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Republicans may be turning next election.

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Republicans may be turning next election.

Old 03-09-2006, 01:18 PM
  #31  
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Cal[/align]First off, NCLBs goal is to bring the lower level kids to a min standard in all core subjects. It does not address advancing the upper level to their zenith. That alone is one of my biggest gripes. It looks great that Bush cares so much about our kids he will pass a bill that candy coats the problem, but does not put realistic measures in placeto solve the problem. His plan is to fix the problem with a one size fits all solutionwhen the problem is dynamic. For instance, it basically implies that a kid who can notunderstand physics, chem, or math would never be able to do minimal work, and limits them because of. How many secretaries do you know who can find the resultant vector in a multiple vector system. Or why would they need to. But NCLB's says they have too. Just one example.[/align][/align]My idea would be, allow teachers to teach. Don't put unrealistic standards on them with kids who can not obtain these standards. Standard tests are not a bad thing, if used correctly. Don't hold kids incapable of achieving a higher goal, or who will not strive to achieve a higher goal, to said goals. Yet teach them basics, focusing on their strengths (which would be achieved through these standard tests), and usher them into vocational courses that cater to success in the real world. Get rid of the special ed system as it stands. Contain kids in subjects they are truly in need of help with, instead of placing them in regular ed courses they have no reason to take nor can handle. As it stands, this is the norm. Focus on their strengths and teach them a vocation. Allow teachers to have students in their classes that have the ability to obtain the purpose of said course. As it stands, we have kids who can not do algebra, in chem. classes. They are special ed in math, but are placed in chem. classes for social skills. I have seen special ed kids put in A.P. chem. classes, now how much sense does that make. Stuff like this puts an undue burden on the teacher of the course, who is forced to water down the materials for one student who has no need for the course nor can learn it at the true level. I, as well as some of my teachers, are forced to baby sit kids who do not have the base knowledge to handle the materials, and are forcedto make special lesson plans for each special ed student. I have had classes where I had over7 lesson plans a day, for one class. 1 lesson plan for the regular class, and6 separate ones for6 special ed kids. This kind of garbage leads to teachers having to ignore the upper level kids simply because the upper level kids can obtain the basics of the course with little help. Forcing the teacher to focused on the lower learners because of the undue burden they place on the course. Regular kids suffer as well because of the lack of time the teacher can spend on them. I believe these kids should be taught a skill they can obtain and use, instead of being placed in courses they can not handle.This is done regularlyin an attempt to keep these kidsfrom getting low self esteem. We been inundated with the notion that all kids can and will learn at the same level. You, as well as everyone here knows that's not true. NCLB is based on this premise. Ifthe goal is to obtain mediocrity, then NCLB is a great thing. I personally want to see my kids excel beyond the min. standard. I would also hold parent accountable. If kids have excess absences, start billing the parent. Joe tax payer is fitting the bill, I bet they would like to see their money spent better than on kids who do not attend school. Ill have to stop here. Ill try to add more later.[/align][/align]
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Old 03-09-2006, 01:49 PM
  #32  
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Now, this problem existed before NCLBA
Freudian slip ? I know the kids are getting hosed , but ....
No Child Left Behind Act
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Old 03-09-2006, 05:05 PM
  #33  
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Default RE: Republicans may be turning next election.

Last time I looked at a budget, the Feds provided less than 6% of the funding for Texas schools. Do you think the Feds provide less than 6% of the regulations?

I agree with everything Burnie says. NCLB strives to make everyone mediocre, and in shifts the focus to students on the lower end of the curve to bring them up to par, whileholding backthe students on the upper end of the curve until everyone else catches up.


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Old 03-09-2006, 06:51 PM
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Default A typical teacher scenario

NCLB is not the problem. Most of the time, it is not the teacher's fault. The problem lies with parents and the choices that they have made. The parents do not take an active role in their child's education, the techers have been essentially emsaculated as far as their ability to govern and control in their own classroom, and G.W. is going to solve it all by implenting a test.

The parents are too involved in their own lives, mom and dad got divorced and live 80 miles apart, and little Jenny gets to spend three days with dad and then four days with mom this week. Dad's got a girlfriend and a guilt trip up the wazoo, so he does not want to sit down and help Jenny with some homework, instead, he, Jenny, and chickylicky girlfriend go for ice cream so they can all "bond".

Meanwhile, mom's got two other kids at home, a crappy job that she has to work overtime to make ends meet, and chip on her shoulder like you would not believe. She gets home late, tired, and irritated. The last thing she gives a flying crap about is little Jenny's schoolwork.

Jenny is thrown into a classroom with 30 other kids, 1/2 of them in the same boat as she is. Add one teacher who is pissed because her class is too large, her pricipal is spineless, and her president now has asked her to do the impossible. Plus she gets to have onechild with cerebral palsy and another with Down's Syndrome in her classromm for three hours out of each day so they can be "mainstreamed". Of course, her two severly disabled students must pass the NCLB test as well. On top of this, her insurance premiums have gone up 15%, while her school distri ct did not get her a raise this year because of "financial problems" (of courese the superintendent got HIS raise) -- so she is actually working harder for LESS money.

If your boss came to you with a report that is as bad as these classrooms and told you to turn it into a working document that captures 90% of what you need, most of us would throw it back at him and laugh, and state that he needs to open up a job for Saintly Miracle workers. Yet this is what we demand of teacher's everyday.
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Old 03-09-2006, 07:00 PM
  #35  
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I used to agree Alaska. But recently changed my mind. If you ever have the opportunity to go to Japan, take note. They have a different learning system really based on wrote memory. They work great as a team of engineers but don't do well by themselves. But you want to talk about parents who are into themselves. All they think about night and day is career.

So whats the difference. Well I would say first differnce in culture has a big part in it. Things are slowly changing there however. But with thier technique of teaching, all the students rise up together, but none really pop out. Andmost are above average or better. In the US, its kinda a fend for yourself, and you always get a smallhandful of truely bright thinkers out of a graduating class. They made it by pure natural talent. Problem is we miss a few bright people we just didn't give a chance.

I don't have the answer, thats for sure, Just thinking outloud.


 
Old 03-10-2006, 03:24 AM
  #36  
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Default RE: Republicans may be turning next election.

I agree with all of that Burnie and it makes a lot of sense.
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Old 03-10-2006, 07:20 AM
  #37  
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Default RE: A typical teacher scenario

Alaska
Thanks. You either have taught, or know a teacher because you hit the nail on the head.
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Old 03-10-2006, 08:31 AM
  #38  
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Default RE: A typical teacher scenario

Burnie:

There are parts of the opinion you stated that I agree with but I don't agree with the general idea that because teachers have to focus on lower students, students who can excel are ignored.

Like I mentioned several posts ago, my wife has been teaching under NCLB for years (1st grade). I also have a son in 5th grade and a daughter in 3rd. My wife's brightest students excel and are eventually moved into Academically Gifted (AG) classes. But the lower students have expectations that must be met. I certainly don't mean to offend, but I think it's a bit of a cop out to suggest that teachers can't challenge all of their students.

The government's job (through public schools) is not to "usher" them toward vocational or any other job. Their job is to provide a fundemental basis of an education. Ushering students toward jobs is what they did in the Soviet Union. I don't mean to imply anything with that statement. But they did. The Soviet governement determined for students what they should do with their lives based on their skills and how they could best help the gov't. Many of our lower kids have been put into a cycle of not learning and still being passed on that minimum standards don't seem that minimum any more.

In NC, if minimum standards aren't met, then the school/class is reviewed to determine the reasons. Help is given to them accordingly.


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Old 03-10-2006, 09:07 AM
  #39  
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Default RE: Republicans may be turning next election.

Burnie:

If the goal is to obtain mediocrity, then NCLB is a great thing. I personally want to see my kids excel beyond the min. standard.
North Texan:

NCLB strives to make everyone mediocre, and in shifts the focus to students on the lower end of the curve to bring them up to par, while holding back the students on the upper end of the curve until everyone else catches up.
I can't disagree with everything that you fellows are saying. However, I certainly don't think those two quotes are very accurate portrayals of NCLB.

My wife is a teacher. My mother-in-law is a teacher. My father-in-law is a teacher. My mother is a teacher. My sister-in-law is a teacher. My aunt is a teacher. And observing their schools, I just don't see it.
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Old 03-10-2006, 09:16 AM
  #40  
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Default RE: Republicans may be turning next election.

a)progun, prochoice, or
b) prolife, antigun


I am progun, prochoice...............
Where is my representation????????????????????????????

Damn independent party, how come they cannot come through with a leader....
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