Overall Responce
08-19-2003, 08:00 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Avon Lake Ohio USA
Posts: 232
Overall Responce
I' ve read and listened to the many thoughts and opinions written and voiced since Saturdays activities. Those opinions have ranged greatly from loud objection to quiet support. Instead of trying to chime in on the various threads being generated, I will offer my own thoughts on the overall responce from our shooters and membership.
First the treatment of the man. Contrary to popular belief at the moment, Ken Watkins does not and can not make these kind of decisions on his own. He reports to the board of directors, and while his voice is heard, it is not the only deciding factor. Ken is the point man when presenting such decisions in public. That does not mean he has a responcibility to act as your personal whipping boy whenever you disagree with those decisions. Accusations that any decisions were made with regard to personal profit are totally off base. The fact that such accusations were made at all does not speak well of the intelligence or understanding of the accusers.
Communication..... before it can be achieved people have to be willing to listen. The attempt was made, the information was presented. Unfortunately, as often happens people have pre-concieved ideas or opinions and refuse to hear the information presented. In the heat of their frustration they often see things which never happen and hear things never said. The lifts were shut down and pools locked. The threat was lifted and mountain top activities resumed. Unfortunately the timing was awful. Fog had already greatly delayed the start of activities on many ranges. Some ranges were able to start nearly on time or with slight delays. Unfortunately, contrary to the " factual" reports of some, ranges such as P were able to start 1 group before the alert sounded. When the alert forced the clearing of all ranges, legistically the window of oportunity for Saturday was lost. Never was a sunny afternoon so sadly welcomed. The alert system, by the way, is a safegard of the mountain. It is not controlled by Ken, or the board, or Snowshoe personnel. It is controlled by radar to detect that which we are unable to see or predict for ourselves. I heard several voices state that " we should decide for ourselves if it is safe" . You just don' t get it. Unfortunately saturday also allowed the emotions and voices of some to be lubricated a bit too much. Sound reasoning is often difficult to hear over big, loud, and obnoxious.
Moving the shoot? Where is weather never a factor? We play our sport outside, and weather is a part of that game. Rain damped the game in PA, Lightning disrupted things in Ohio. This weekend the lights went out in the whole northeast grid. We could have been there just as easy. I' m sure that if we were that would have been Ken' s fault also. I spent 9 days on the mountain. For the week preceeding the event the weather was great. Saturday and Sunday we saw the clouds on top. Monday the bottom was socked in. Only hindsight can accurately predict the perfect time and location.
Could things have gone smoother - sure. I believe, however, that we the shooters contribute greatly to that end. Ken, the B.O.D. , and Snowshoe have a responcibility to perform to the best of their abilities to ensure a smoothly run event. We the shooters have that same responcibility. This weekend we all could have performed better. I know that Snowshoe and the IBO staff instantly began looking at ways to improve their performance in the future. My hope is that we are able to do likewise regarding our own conduct.
I am proud to support and represent the IBO in the State of Ohio. The constructive ideas and suggestions being presented are noted and will be forwarded to the appropriate personnell at a time and manner to ensure their being heard. The immature rantings of some will be treated with all the respect they are due.
Working to secure our heritage:
Chris Turner
Ohio State IBO Rep.
First the treatment of the man. Contrary to popular belief at the moment, Ken Watkins does not and can not make these kind of decisions on his own. He reports to the board of directors, and while his voice is heard, it is not the only deciding factor. Ken is the point man when presenting such decisions in public. That does not mean he has a responcibility to act as your personal whipping boy whenever you disagree with those decisions. Accusations that any decisions were made with regard to personal profit are totally off base. The fact that such accusations were made at all does not speak well of the intelligence or understanding of the accusers.
Communication..... before it can be achieved people have to be willing to listen. The attempt was made, the information was presented. Unfortunately, as often happens people have pre-concieved ideas or opinions and refuse to hear the information presented. In the heat of their frustration they often see things which never happen and hear things never said. The lifts were shut down and pools locked. The threat was lifted and mountain top activities resumed. Unfortunately the timing was awful. Fog had already greatly delayed the start of activities on many ranges. Some ranges were able to start nearly on time or with slight delays. Unfortunately, contrary to the " factual" reports of some, ranges such as P were able to start 1 group before the alert sounded. When the alert forced the clearing of all ranges, legistically the window of oportunity for Saturday was lost. Never was a sunny afternoon so sadly welcomed. The alert system, by the way, is a safegard of the mountain. It is not controlled by Ken, or the board, or Snowshoe personnel. It is controlled by radar to detect that which we are unable to see or predict for ourselves. I heard several voices state that " we should decide for ourselves if it is safe" . You just don' t get it. Unfortunately saturday also allowed the emotions and voices of some to be lubricated a bit too much. Sound reasoning is often difficult to hear over big, loud, and obnoxious.
Moving the shoot? Where is weather never a factor? We play our sport outside, and weather is a part of that game. Rain damped the game in PA, Lightning disrupted things in Ohio. This weekend the lights went out in the whole northeast grid. We could have been there just as easy. I' m sure that if we were that would have been Ken' s fault also. I spent 9 days on the mountain. For the week preceeding the event the weather was great. Saturday and Sunday we saw the clouds on top. Monday the bottom was socked in. Only hindsight can accurately predict the perfect time and location.
Could things have gone smoother - sure. I believe, however, that we the shooters contribute greatly to that end. Ken, the B.O.D. , and Snowshoe have a responcibility to perform to the best of their abilities to ensure a smoothly run event. We the shooters have that same responcibility. This weekend we all could have performed better. I know that Snowshoe and the IBO staff instantly began looking at ways to improve their performance in the future. My hope is that we are able to do likewise regarding our own conduct.
I am proud to support and represent the IBO in the State of Ohio. The constructive ideas and suggestions being presented are noted and will be forwarded to the appropriate personnell at a time and manner to ensure their being heard. The immature rantings of some will be treated with all the respect they are due.
Working to secure our heritage:
Chris Turner
Ohio State IBO Rep.
08-20-2003, 07:43 AM
#5
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: NEW BRAUNFELS TX USA
Posts: 26
RE: Overall Responce
Well spoken! Maybe those who were/are unhappy with the events that took place on the mountain can read your post. Ken, you are in my prayers. Take care and hold your head up.
Jeremiah 29:11
In Christ,
Joel Chavez
Jeremiah 29:11
In Christ,
Joel Chavez
08-20-2003, 09:32 AM
#6
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: TROUPSBURG, N.Y
Posts: 371
RE: Overall Responce
bluejacket,
Your response was very well worded and also expected considering your position.
The event scheduled for the weekend at Snowshoe was supposed to be the final shoot of a year that had seen other problems for many people. To list these problems would serve no purpose. The problem in the past has been and remains to be communications during the event for those involved and communications for all members as soon as possible. The breakdown in communications got out of hand when the message of the cancellation of the days shoot was prensented at different locations on the hill by emplayees of the Host site with no clear cut message or understanding of what the archers expectations were for that day. This is not a cheap event for many people and and when the message that the remainder of the event had been cancelled was announced many people with hopes and expectations reacted other than normal. The announcement in the minds of most people came from one source and this was just another disappointment the people were being asked to understand. No other event scheduled for Snowshoe Mountain should be more important that the shooting portion of the championship rounds. The shoot off is not important if all the shooters have not had a fair chance to compete. The extra activities scheduled by outside vendors has less importance than the event that people have paid for in advance, the World Championship. The target auction should have no bearing on the completion of the main event. It seems that many of the contestants felt that some effort should have been made to complete 2days of shooting in a 3 day period scheduled. Closing the opportunity for the majority of the shooters was not what most of the people who had paid the same entry fees expected.
Last year a similar unexpected event occured which was also weather related but it only made people who had qualified for the shoot off disappointed. I may have missed it but I never seen any kind of explanation of what had happened or a plan to take care of any future problems of the same kind.
The comments and replies of the people that were there are not entirely with out justification. Some of the presentation of these comments may not meet with our approval but their ability to relay such comments is the biggest difference.
The IBO and BOD has an opportunity to take a bad situation and learn a valuable lesson. If blaming the unhappy members and trying to justify what happened is the only response forthcoming then I can only say that we all loose.
I too am very disappointed by the abrupt ending of the scheduled WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP, and it is going to take more than one positive event to cancell this feeling.
Your response was very well worded and also expected considering your position.
The event scheduled for the weekend at Snowshoe was supposed to be the final shoot of a year that had seen other problems for many people. To list these problems would serve no purpose. The problem in the past has been and remains to be communications during the event for those involved and communications for all members as soon as possible. The breakdown in communications got out of hand when the message of the cancellation of the days shoot was prensented at different locations on the hill by emplayees of the Host site with no clear cut message or understanding of what the archers expectations were for that day. This is not a cheap event for many people and and when the message that the remainder of the event had been cancelled was announced many people with hopes and expectations reacted other than normal. The announcement in the minds of most people came from one source and this was just another disappointment the people were being asked to understand. No other event scheduled for Snowshoe Mountain should be more important that the shooting portion of the championship rounds. The shoot off is not important if all the shooters have not had a fair chance to compete. The extra activities scheduled by outside vendors has less importance than the event that people have paid for in advance, the World Championship. The target auction should have no bearing on the completion of the main event. It seems that many of the contestants felt that some effort should have been made to complete 2days of shooting in a 3 day period scheduled. Closing the opportunity for the majority of the shooters was not what most of the people who had paid the same entry fees expected.
Last year a similar unexpected event occured which was also weather related but it only made people who had qualified for the shoot off disappointed. I may have missed it but I never seen any kind of explanation of what had happened or a plan to take care of any future problems of the same kind.
The comments and replies of the people that were there are not entirely with out justification. Some of the presentation of these comments may not meet with our approval but their ability to relay such comments is the biggest difference.
The IBO and BOD has an opportunity to take a bad situation and learn a valuable lesson. If blaming the unhappy members and trying to justify what happened is the only response forthcoming then I can only say that we all loose.
I too am very disappointed by the abrupt ending of the scheduled WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP, and it is going to take more than one positive event to cancell this feeling.
08-20-2003, 09:54 AM
#7
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Stratford CT
Posts: 80
RE: Overall Responce
I think the general sense of disappointment is because many people would expect more out of a self-proclaimed world championship. Had this happened at a smaller shoot... one less expensive.... less time consuming.... less demanding... Shall we say, then, less than something expected and billed as the biggest and most prestigious shoot anywhere.... had it been less, I think less would have been expected. I wish I had felt the same way about the World Championships on Friday that I do now. I certainly wouldn' t have felt as pressured realizing that it was just an overblown club shoot with a grandiose title instead of a true world championship that everyone, including the IBO takes VERY seriously.
The result is that a tremendous number of shooters who came now have a different perception of the IBO World Championships than they had on Friday morning. And there aren' t many people who want to spend a week and a lot of money and preparation to attend an event that is considered a fiasco or a joke. If this is to be taken seriously, it needs to be treated like other sports treat their events. If the World Series if a game gets rained out, it gets delayed or replayed or whatever. The umpire doesn' t simply declare whoever had the lead in the 4th inning to be the winner.
Maybe if the official rules stated that whoever was winning with whatever targets get shot will be declared the winner in the event that the IBO decides to cancel shooting on a day for any reason, then maybe there would be a lot less hard feelings. People wouldn' t feel that the rules had changed on them or that the format changed without notification. But if it' s in the rules, I missed it and I thought I read them all. This, I think, is the real reason for the ruffled feathers and feelings of disappointment. What' s been done can' t be undone and the clock can' t be turned back. However, the IBO is, for all intents and purposes, a vendor. The shooters are, for all intents and purposes, customers. The customers complaints need to be listened to and acted on if the IBO wants to keep those customers. I thought I' d throw that out there and if you disagree, that' s perfectly fine. I have no interest in debating this and I' m not castigating anyone or anything. I' m simply trying to analyze and clarify my thoughts; for my own benefit as much as for anyone else, I suppose.
The result is that a tremendous number of shooters who came now have a different perception of the IBO World Championships than they had on Friday morning. And there aren' t many people who want to spend a week and a lot of money and preparation to attend an event that is considered a fiasco or a joke. If this is to be taken seriously, it needs to be treated like other sports treat their events. If the World Series if a game gets rained out, it gets delayed or replayed or whatever. The umpire doesn' t simply declare whoever had the lead in the 4th inning to be the winner.
Maybe if the official rules stated that whoever was winning with whatever targets get shot will be declared the winner in the event that the IBO decides to cancel shooting on a day for any reason, then maybe there would be a lot less hard feelings. People wouldn' t feel that the rules had changed on them or that the format changed without notification. But if it' s in the rules, I missed it and I thought I read them all. This, I think, is the real reason for the ruffled feathers and feelings of disappointment. What' s been done can' t be undone and the clock can' t be turned back. However, the IBO is, for all intents and purposes, a vendor. The shooters are, for all intents and purposes, customers. The customers complaints need to be listened to and acted on if the IBO wants to keep those customers. I thought I' d throw that out there and if you disagree, that' s perfectly fine. I have no interest in debating this and I' m not castigating anyone or anything. I' m simply trying to analyze and clarify my thoughts; for my own benefit as much as for anyone else, I suppose.
08-20-2003, 10:08 AM
#8
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Hepzibah WV USA
Posts: 313
RE: Overall Responce
I Agree it is not Kens fault the weather went bad but this makes it no less expensive for the shooters, IBO still made there money and the shooters did not get what they paid for.
I don' t blame Ken for the weather, I agree on his call, but I think he could have had a contingency plan in place or been prepared to return some of the fees. Snowshoe did, if you checked out by 2pm they gave you a half a day back. Snowshoe from what I have seen has been more than cooperative it is IBO that did not do there part in my opinion.
I don' t blame Ken for the weather, I agree on his call, but I think he could have had a contingency plan in place or been prepared to return some of the fees. Snowshoe did, if you checked out by 2pm they gave you a half a day back. Snowshoe from what I have seen has been more than cooperative it is IBO that did not do there part in my opinion.