herdhunter

just getting wiser? I've been reading down through some of the threads and have noticed that a lot of people haven't been seeing the number of deer that they have seen in previous years in PA. Although I think the herd has been greatly reduced I don't think they (the numbers) are at record lows. I'm not going to sit here and tell you guys/ladies what you don't already know, and tell you that you are wrong and I am right because everybody has different styles and different beliefs on how to hunt the ever so elusive whitetail deer. The first couple of days I didn't see near as many deer as I did in previous years and obviously the deer herd (as previously stated) has been greatly reduced due to the "assault" laid upon the herd the last two years but after trying my "traditional" techniques such as hunting close to feeding areas and/or rubs and sitting on the deer's normal everyday paths and funnels and not seeing deer, I began to wonder if I was ever going to see deer. I scratched my head and sat in deep thought as to what the samhell is going on here. After hours of pondering I realized that the numbers aren't the only factor coming into play this year. #1 the weather pattern has been an odd one to say the least. Rain instead of snow, 40's and 50's instead of teens and 20's, thunder, lighting and wind instead of, well, snow showers. I think this is the main factor. The deer are content with climbing into the thickets and just laying down and since it's been raining, a lot of people (not necassarily you and I) aren't getting into the woods and when they do, they aren't moving thus the deer stay bedded down in the daylight hours and move only at night. After realizing this, that's where I headed............into the thickets where no hunter ever really wants to venture. Well, that's where they were at but there was only one problem, I could only here them running away and never saw them and when I say them it sounded like atleast ten jumping out at a time. Which brings me to my next point. With no snow on the ground, wet leaves, and high winds, there could be deer walking 75-100 yards away from you and you won't ever see them. Infact, I kicked some deer out to my father and they had to run right past him and he never heard or saw them. They are calling for snow (maybe) in the early hours of the morning so if there is snow on the ground, I'm almost certain that people will see more deer.

cardeer

Like everyone realizes it depends where in the state your hunting. It is a big state with varied habitates

chickory

if they are just smarter, and not being shot, then that means our plans to reduce the herd (the essence of our mgmt plan) are failing.

And I don't think the PGC, who said they want to reduce the herd, is going to allow the herd to grow when they said over and over thier goal is to reduce.

Obviously you have not thought out your "they're just smarter" theory.

In a deer mgmt plan with herd reductions (and we are in the 4th year of one), you will have lower sightings, and lower harvests. It is after all why they call it herd reduction.

Heres a mathematical presentation to help you with the arithmetic issues we face:

less deer = less deer.

Get it?

rybohunter

The weather pattern is always odd. It's either too warm, too windy, too rainy, too snowy, too cold, etc. The deer ain't any smarter, they didn't start behaving different. Yes crop rotation/mast production changes from year to year and can change deer patterns as well, but in some areas there really are far less deer.

RonM

Smarter = warier , I notice in PA and W Va as soon as you stop your vehicle , before you even have to open a door they are scurrying away, which tells me one thing, roadhunters,jacklighters, poachers, whatever you call them are making them a little warier.

DougE

They're no smarter.If they were,we wouldn't be harvesting such a high perentage of 2.5 year old bucks.Besides,regardless of how smart any animal is,they still leave sign,something that is non-existant in many places.I went out for a little while yesterday.As I snuck up to the side of a ravine,I caught a huge buck bedded down on a small bench on the opposite side.My buddy hunted this buck hard all archery season,he has at least a 24 inch spread.Unfortuanely for me,I killed a buck in archery season so all I could do was watch as he got up to stretch not 75 yards away.I still hunted in the wet leaves until 1:30 and neer saw another deer until I got to within 200 yards of my house.Two doe stood there not 30 yards away but the shot wasn't safe.

I've heard every theory on why guys aren't seeing deer this year.So far the mast crop,weather,failure to hunt new areas and now increased IQ level are the reasons for less deer.I would say 4 years of greatly increased allocation not to mention 9 more days to use those tags has greatly reduced the deer herd.Imagine that,less deer does in fact =less deer.

ulysses

now if only Gary Alt would get that theory less deer = less deer and cut back on doe tags in some WMUs. Doesn't seem like it is too hard a theory to grasp for a DR. , is it ALT

White-tail-deer

I'm sure he grasps it, I don't think they have the energy to have different regs and season lengths for individual WMU's. That's what we really need micro-management of smaller WMU's!!!!

boysda

herdhunter
my experience exactly. spent two days sitting by a rub line & nothing. spent one day crawling thru underbrush on my belly-flushed 'em everywhere, but couldnt get a shot

PAhunterJEN

Herdhunter I agree with you in a way. I believe the other hunters in the north and northeast that aren't seeing the number of deer. They know their area - at least most of them do.
During archery I seen many deer. I kept a log of what I seen each day. The numbers were pretty good until later on after the muzzleloader and small game hunters began moving around. We had corn planted on the neighboring farm for the first time since we've lived here. So the deer here changed their patterns drastically. They were bedding in the corn and not in our woods like they used to. Once the corn was cut some of the deer (I believe the young ones) began to bed on top of this hill that is thick with vines and brambles. I began to only see very young deer. Where did all the adult deer go?
Opening day there was a lot of shooting but it has been sporadic to quiet since. I've seen some deer here and there but nothing like the last couple of years. It is not because there are no deer here. There is one local farm which I can see from the hill on our property. Most evenings there are from 10 to 35 deer there. Several of the deer are shootable bucks and there is even a 12 pointer which shows up sometimes. One afternoon I watched the hunters leave the woods from this property and the deer showed up a half hour later. They must have a good hiding place where they can see when it is safe to come out. Apparently these deer know it is not safe anywhere else.
I've run into several different hunters driving ours and neighboring properties. They aren't seeing much and I laugh and tell them to go check out the farm over there. They then know what I'm talking about. It is the same thing where we hunt in Allegheny and Washington Cos. You either see nothing or a herd of 10 to 20. And even then the deer are not in any of the usual places.
If you guys in the north and northeast have dwindling numbers of deer then no wonder you aren't seeing anything. What little deer you do have must be hiding in a really hard to get to place.
Well, one more day then I can catch up on some rest....