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Bush Timetable

Old 11-13-2002, 10:50 AM
  #51  
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Default RE: Bush Timetable

Yes oldelk it is a gray are. Some fought for the south and some the north. And again I say I never said scandal, you did. I said convictions. Why do I need to defend the facts? Show me I am wrong. But then that would mean you would have to do honest research and NOT ignore the facts, but actually LOOK for the facts. Something the reps have a hard time doing when they don't like what they show.

So why don't you go do some research or shut your mouth? And as far as idiots, check Clinton's IQ versus that genius busch you love so much.

I believe this thread started as a question, how long does busch have to get something done. Fair question. He has the presidency and the congress, and as he is held up to be some sort of heroic leader, it shouldn't take very long at all. So how did it turn into a Clinton bashing, again? I guess it is easier to beat on him again than to actually look at the situation at hand and set some realistic expectations for busch. That way you won't be held to question when he fails miserably?
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Old 11-13-2002, 10:57 AM
  #52  
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Default RE: Bush Timetable

Easy, there Shawn. Everything is Clinton's fault. And it always will be. Forever. Always.

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Old 11-13-2002, 11:54 AM
  #53  
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Default RE: Bush Timetable

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote> Why do I need to defend the facts? Show me I am wrong. But then that would mean you would have to do honest research and NOT ignore the facts, but actually LOOK for the facts. Something the reps have a hard time doing when they don't like what they show.

So why don't you go do some research or shut your mouth? And as far as idiots, check Clinton's IQ versus that genius busch you love so much.

<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

You brought the subject up first I want to see facts. I am not going to run and research everytime some whining Democrat wants me to.
Jimmy Carter was a Nuclear Physicist look what that did for us. If your going to slam our President at least spell his name right. I am not going to go over every frigging scandal brought about by Clinton there is not enough room on this server for that to happen.



<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>oldelk, our water is just fine, but I do wonder about your schools down south <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>


What is your problem with the schools down south ? But you may have something there , since we suffered under 3 rejects that are products of the school system in Georgia,Arkansas,and Tennessee.


See my post to GA above and hope you enjoy the next 6 years of the Bush Presidency...LOL LOL
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Old 11-13-2002, 12:52 PM
  #54  
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Default RE: Bush Timetable

Gobbler, you had my support until this bonehead statement.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>Just so you know, you want to attack the dems for 40yrs of things going wrong, but under every rep president we go into recession, it take a dem to pull us back out. The only thing Reagans trickel down economics did was cripple the economy, and piss on the middle class. So get your facts straight.<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

Did Carter pull us out of recession? Does the term &quot;Misery Index&quot; mean anything to you? Can you conjure up any hard numbers to prove that Reagan's economic plan &quot;cripple[d] the economy and piss[ed] on the middle class&quot;?

I've taken on the subject of Reagan's economic policies before on here, and I'll do it again.

As to your original question, &quot;So how long does the president, with his congress have to show Positive change?&quot;, I really think that depends. Depending on what happens in Iraq and other places that must be smacked down, I'd say he has one year to implement real changes.

Nothing ever happens in an election year, so forget about anything controversial (read: meaningful) being done in 2004. He has from January 2003 to around February or March of 2004 to prove to the moderates (read: people who don't know what they believe in) that he's the man for the job.

However, if the war goes in a crazy direction, or Al-Qaeda strikes again, he's a lock, as are most Republicans. There is an all-too common, and not inaccurate perception that Republicans are better at national security and war than are Democrats. In fact, that raises a good point...excepting FDR, name one Democrat that has successfully overseen a war or conflict. I can only think of one.


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Old 11-13-2002, 12:54 PM
  #55  
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Default RE: Bush Timetable

1&gt; The last 2 years of the Clinton Presidency I lost money in my Ira and 401k and the economy was going down.

But not in recession, under the dems plan it would have started growing again.

<font color=red>FACT - Last two years of Clinton was the beginning of the recession we are now in - nothing could have changed the Dot.Com collapse or the Enron's.</font id=red>

2&gt; read Dochendrix post and he explains what Clinton exactly did.
3&gt; He sold military secrets to China or gave them away

Thats a lie so I wont respond to it any more

<font color=red>FACT - There were secrets sold to China during the Clinton ADministration. Also, China was sleeping in the White House, were they not ??</font id=red>

4&gt; He lied to the American People
5&gt; He lied to the American People again
6&gt; He was impeached
7&gt; He had scandal after scandal

Dont care about him lying about monica, It was not your or my business in the first place, and the only ones who did care suffered from Clinton Penis envy

<font color=red>I don't get that. You probabaly don't accpet yopur kids lying to you (even if its not your business) but the President breakig the very code that holds together our Judicial Sysytem (Lying under Oath) don't matter to you ? Odd thought process.</font id=red>

8&gt; The Democrats had control of both houses for almost if not 50 years and just raised taxes.

Actually this nation did well until Reagan

<font color=red>There is a trend that when a Rep is in office the country does poorly, and when a Dem is in the office country does well. Am I wrong ?</font id=red>

9&gt; He and the witch Hillary contrived a botched Healthcare system
in private without consultation or feedback from citizens.
10&gt; He lied to the American People
11&gt; He grew government at the rate of 8% every year during his 2 terms...Did your pay go up 8% every year?

More lies, the rate of national debt growth also slowed way down under Clinton. Bigger Gov. yet less National debt. By the way under Bush the Gov. has continued to grow

<font color=red>FACT - The national debt is NECCESSARY and has ever been increasing. It did slow under Clinton but that was a direct result of a booming economy</font id=red>

12&gt; He did not abolish Welfare

welfare reform that he and Republicans agree'd on

<font color=red>Welfare .... big deal, political lies to get votes and elected</font id=red>

13&gt; He allowed our soldiers in Somalia to be murdered

another lie

<font color=red>That is not proveable. Clinton is responsible for calling the action, but not neccessarily in how it was played out. There is a difference. Is GW a murderer for ever soldier who dies while hes Commander in Chief ? Silly point to post i think.</font id=red>

14&gt; He allowed our military to be run down and demoralized
15&gt; He persecuted our enlisted men in Tailhook Scandal

more lies

<font color=red>Actually this is true. Clinton was Commander in Chief. under his Command the military suffered and badly.</font id=red>

16&gt; He turned the White House into a Brothel

another fantasy of old elk

<font color=red>Actually, another true. Clinton succeeded in demoralizing America to infedility and because of his antics Clinton will forever be known as the lying President who was found guilty of lying to a Grand Jury and impeached.</font id=red>

17&gt; He entered the white house making 35000 a year as governor of Arkansas and never owned a home. Left left with everyting he and his wife could steal and book deals and now lives in a million dollar mansion along with the evil witch Hillary.

jealous? by the way, what did Hillary do to you?

<font color=red>I agree GA, so what on Clinton having $$ ?? GW is loaded and all of it came from his families wealth and silver spoons. Whats the point of this point ?</font id=red>

18&gt; He made extremely questionable pardons the last days of his presidency ie Mark Rich.

who cares

<font color=red> The same Americans who don't appreciate being lied to and sold out maybe ?</font id=red>

19&gt; His Vice Imbecile raised questionable campaign contributions
20&gt; His Attorney General killed innocent children in Waco
21&gt; His BATF killed innocents in Ruby Ridge
22&gt; He allowed uncontrolled migration of illegals from Mexico
23&gt; He allowed Weapon inspectors to get booted from Iraq

another lie, Also Bush is the one wanting to give citizenship to all illegal immigrants. Clinton was going by the old UN resoulution. Bush has not invaded or bombed has he? Clinton had nothing to do with the weapons inspectors. Noice Bush didnt disarm Iraq yet, and he has been in office 2yrs.

<font color=red> Boy, blaming everything on the Pres here, aren't we ? HIS Administration, yes, but HE isn't directly, PERSONALLY responsible for all that occurs. Held accountabel yes, responsible, no</font id=red>

24&gt; What did he do for your wonderful home state of WVA which has had democrats in control for longer than Methusaleh lived?

More that any republican ever has, thats why dems control everything here. Not many major corp's here so they dont give a crap about this state. Without that huge wad of corperate money being shoved in the republicans hip pocket, they have no reason to be here.

<font color=red>http://clinton3.nara.gov/WH/Accompli..._Virginia.html

Check this site out, guess Clinton could be given credit for all this, right ??</font id=red>

25&gt; He allowed the passage of Partial birth abortions...he will burn in hell for eternity for that

Actually Tom Dashle brought up a bill a few years ago that banned Partial Birth Abortions unless the mothers life was at risk. The republicans shot that one down. So the a partly to blame for it still being legal, It was all or nothing with them.

<font color=red> Why does it matter ? If its a baby, ban it. If its not, allow it. Partial birth abortions are rare, they are something to argue and debate on but in reality a PC move to stay away from the real issue of killing babies.</font id=red>

26&gt; Empowered gays so what
27&gt; Was Anti-Gun lie
28&gt; He had buffoons believing he reduced the 4 trillion dollar deficit when it remained the same. another lie
29&gt; He balanced the budget because Newt held his friggin feet to the fire and made him do it.

Newt left under shame, and held nothing but his dinner plate to his fat face

<font color=red>GA - what about the anit-gun stuff and the Pro Gay stuff ??</font id=red>

30&gt; he bombed an Aspirin factory

And Bush Bombed a wedding

<font color=red>SCORE for Gobbler !!</font id=red>

31&gt; He brushed aside Osama Bin Laden

If you havent noticed, I havent heard of Bush doing anything to catch him lately

<font color=red>I think this country backs what GW has done post 9-11. Hind sight is 50-50 as far as what COULD have been done, isn't it ??

Had to pipe in on this one. Attack GA why don't ya'll ?? Half of what he says don't make logical, reasonable sense, but half of what ya'll counter with is half bull too.</font id=red>

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Edited by - stealthycat on 11/13/2002 14:46:46
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Old 11-13-2002, 04:44 PM
  #56  
 
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Default RE: Bush Timetable

Here is the bottom line boys and girls.

People like GA and Shawn believe that the government creates wealth and economic prosperity. They believe that the president and congress through the passage of laws, can boost the economy.

Economics 101
Lesson one: Government is a net consumer of resources.
Lesson two: Wealth is created in the private sector. IOW, we are net producers of resources.

In light of lessons one and two, we can draw the conclusion that the best thing any government can do is get the hell out of the way. Our government needs to DO LESS, not more to stimulate the economy.

Here is where the president and congress CAN do something.

1. Eliminate the death tax.

2. A choice between eliminating the income tax and instituting a national sales tax capped at 8% or restructure the income tax system to a flat 10% from everyone. These taxes can only be raised for military expenditures and must have a sunset rule in the text of the rate hike.

3. Abolish all welfare (corporate and individual) and related programs such as HUD, Dept of Education, etc. If individual states want to create such programs, so be it. The feds have no business being in business when all they do is create a monopoly of services that stifle competition and market forces.

4. Eliminate capital gains taxes. I already paid tax on the earnings I invested. Double taxation is what started the revolution.

5. Allow individuals to opt out of Social Security and let the program die. My parents were duped into this lie, do not make my children pay the price.
---------------------------------------------------

This is the way this country was meant to run and was run until FDR and The Great Society bastardized the constitution to &quot;provide for the general welfare.&quot; Notice it says 'general,' not 'individual' welfare.

These things will never happen because this country has slipped so far down the slope that 'left' appears to be 'center.' 'Right' appears to be mean, cruel, inhumane, etc., etc..

So, GA and Shawn can call me callous and any number of things. Truth is I donate time and money to help a lot of people and would donate more money if only I were allowed to keep, invest, and secure more of my own earnings.


<font color=purple><font size=4>It never ceases to amaze me that the same people who would give an individual the right to kill a child, would not garner such a choice to an individual in terms of the fruits of their own labours.</font id=size4></font id=purple>

You say:If its not your pregnancy, Its not your choice

I say: If it's not your money, you can't choose how I spend it.

Time to grow up and take responsibility for ones own actions. Something your president never learned. I hope you do.

Blue

&quot;Liberals are tightwads with more than just mindwidth, unless of course you are picking up the tab.&quot;
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Old 11-13-2002, 08:54 PM
  #57  
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Default RE: Bush Timetable

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>That way you won't be held to question when he fails miserably? <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

Thats just wishful thinking and more proof of yet another democrat that puts politics before the good of this country.



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Old 11-14-2002, 05:32 AM
  #58  
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Default RE: Bush Timetable

Now how does bluesranger know everything I believe? Must be him consulting his astrologer or tarot card reader like raygun used to do.

Ha
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Old 11-14-2002, 06:35 AM
  #59  
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Default RE: Bush Timetable

I have been reading along and something that has been mentioned/implyed is how Republicans are for big buisness and the Dems. are for the working class.

First off, if the Dems. were for the working class why do they fight so hard for welfare. I dont like the idea of my money getting taken from me and a part of it distributed to the &quot;needy&quot; (20% needy, 80% dead beats). I dont mind helping the needy, but our system caters more to the dead beats than the needy.

Second of all, which party has brought big buisness slimeballes to justice ( Enron and Tyco ).


Along these lines, can one of you lefties explain to me the so called tax breaks the upper 2% get. I do believe the last stats I read had the upper 2% paying over 65% of the taxes revenued. Little unbalanced if you ask me. I keep hearing the Dems. cry about the tax breaks of Bush, but I have not had one yet explain or justify their arguement.

&quot;Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity&quot; Martin Luther King Jr.
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Old 11-14-2002, 06:53 AM
  #60  
 
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Default RE: Bush Timetable

From GA's original post:
<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote<font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
I am just asking how long does he have to show real progress? Passing laws does not constitute progress either, alot of gun laws were passed and claimed to be progress, when in reality they did nothing.

So how long does the president, with his congress have to show Positive change?
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

If passing laws does not show progress by your definition, can you tell me what else the POTUS and congress do?

And here we have GA wanting POTUS and congress to &quot;show positive change.&quot; Presumably he believes the POTUS and congress have the power to lift the economy by being proactive.

From Shawn's third post:
<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
I believe this thread started as a question, how long does busch have to get something done. Fair question. He has the presidency and the congress, and as he is held up to be some sort of heroic leader, it shouldn't take very long at all.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face='Verdana, Arial, Helvetica' size=2 id=quote>

Presumably, Shawn also believes the POTUS and congress have power to &quot;get something done.&quot;
--------------------------------------------
Since both of you used vague terms (&quot;get something done&quot; and &quot;show positive change&quot to describe actions of the executive and legislative branches, it is not totally clear by your statements, what area of the nation needs said action. Seeing as how you are both Klintonistas, I drew the conclusion that it was 'the economy,' stupid.

Please show me that I am wrong, and you meant something else. Perhaps you could elucidate on your vague statements and clear up this misunderstanding, instead of just proposing logical fallacies like &quot;{I}know everything {you} believe.&quot;

I know enough from your statements that you and GA were addressing the ability of the POTUS and congress to effect the economy in proactive ways. Again, I challenge you to show me that you were speaking of some other 'changes' or wanted 'something [else] done.'

Please tell us what you both think the POTUS and congress should do. Be specific. Your leaders lost because they could not be specific, perhaps you can.



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