cardeer

I went to one meeting last year.I ask a question and he refused to answer it,Said it had nothing to do with the pa management program. I ask him if he practices what he preaches when hunting and most of all I wanted to know where he hunts for deer.public land or a private club he pays for.He flat refused to answer. the way I look at it a good leader would have no problem answering that problem.Why should we be expected to suffer on public land while the leader gets the best places to hunt and manages the deer the way he sees fit. I know what kind of property he hunts,and believe me you cant go there as a average Joe schmoe. I can be a politician to,If he lets me hunt on his honey hole I'll support him 100%.And he does believe in smaller management areas,he hunts on one of his own.

RLong

Why is it that we can attend his seminars....pour over everythng we find in print on him....watch him on TV when afforded....and if we still disagree with much that he is selling, its only because we are naysayers. Unbelievable!

What do you take us for Mark....IDIOTS? Don't insult me. Or is that that you actually do think yourself so much more intellectually superior to the rest of the states sportsmen? Like a few folks in the UBP do. I comprehend all that he is saying. And I see why he may choose SOME of the things that I disagree with. So you can stop the socialist mentallity, that anybody not on board with the current program is "part of the problem". We aren't saying we disagree completely with the man. We just aren't twinkledusted to the point of not being able to see just "why" in many cases he is doing things. And where some decisions could be taken in another direction....IF....and that is a big IF....he was actually listening to the states sportsmen.

mhogan

Boy Ralph, you read all that into my post? It was meant to encourgae people to attend his seminars. Will I see you at the 1/13 Harrisburg meeting?

Cardeer. I am sure he saw where you were going with that. I would agree it has nothing to do with management of the states deer herd. I am also sure many people have better places to hunt than he does. I don't think he got a chance to hunt this year at all because of the work he is doing for you or me. How would you handle a heckler in the crowd? When someone is obviously pushing for a confrontation, you try to put it aside and defuse. You came to explain a plan, not butt heads with an un-happy sportsman.

PABowhntr

Mark,

I also understand where Cardeer was headed and I think it had every bit of relevance in relation to our deer management plan.

Each one of us forms our own opinions based on the areas that we frequent. Mr. Alt is no different. I do honestly believe that if he had to spend one day of a firearms season with me in the area that I hunt then he wouldn't have the same view of things that he does now.

I do support the antler restriction legislation but to view Mr. Alt as some sort of martyr who trully represents the majority opinion as opposed to his own viewpoint based on his personal experiences seems somewhat ridiculous to me.

Am I an "Altite"? No ....but do I believe the man is the "antichrist" to deerhunting in Pennsylvania...definitely Not.

Frank

mhogan

Frank, the problem with your argument is that Alt's opinion isn't based on the area he hunts. Like ours might be. I think that is a stumbling block he faces and have asked that he address it. He needs to show people why they want the denisties that they do. Release the studies it is based on. Show what data helps them determine the actual DPSM. Explain why it might be low in one area and high in another and how we will need to move around a little to get the density more balanced. I also want as many deer as we can get healthily.

BTBowhunter

Cardeer, When Gary Alt was at our gun club for one of his meetings he did mention (at least one of the places )where he hunts as part of his talk. Maybe he didn't respond because the audience at your meeting was close to the area. Ever have your favorite fishin hole/huntin spot appear in a magazine or paper? One of my favorite wild trout stream was in a PA magazine and my best kept secret was overrun! Oh yeah, as I recall, the area he mentioned was available to the public but he said that a lot of posted private property is in the area as well.

To those folks who claim that Dr Alt is going forward with his agenda, no matter what, it doesn't seem that way to most of the hunters I know.
As for the majority of hunters disagreeing with his plan, I dont see it among the 600+ members of our club, not among the hunters around my home and not among the hunters I've run into in the ANF. What I have encountered is some concern about the new ideas "is that really gonna work?" coupled with an attitude of "lets give it a chance".
By the way, the October rifle doe hunt has been scrapped. I guess they must listen to the wishes of hunters once in awhile

PABowhntr

YYYYYaaaaaaaaaeeeeeeehhhhh!!!

<img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>...sorry, but that just made my day.

Now I am more than open to hear any other new ideas for the new year...

mhogan

Alt has repeatidly said he will not institute new plans without hunter support. He knows you can't do much without it. They will bring you and your plan down otherwise.

BTBowhunter

Hi Frank,

Me too <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle> saw it in the Greensburg paper yesterday! Now maybe the bowhunters of this state can come up with an alternative. Iffn we don't, I betcha we'll be facing this next year!

RLong

Yeah yeah....he's a Saint<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

I thought ALL those hunters supported him. Maybe....just maybe.....we ain't the only ones putting up a fuss about the early doe season? And MAYBE...he is listening at least a little bit......and heard it. But to some of you....even fussing or questioning him is out of line. Well....I beg to differ.

he is NOt going about this neutral like some lead us to believe. He got buyoff from a bowhunting group....and used our season to appease a few folks.....and chose our season cause he does not bowhunt. Maybe in the future if he proves me wrong....i will differ in opinion. but NOTHING done so far leads me to another conclusion. Sorry.