk high school. Like bergall said:

People are missing the freaking points here:
1: A student's 1st amendment rights are abridged by school policy, as a matter of course. Usually, there is a good reason. So their "1st amendment rights" only extend to the point where their right to expression does not cause problems with the greater population at the school.
Wrong, look up bong hits for Jesus.
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Old 05-08-2010, 12:44 PM
  #52  
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Hmmm.....because you seem to be more full of crap today than usual, my comments will be in bold red, below...I edited out the sections that either do not apply or are of no interest...


[QUOTE=vc1111;3623728]Well, I suppose you would see it that way. What I see is an incident involving a bunch of pimple-faced high school kids who were most likely trying to stir up trouble.
"Seems to me, the HISPANIC school official began this by demanding the American kids remove American flag bandanas. Seems like a discriminatory move from the get-go.


Gee, I must have missed that. Where did anyone say it was "illegal," Mr. Deep Thinker? Can you prove that? Or you just talking out your posterior orifice?

Thanks for proving my assertion.
Banned by the school is as illegal as it gets in high school....so banned=illegal because both are actionable.


bernie:
Maybe. Or maybe appropriate discipline took place against a handful of kids who got together to purposely stir up trouble at some podunk high school.
It may be podunk, but to assume the kids were looking for trouble is an assumption that's being made to justify a questionable action by the school admins. I make no such assumptions...there was no confrontation, except by the school's admin and the 5 kids who were sitting minding their own business, ostensibly.

Like bergall said:
People are missing the freaking points here:
1: A student's 1st amendment rights are abridged by school policy, as a matter of course. Usually, there is a good reason. So their "1st amendment rights" only extend to the point where their right to expression does not cause problems with the greater population at the school.
This is true across the country. Minors have the rights they're allowed by those in authority over them. That being said, Administrative 'codes of behavior' are usually universal...and to apply the code to 1 group and not another is selective or rather, prejudicial enforcement.


Bergall, by the way, is usually much brighter than to post this type of nonsense:

[Quote]So, if those freaking Mexican skunks have a problem with Americans celebrating a 'mexican' holiday (which is not a
holiday in Mexico, by the way), then they are racists and SHOULD be stomped. Likewise if there is a sense of 'national pride' to be expressed, ALL GROUPS in attendance can express THEIR OWN FEELINGS of national pride...it's not Mexico or nothing, for
crissakes !!! [\quote]
you take exception to mexicans celebrating a national holiday in the USA and threatening violence for natural-born Americans if they wear their own flag...seems racist to me, in every way imaginable. Also, there's a bit TOO MUCH 'national pride' for a bankrupt corrupt foreign country in a State in the USA. If they're so damn proud, how come they're not rollin' in crap in their own country ? Wave the flag there, hermanos...


and this:
WTF are we doing with supposed American citizens asserting a potentially violent allegiance to a foreign country[\quote]

I must have missed the part about violence taking place during the school yard incident.
School officials acted in an official manner exactly because this was seen as a distinct possibility if not a certainty. That's a lot different than closing your eyes and barking out your butt about where's the violence. The violence was, for good or bad, supposedly defused by the nutless school admins by grabbing the kinds wearing the US flags...not by putting things in perspective for ALL THE STUDENTS. If wearing an American flag is provocative, then so is wearing a Mexican flag. The rule goes for everyone or it goes for no one. These cowards chose to segregate 5 presumably white kids and allow the rest of the ignorant scumbags to have their way in their 'guest country'. Truly stomach turning cowards...they are supposed to be professionals. What did they day last year on may 5th ? How about next year ? WTF is going on over there ? Are those kids secured or is it survival of the most fit ?


Quote:
I've seen more confederate flags in New Jersey than when I hunted down south..

Funny how just the mention of the Confederate flag brings out this defensiveness. Could it be because the Confederate flag has gained an identify as a symbol of racist groups who show up in the south, the north, the east and the west? And since we're on the subject of flags...why would racist groups identify with that particular flag?

If you're going to deal in feelings, then you'll also have to acknowledge the "feelings" of those (not me necessarily), who feel that the flag also represents the South's ties to slavery. I will also acknowledge that you allowed that those people can decide whether or not to tolerate that symbol of slavery...and they apparently decided that they would not tolerate it flying over the capital, if I recall correctly.
The flag represents the STATE FLAG of each confederate state, the content of which is notwithstanding. The state flags fly below the American National flag, as they should. It is a state issue, the graphics on their flags. There's a lot of pride in the southern states and defeat was a bitter pill to swallow. I would say that the NORTHERN states are the ones equating the southern cross with slavery, which the confederates see it in different terms. And exactly WHAT flies over the statehouse in each state is the choice of the people of that state. Some states have maintained the rebel history in their state flags...others have modified their state flags according to the wishes of the residents of the state. That's part of their right to self-determination, another right they fought for and lost in the war between the states.

One might also ask if the Confederate flag was a symbol of the United States Of America or some other outfit, which had decided it no longer wanted to be part of America. If it is the latter, then that flag is no different than the Mexican flag, is it?
B]Butt barking at it's finest, to be sure. In your ignorance, you are talking about a confederate BATTLE FLAG (there were at least 4 or more of 'em), and not the Flag of the CSA which nobody flies. And racist skunks can associate it anyway they want...certainly there are sheets and the southern cross and the swastika and other racist symbols...far fewer adhere to the open display of such icons as would be presented here. For most across the south, those with a family history and not just recent transplants from the north, it's symbol of confederate pride. There is the issue of honoring their war dead and the reverence with which the battle was joined. Southern folks had to swallow a bitter pill in their loss to the north. The SOUTHERN CROSS (you never see the flag of the government of the CSA, only the battle flag) represents not support for slavery, but rather, the spirit of a people who sought to sever ties with a federal government which was using 'states rights' as a welcome mat. And just so we get things straight....the Civil War began in 1861 and Lincoln did not issue the Emancipation Proclamation until 1863, FULLY TWO YEARS INTO THE WAR, the purpose of this action was to break the back of southern manufacturing which, without slavery could not supply it's own troops with war materiel. So slavery was not the primary issue here...the confederated states felt the Federal government had abrogated the agreement binding the states into the Union, which was the constitution. Much as is happening today in modern times.[/B]


I have great respect for your opinions, Bergall, and I mean that. But on this one, your emotions seem to be distorting what ever semblance of a valid point you hope to make.
I usually have an equal respect for your opinions as well, but in this, I believe you are dead wrong. I believe we must assert ourselvs and our national identity of have it crushed underfoot by those intent on razing the country and reclaiming it as their own if not legally, then culturally. I am not a fan of placating people for expediency's sake...that tends to corrupt thiings as a general policy.

Last edited by bergall; 05-08-2010 at 12:51 PM.
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Old 05-08-2010, 02:08 PM
  #53  
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Let me see if I understand your logic, vc1111: If folks are hacked off because of a piss-ninny politically correct attitude that Americans should go out of their way to avoid offending Mexicans in our own damn country, those folks are trying to deny Mexicans the opportunity to celebrate their heritage and national pride?

Nonsense.

If this were a matter of standing in the way of Mexicans' celebrating their national pride, the Mexicans would be refused the opportunity to wave their flags and display their customs. Of course, in the situation being discussed here, the only people who were denied those opportunities were Americans.
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Old 05-08-2010, 02:19 PM
  #54  
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Who went on the attack?
That would be the party who referred to the content of my post as “Fairy Tales" told within "sewing circles."


Who said Northerners are Rude? (which you just proved your own point with your post)
Well, since you want to get cute, let me define rude for you: Rude would be mocking another board member’s disabled mother. That ring a bell for you?

Such anger.
Want to talk about anger? Lol, talk about hypocrisy. Every time I stop by and take a peak in here to see if there is anything interesting, all I see is another of your inflamed, ranting threads about how angry you are about one thing or another in the current state of political affairs. I don’t ever remember a time when you were as rude or constantly bristling as you seem to be these days.. You used to be a nice guy. Now you don’t hesitate to openly mock another member’s disabled parent in an attempt to make political points.

Here’s a couple of nice, little, family-oriented gems you posted on page one of this thread:
“What f-ing nation does she live in?”
What the [email protected]#%?
I’m surprised that this board has come to a point where we’ll allow that kind of language. But…language aside, it highlights your anger and inability to rationally discuss routine political topics.

As to “bong hits for Jesus,” you may direct your correction at Bergall. Apparently you didn’t read carefully enough to notice those were his words.

Bergall:
Hmmm.....because you seem to be more full of crap today than usual, my comments will be in bold red, below...I edited out the sections that either do not apply or are of no interest...
In your ignorance, you are talking about…
Here, Bergie, let me define “ignorance” and ”full of crap” for ya:

ROcks should be thrown thru windows, cars overturned, fires started...
Maybe if somebody's parents went down there and wiped the floors with these school admins,..
A beat-down is a definitive solution..
…. , then they are racists and SHOULD be stomped….
Insults like that those that you led off with, especially in the wake of the trash you posted and which I underscored above, are actually proof that I’m on target with the idea that you and yours are incapable of any meaningful analysis. You’re apparently so full of hatred, you resort to openly and repeatedly calling for violence as the answer???. Brilliant stuff, Bergall.

Now allow me to dismantle the rest of the hype you concocted as a response:

Banned by the school is as illegal as it gets in high school....so banned=illegal because both are actionable.
Thanks for proving my point. You use the word “illegal” in the same context as double-dribbling is “illegal” in basketball. Not “illegal” in the legal sense, but against school policy? Gee, ya think?

That's a lot different than closing your eyes and barking out your butt about where's the violence.
Wrong, homie. The school officials felt that the one’s INCITING the violence were trouble-makers who showed up and openly violated school policy by wearing contraband bandanas and while wearing flag t-shirts…they were probably known trouble-makers with a history of that type of ting, which is probably why the school officials removed them. As I said before, I agree with Kevin’s assertion, that while we should allow these KIDS to do whatever they please to assert their “rights”…but only in a perfect world, mind you…the admin probably responded appropriately…despite your wild, shrill calls to have them attacked and “stomped.”

Of course you followed your caterwauling for violence with more wild, over-the-top speculation:
What did they day last year on may 5th ? How about next year ? WTF is going on over there ? Are those kids secured or is it survival of the most fit ?
That being said, Administrative 'codes of behavior' are usually universal...and to apply the code to 1 group and not another is selective or rather, prejudicial enforcement.


You are talking about the use of the bandanas, right? …..Right? READ THE ARTICLE: The patriotic little “angels” you are so quick to defend came to school openly wearing paraphernalia the school had forbade. That alone was probably grounds enough to eject them on the spot…and again, I’m betting your little patriots were probably the school’s known pot-stirrers.

The state flags fly below the American National flag, as they should.


Now are talking about when they’re flown over the fridge converted to a beer cooler or in the back of your obligatory pickemup truck? Lol, you wrote the most about that flag…that has been adopted by a number of well-known racist organizations, but you never did address my question…With all the “state” flags to choose from, with all the flags on the planet to choose from why THAT flag for the racists groups to show off their proud “heritage?”

, it's symbol of confederate pride.
You mean like the display of the Mexican flag in the article in question? Or are you talking about the “Confederate pride” as exhibited by the KKK etal?

So slavery was not the primary issue here...
Ah, yes, there it is. Comes out every time, it does. The attempt to play down slavery…which I never even mentioned, by the way You boys sure are touchy about your flag, aren’t ya? But wait….didn’t you just make argument that no one should be allowed to show any flag other than the USA flag on school property? But hold on…you argued that each location can decide if it wants the confederate “battle” flag to fly, right? So which is it? Or does it depend if you are a citizen of Mexican descent or a “real” American like you, eh Bergall?

I usually have an equal respect for your opinions as well…
Hard to see that since you led off with insults and continued with them, despite that fact that I approached you with respect and took exception only against your stance and not you personally. Obviously, your vitriol is doing the talking for you this time around.

Gris:
Let me see if I understand your logic, vc1111: If folks are hacked off because of a piss-ninny politically correct attitude that Americans should go out of their way to avoid offending Mexicans in our own damn country, those folks are trying to deny Mexicans the opportunity to celebrate their heritage and national pride?
No, you don't understand at all. It's easy. A bunch of kids went to school on a given day dressed a certain way to get a rise out of the other students of Mexican descent. They also wore bandanas, against school policy, which is to me at least, another sigh that they went to school that day with ill intentions. The school officials caught onto it and defused the situation, the BEST WAY THEY COULD...end of story. There were no good solutions from what I saw. I believe that is what Kevin also inferred.

We're talking about KIDS, not adults. If this were a bunch of adults, it would probably not have occurred at all, but that is conjecture. Who knows.

Last edited by vc1111; 05-08-2010 at 02:41 PM.
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Old 05-10-2010, 08:14 AM
  #55  
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Bwwwwww ha ha ha ha ha ha. You need to do stand up V.C.. Gawd, you are an angry person.


And Ill say it again and stand by it;

In regards to the young lady saying it is disrespectful for someone to wear the American colors on a Mexican holiday, here in America. And then explains she is showing national pride. Pride to Mexico, while being an American citizen, here in America, I reply with;

What F-ing country does she think she lives in?

And please, you rude Notherner, explain to me why Im off base?

Besides, sewing circles is not disrespectful, get a grip you angry little man. And yes, you are eat up with fairytales when it comes to my home state. And fairytale is simply a made up story, that which you are doing about the south. I guess you got your lunch money taken by someone you suspected to be from the south, as a child. Get over it. And yes, I’m being rude now.

Last edited by burniegoeasily; 05-10-2010 at 08:22 AM.
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Old 05-10-2010, 09:26 AM
  #56  
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In regards to the young lady saying it is disrespectful for someone to wear the American colors on a Mexican holiday, here in America. And then explains she is showing national pride.

It should again be noted that Cinco de Mayo is NOT a "MEXICAN HOLIDAY." It is a regional holiday, only celebrated in and around Puebla, Mexico. Here in the states, it's pretty much just another reason for idiots to drink themselves stupid.

I'm curious why we are required to bend over and grab our ankles to keep from offending someone who is celebrating a Mexican Holiday that isn't even a Mexican Holiday...
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Old 05-10-2010, 09:31 AM
  #57  
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I'm curious why we are required to bend over and grab our ankles to keep from offending someone who is celebrating a Mexican Holiday that isn't even a Mexican Holiday...
because VC is now pretty embarrassed that he paid his illegal house maid time and a half (1.50/hr) for Cinco day.
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Old 05-10-2010, 11:20 AM
  #58  
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After reading this story I want to just cry and put my head in the sand...is that ok? Seems like we are Rambo in the end of part 1...hearing "Its over Johnny!" very depressing.
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Old 05-12-2010, 09:11 AM
  #59  
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the most depressing part, is that there are unmitigated schmucks who will maintain that the display of an AMERICAN flag in an AMERICAN high school on a school day is troublemaking, and the singling out of same by an hispanic school official for punitive measures is "good administration". Ducky...we're circling the drain.....
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