FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

The New York State Department of Environmental Conservation (NYS DEC) has
> proposed a firearms Big Game "Youth" Hunt for November 13 and 14, 2004.
> Yes, you read it right firearms in archery season!
>
> This proposal will allow 16 and 17 year olds to use firearms to take deer
> and bear during one of the best southern zone bowhunting periods. This
> proposal would ruin the last week and both of the last two weekends of the
> southern zone archery hunting seasons. The NYS DEC will decide by May 1,
> 2004 whether or not to hold this hunt. If the hunt is held this year you
> can expect it to continue in future years. Your prompt attention is
> vital.
>
> 1.) New York Bowhunters, Inc. (NYB) supports increased youth hunting
> opportunity. We have a scholarship program for young people going into the
> field of conservation, a youth membership called SPIKES, youth camps
> throughout the state for 12 to 15 year olds, an annual Youth Hunt for 14
> and 15 year olds, and an awards program for youth. Many NYB members are
> long time sportsmen and bowhunter education instructors.
>
> 2.) As a result of NYB activity junior big game hunters can use their Deer
> Management Permits (DMP) and Deer Management Assistance Permits (DMAP)
> during all available seasons. Because of NYB all junior big game hunters
> pay a reduced license fee.
>
> 3.) The NYS DEC, by its own license system, defines youth as those hunters
> 15 years old and younger. 16 and 17 year olds are young adults. By the
> age of 16 young people are well indoctrinated in their chosen fields of
> interest. Enactment of this proposal will not help recruit youth into the
> shooting sports.
>
> 4.) Juniors 14 years of age and older can already hunt big game with bow
> and arrow through out the big game seasons.
>
> 5.) The DEC understands the negative impact this will have on deer
> hunting. When NYB members asked them why November 13 & 14 instead of the
> last weekend before gun season they replied that "the deer need a week to
> calm down before firearms season opens". The DEC is willing to have deer
> spooked during bow season but they want them calmed down for the firearms
> season. Go figure.
>
> 6.) The safety concerns are obvious; firearms hunters, using firearms
> tactics like deer drives at the same time, in the same places where
> camouflaged bowhunters are trying to remain undetected...
>
> 7.) The disruption to the bowhunting season and the whitetail rut cycle
> are obvious. Once the gun fire begins all bets on deer movement are
> off...
>
> 8.) The law enforcement concerns are obvious.
>
> All in all, this is one of the most foolish ideas that has ever come out
> of NYS DEC Headquarters.
>
> What New Yorker's need to be doing is pushing for passage of A1099 which
> would lower junior archery age from 14 to 12 years of age, and A6752 which
> will lower junior big game (firearms) from 16 to 14 years of age.
>
> Contact the NYS DEC at the following address;
> New York State Department of Environmental Conservation
> Attn: John Major, Bureau of Wildlife
> 625 Broadway Ave., 5th Floor
> Albany, New York 12233-4754
> [email protected]
>
> Tell Mr. Major that this proposal is unacceptable. Firearms do not belong
> in archery big game seasons, it does not matter who is using the firearms.
> Tell him that if adopted this proposal will ruin the archery seasons that
> we cherish, the seasons we have worked so long and hard to establish and
> to protect. Tell him that young adults should not be entitled to 'special
> rights' by virtue of age. Tell him that this proposal calls the NYS DEC's
> judgment into question and that it will be difficult for sportsmen to
> trust DEC judgment if they continue on this course.
>
> To weigh in on A6752, and A1099 send your letters to your district
> assembly representative and to;
>
> The Honorable Thomas P. DiNapoli
> NYS Assembly
> Room 625 LOB
> Albany, NY 12248
> [email protected]
> WE KNOW GUNS AND ARROWS DONT MIX! Rich [:'(]

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

I know tons of hunters, but I personally do not know of any hunters in my area who are 16 or 17 year old Jr hunters. Will it really hurt your precious bowhunting in your area. Afterall, I hunt turkeys and other small game with a gun during bow season. How is me tramping around the woods shooting squirrels, grouse and shooting at turkeys going to be any different than a few ... that is few... young hunters shooting at a deer? Could it be that maybe you're afraid a youngster might shoot that deer out from under you? Personally, I believe many more big bucks are killed during bow season than gun season. Why is that, mostly due to tree stands. I don't bowhunt, you gun hunters are spooking the deer for me. How is that any different than a youth spooking a deer for you? In summary, I approve of all youth hunts. In addition, instead of us hunters starting petitions against other hunters, we need to be united. I don't agree with bowhunters hunting out of trees, but I don't go start petitions against you.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

One last thing. Thanks for the contact to our Legislature. I'm going to send a letter now stating how great it is to have Youth hunts and I hope to see more of them in the future. I know of a lot more people in favor of youth hunts. I'm going to give this email address to them to congratulating the DEC on a fine decision.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

I FOR ONE AM ALL FOR ANYWAY A KID CAN HUNT. I THINK THE BOW SEASON IS LONG ENOUGH SO WHY WOULD IT HURT YOUTHS TO BE ABLE TO HUNT

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

BY THE WAY CANT 16 AND 17 YEAR OLDS HUNT ALREADY?

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Coyote, he is against kids hunting deer with a gun while he's sitting in a tree waiting to stick a deer. I just sent my letter supporting this Youth Hunt, I urge all fellow hunters to unite as hunters and support this special Youth Hunt. They will be getting a lot more support on this from me, both financially and politically.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Yes they can - so why do they need a 10 day head start?


Why not the weekend before if a special season is needed?
The answer is:

If you wish to have a real, positive influence on youth and bring more into the sport, than you need to support (as I do) the following:
Steve

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

If I hunted in NY, I'd support RWK's position. Putting 16-17 year olds in the field with guns during traditional bow hunting days isnt an attempt by fish and game to encourage youth hunting, its an attempt to increase the deer harvest. If it was a true 'youth' hunt, younger hunters accompanied by gunless adults would be allowed to participate.

CattNY, to me, sounds like a jealous gun hunter who's pissed off that other type of deer hunter's (archers) have earlier chances at deer and longer seasons.

Why do you think that is Catt? Maybe because the chances of harvesting a deer with a bow is alot more difficult than killing one with a gun?

If you supported 'youth' hunts in NY, you'd be screaming to high heaven to include younger hunters. IMO 16 & 17 aren't youths. They shouldnt even be included. 15 and younger with adult supervision is the best way to go.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Duckmastor2 - Thanks!!!

Steve

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

They sure can...........just like everyone else.


This proposal is stupid on many levels. Primarily being that it will not draw very many "new" hunters to the field. What it will do is just give a bunch of younger guys the green light to kill deer before everyone else..........they would all be hunting opening day anyways, now they just will get an early start. Youth hunters are not 16-17 years old. Take some REAL kids out with their dad's and now your talkin'.

Screwing up the last 10 days of bow season is bad enough........not to mention the danger factor of young inexperienced hunters with guns mixed with guys in full camo. Just a bad idea.

I am 100% in favor of finding ways to get kids involved with hunting. This is just a dumb idea that's all.


As said already this is just another example of the DEC trying to figure out ways to eliminate more deer. 16-17 year olds will most likely be less patient and stick it out like others do for a whole year........they simply have a million other things going on. Giving them the keys to the candy store will hopefully help them take a deer more easily so when they disappear they take some deer with them.

I really fail to see the logic the DEC uses sometimes.............they are willing to gamble ruining the seasons for bow and gun hunters alike by throwing this wrench in the system............all under the veil of trying to help kids......which is not what this is about at all.

Just another reason to believe that the DEC wants massive numbers of deer killed every year.......period. The more the merrier.

I am shocked they haven't exended the seasons yet.........that has to be coming soon.

I am even more shocked when people can't see through the DEC's BS on some topics.


[:'(]

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

In CT, landowners can rifle hunt starting November 1st, whereas the rest of us gunners wait until the 3rd Wednesday. Prime of the rut...

Hasn't affected the deer or the bowhunting opportunities. I can understand the safety issue, but perhaps the DEC are thinking of mandating archers wear 400 sq inch of orange, or have an orange tag near their blind/tree?

With that said, I've already posted enough on the new NY turkey "youth" hunt", and how I feel about "special hunts" in general.

This one is beyond comprehension...this may actually increase deer herds, as the deer will be in "hide mode" during the "big" gun opener 8 days later...

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Here in New Jersey we have a single day for youths to hunt deer & turkey(shotgun) as long as they have the right permits, licenses, and have past the hunters education class, they also must have a adult license hunter who doesn't have a firearm with them. Any sex or age deer are allowed, and this takes place during the NJ archery season. At first i was concered, but after a few years, it doesn't affect anything, matter of fact i see alot more deer on this day then any other day, the kids can't sit for long and they want to move, or they want to go home.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

This is off the topic, but someone posted it was harder to kill a deer with a gun than a bow. I totally disagree with this. I use to bow hunt a lot. And I know of several other bowhunters. If you were to get an honest answer from a devoted bowhunter, he or she would say, with today's bow technology, killing a deer with a bow is simpler than with a gun. I know several bowhunters who take their vacation during bow season and seldom hunt during gun season because they say during gun season, the deer are too spooked. Anyone who has a little time can learn to accurately and consistently shoot a compound bow with sights with very little practice. I am a very good shot at up to 20 yards. Now, place me in a tree along a deer trail, before the deer are spooked, and I guarantee I can get a deer (a buck) within 3 hunts of 4 hours each on good deer habitat. You might say, why don't I bowhunt still? It's because I hate and afraid of tree stands. Bowhunting from a ground blind, that is more difficult than gun hunting. I agree. When I use to hunt from tree stands. Almost every hunt I had deer within bow range. Numerous times, I had deer sniff the tree I was in. Gun season, same tree, no deer.. period!

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

I THINK THE YOUTH DAY SHOULD YOUNGER WITH SUPERVISION. GET THEM INTERESTED

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

You may want to edit this. ;)

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

I'll side with RWK also. Get the adults to give up a little bit on opening day and teach the kids then. Quit being so obsessed with their own success that they can't put in a little time to set the hook for their kids. I would rather sit with my son or daughter and share that great moment of their first deer with them. I can give up some of my time to be with with them on that moment. As far as CattNY's idea of bowhunting being easy, you either were lucky with a bow and got a deer quick, or you're so scared of treestands that you couldn't pry your hands off the tree long enough to draw a bow. The reason that people embrace bowhunting is to see deer move in "normal" conditions, and for more of a challenge. This being true, alot of guys do hunt out of blinds, and stillhunt with a bow. Some with great success. Its called adapting to conditions. Being a bowhunter doesn't mean your "arse" has to grow roots in the tree. Bowhunters that do these things find a whole different dimension to the hunt. I'll give you that technology has brought the bow a long way, but be real. If it was such a cake walk, you would be out there with a bow even if it meant hunting them eye to eye.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Believe it or not, I can be open minded. Before I started posting on this board, I hated ARs, now I am convinced they might be a good thing. As for the Deer Youth hunt. I would be in favor of not giving a youth hunt to 16 and 17 year olds, but let's lower the age for deer hunting and have a one day Youth deer hunt with firearm, Saturday before Opener, for 12-13 year olds with a licensed adult not carrying a firearm. I agree with Coyotedawgs on this.
As for me being a lucky bowhunter. I bowhunted when I was 16 all the way until my mid 30s. The only luck I had at bagging deer was when I hunted from tree stands. Even being strapped in, I don't like being up a tree with an arrow w/o anyone around to help if I fall. I admit, bowhunting from the ground is a big challenge. From a tree, I don't care how big of a buck you shoot from a tree, I'm not impressed. Tell me you got it from the ground with a longbow or recurve, then you are one of the best hunters around.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

If you want the future of hunting to be bright, you gotta get kids interested in hunting first. Hunters gotta stay united, or the efforts are worthless. :eek:

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

I'm sorry.......I just don't consider 16-17 year olds that are allowed to hunt in the regular gun season already........kids.


You wanna get a kid interested in hunting?? Start WAY before he is 17 years old.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Lower the age and then give the kids a real Youth Hunt. I'd be willing to share the woods for a weekend with kids.

You have to get your kids out in the woods at a early age,and I'm not talking about hunting. Get the kids in the woods as early as possible and just walk and watch animals. Show them what it's all about long before it's time to hunt. If you get a 3-5 yr. old in the woods to scoutr with you and explain to them about nature when it's time to hunt they'll be interested and have the basic knowledge to succeed.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

RWK, So far your posts have been write your a reps so I can hunt with a crossbow and write your reps so kids can't have a Youth hunt.

I'm still against a Crossbow bill and have written my assemblyman to tell him that. Now I'm writing a letter telling him I'm in favor of both lowering the age for bow and gun hunting.Thanking them for the oppurtunity to take my son out next weekend on the Youth hunt for Turkey and explaining that they need to get more active promoting hunting to kids.I feel a youth hunt at 16-17 isn't a youth hunt. it should be for 14-15 yr olds.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Rwk, I made a post of this on 4/8! Plus I believe I've seen this word for word on NY Bowhunters website!!!!!!

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Catny, Man I'd like to know where you used to bowhunt, that you guarentee a deer with a bow from a treestand that early in a hunt! Personally I've been bowhunting for almost 20yrs, and I've NEVER found archery season to be easier then gun season. Sure the deer are not as spooked during archery. But yet you have to pattern their movements, and make your setups so get that deer to pass within 30yds for a possible shot. Then just becasue you do get that deer within range, doesn't always mean you'll get a shot. I've harvested alot more deer during regular seasons, then archery seasons. I'm also wondering why you gave up bowhunting? If you found it so easy from a treestand, and admit ground hunting with a bow is more difficult. Was that bowhunting challenge too difficult for you to pursue. Ever try still hunting-stalking with a bow? My preference is to bowhunt from a treestand. But I also enjoy a variety of bowhunting ways. I'll also ground blind, and still hunt with a bow. If we get some fresh snow in archery season. I'm off tracking down a deer. In fact some of the most fun I've had bowhunting is tracking a buck through the woods for several hrs.
But as I wrote in my post on the youth hunt. I'm not for it, becasue I can't understand why the DEC couldn't have purposed the wknd as the wknd just before the Monday opener. I fail to understand the DEC's reasoning. I'm more for lowering the age limit, and I've sent letters out on this issue in support of lowering the age limits. I'd much rather see youth in the woods bowhunting. Learning how deer are under a more natural state. Learning 1 shot 1 kill. Then starting out in gun season waiting for some other hunter to push a deer his way! I believe archers are the most ethical hunters in the woods, and teaching ethics is a must!

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

RWK in response to the post starting this thread....

Boy you sure hit the ground running! Joined 2 or so weeks ago and come out with a pro-crossbow thread followed by an anti-youth hunt thread.

Looking for quotes to feed the anti hunting groups propaganda machine perhaps?

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Buck Alley, I'm not lying to you. I believe bowhunting from a tree is simpler than gun hunting. I stopped bowhunting because I was scared silly hunting from a tree. When I tried hunting from a ground, I couldn't do it. I'm just not that good of a hunter to bowhunt from a ground. But, when I was up in a tree, I passed up several several easy shots because mostly I would not shoot a doe or a button buck. This was several years ago when killing a doe was a no-no. I'm going to try bowhunting again and force myself up a tree. Personally, I know several bowhunters that tell me that, from a tree, if you're not afraid to get up there, is easier that gun hunting (shotgun where I am from in NY).

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Cat, must be the deer in my woods are more educated then yours! I've been busted out of treestands more times then I care to recall. I've had to take extra special precautions to hide well in my treestand setups. I've had more deer walking around, and if they catch a single hint of trouble, they are looking up! I've also encountered several string jumpers in the past several yrs also. You should get back into it, nothing wrong with filling a doe tag, and putting meat in the freezer!

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

16 and 17 year olds don't make it a youth hunt. i say lower the age to 14 and 15 with licensed adult, and make it like the third weekend of rifle season.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

That just doesn't even make sense--even after re-reading this and the previous post. Everything is the same except the weapon. And if you do a search under the bowhunting forum, you'll see that nearly every bowhunter limits there shots to 40 yards--most limit themselves to 30 or less. Most responsible gun hunters can easily kill a deer at twice that range and further. So how does the shorter range weapon make it easier? Remember, all the other factors are the same.

And yes, I'm a bowhunter.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

DaveH, I was assuming that what made it simpler was that the deer were still in their natural habits and less spooked. Where I live, when gun season starts, all the deer congregate to the sanctuaries that are not hunted much (like Posted land). It is a lot simpler to hunt around the end of October when the deer are not spooked and in full rut than it is with a gun with more hunters chasing the deer around. I believe most bowhunters will admit they see more deer end of October than they do during gun season. I would agree hunting with bow during firearm season is a lot lot more difficult. Take care fellow Hunter.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Anyone who has a LITTLE TIME can learn to accurately and consistently shoot a compound bow with sites "WITH VERY LITTLE PRACTICE"

You mean to tell me I can just pick up my bow and what ever arrows I have on OCT 14 shoot a couple of times and say good enough and hunt.
Maybe that's what you do with your gun, But all the bow hunters I know practice all year so when that big buck comes under his treestand he can make a quick clean humane kill.
CATTNY do you have that dedication? Maybe that is why gun hunting is so hard for you. I really doubt you have what it takes to be a bow hunter that is why you are so jellous of us!

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

treetop, I belong to a rod and gun club and shoot my gun year round. Just like you say you do with a bow. I am a real good shot with a shotgun. I've even killed a doe last year with my shotgun at 180 yards because I know how my gun shoot. I'm sure I could whip you with my marksmanship. I am also a very good shot with a bow. I haven't in 3 years, but before that, I was in a bow league and held my own. But, since I am an avid small game hunter, I decided not to put the time in for bowhunting. Especially since my son now hunts and he doesn't have an interest in bow hunting. That being said, I believe, along with many other bow hunters I know, hunting from a tree gives one a tremedous advantage over deer. Like blinds are a tremedous advantage during Spring Turkey season. In addition to the advantage one gets from a tree (if you not afraid to get up one), and the advantage of hunting during prime rut and more leaf cover, it is as simple as hunting can get. Obviously, there are no guarantees in hunting. But, get me a good treestand that is secluded and along a good trail, you can count that I will stick something. Take care and keep it clean.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

Just a question. What if you hunt with your shotgun from a tree too? I've hunted with both bow and gun for years hands down guns is alot easier.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

I'm sure we could debate this for a long time. I've never shot a deer at 180 yards with my bow I need to get them a little closer.(that is the thrill)
One thing we need to do regardless of what wepond we choose, is to stick togeather as hunters and sportsmen and do what is right.
Gun hunters have the right to climb trees too. And the rut goes well into your season. I have shot many deer from a stand with a gun, many within bow range. So you see it's all in the way you hunt how succesful you are not what you use.

RE: FIREARMS ALERT DURING ARCHERY SEASON!
 

i think this is nutts[:@] we only pay more every year for bowhunting now they want to do this. what is this comeing to is it really going to turn in to another PA. yes the youth turkey hunt is great but not this a hope all of the bowhunters againist this bill take a stand we need to be heard!!!!!!!!