PA Doe application due
08-14-2014, 05:00 AM
#61
Typical Buck
Join Date: May 2010
Location: South East Pa.
Posts: 526
We have the drillers here too. I cannot complain about damage, but it did nothing for the local economy. We still have moonscape here from the mining and the drilling has not even come close to that. The landscape won't change much, but they may poison us with the residue in the water. As for Mr. McDougal, a lot you know about deer and their eating habits. The deer around here love to browse on laurel. The orange spots on laurel leaves is a blight that is killing off the older laurel. There is plenty of laurel 3-6 inches high under the older bushes. It may be coming up from the roots, or maybe seed drop. Either way, there is no longer enough deer to crop it off and it will probably get the blight too. Get a clue and stop saying "Habitat". The whole woods is dieing from one thing or another and it is usually a foreign introduction, not deer damage.
08-14-2014, 06:57 AM
#62
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 103
We have the drillers here too. I cannot complain about damage, but it did nothing for the local economy. We still have moonscape here from the mining and the drilling has not even come close to that. The landscape won't change much, but they may poison us with the residue in the water. As for Mr. McDougal, a lot you know about deer and their eating habits. The deer around here love to browse on laurel. The orange spots on laurel leaves is a blight that is killing off the older laurel. There is plenty of laurel 3-6 inches high under the older bushes. It may be coming up from the roots, or maybe seed drop. Either way, there is no longer enough deer to crop it off and it will probably get the blight too. Get a clue and stop saying "Habitat". The whole woods is dieing from one thing or another and it is usually a foreign introduction, not deer damage.
I actually have a clue.It's you and your like minded friends that have no idea what relationship deer play with the habitat.
Invasive species are certainly a problem but most of them are a direct result of having too many deer.Deer are picky eaters and eat the most prefered species first,allowing the invasives to take over.When the habitat get's as degraded as it is in so many places,it takes far less deer to continue to have an impact on it.
08-14-2014, 06:59 AM
#63
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 103
How Can Deer Change the Forest?
By James C. Finley
White-tailed deer, through browsing, have the ability to change plant communities where they live. The changes they can impose on the forest occur over time and to the untrained-eye are subtle; however, to those trained in forest ecology and other fields, the changes can approach catastrophic.
Deer, as people, have food that they prefer to eat. Deer food preferences raise concerns about forest health, resilience, and sustainability. Deer are a natural part of the ecosystem and no one wants to eliminate them from the forest. Rather, forest managers want to ensure that deer numbers are in balance with their habitat so that they do not adversely affect natural plant community development.
Forests are dynamic – they continuously change. This change is natural and progresses through various stages. As a forest grows and develops naturally, plants compete for light, nutrients, water, and space. As they compete, individual plants and plant species have different strategies for gaining the advantage so that they can win the competition for resources.
Browsing can shift the competitive advantage among plant species and where deer numbers are or have been extremely high, the shift can be ecologically devastating as non-preferred browse species move to dominate the site. In some cases, those species that dominate the site (e.g., ferns, goldenrod, mountain laurel, striped maple) become stable plant communities that resist successional change, tending to perpetuate themselves and exclude other plant species.
In the hardwood forests of the northeast and north-central regions of the United States, the extent of fern cover is increasing. Single frond fern species (e.g., New York, hayscented, and bracken), which spread easily by extending their rhizomes to occupy new territory increasingly dominate forest understories. Deer do not eat any of these fern species.
As deer browse on some plants and ignore ferns, the lack of competition favors fern growth and expansion. Once ferns dominate the understory they capture light resources that other plant species may have used, and small mammal populations increase under the protection of the lush green fronds. The combination of less light and seed-eating rodents helps to ensure that deer preferred plants become increasingly rare.
When deer populations are in balance with their habitat, their selective browsing does not shift plant species composition to food species that deer do not eat. However, once the imbalance does occur, and preferred species become less common, relatively few deer can ensure dominance by species they do not eat. When preferred browse is abundant, and deer numbers are in balance, the community functions normally. When preferred browse is scarce, and deer numbers are too high, then the plant community-balance shifts rapidly and, perhaps, permanently.
By James C. Finley
White-tailed deer, through browsing, have the ability to change plant communities where they live. The changes they can impose on the forest occur over time and to the untrained-eye are subtle; however, to those trained in forest ecology and other fields, the changes can approach catastrophic.
Deer, as people, have food that they prefer to eat. Deer food preferences raise concerns about forest health, resilience, and sustainability. Deer are a natural part of the ecosystem and no one wants to eliminate them from the forest. Rather, forest managers want to ensure that deer numbers are in balance with their habitat so that they do not adversely affect natural plant community development.
Forests are dynamic – they continuously change. This change is natural and progresses through various stages. As a forest grows and develops naturally, plants compete for light, nutrients, water, and space. As they compete, individual plants and plant species have different strategies for gaining the advantage so that they can win the competition for resources.
Browsing can shift the competitive advantage among plant species and where deer numbers are or have been extremely high, the shift can be ecologically devastating as non-preferred browse species move to dominate the site. In some cases, those species that dominate the site (e.g., ferns, goldenrod, mountain laurel, striped maple) become stable plant communities that resist successional change, tending to perpetuate themselves and exclude other plant species.
In the hardwood forests of the northeast and north-central regions of the United States, the extent of fern cover is increasing. Single frond fern species (e.g., New York, hayscented, and bracken), which spread easily by extending their rhizomes to occupy new territory increasingly dominate forest understories. Deer do not eat any of these fern species.
As deer browse on some plants and ignore ferns, the lack of competition favors fern growth and expansion. Once ferns dominate the understory they capture light resources that other plant species may have used, and small mammal populations increase under the protection of the lush green fronds. The combination of less light and seed-eating rodents helps to ensure that deer preferred plants become increasingly rare.
When deer populations are in balance with their habitat, their selective browsing does not shift plant species composition to food species that deer do not eat. However, once the imbalance does occur, and preferred species become less common, relatively few deer can ensure dominance by species they do not eat. When preferred browse is abundant, and deer numbers are in balance, the community functions normally. When preferred browse is scarce, and deer numbers are too high, then the plant community-balance shifts rapidly and, perhaps, permanently.
08-14-2014, 07:01 AM
#64
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 103
Mountain Laurel
Mountain laurel is a deer resistant plant that grows in Minnesota, Montana, Iowa, Illinois, Missouri, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, Oklahoma, Virginia, Florida and Texas, according to Oregon State University Extension. Mountain laurel is an evergreen shrub which reaches a mature height of about 12 feet and blooms with flowers in shades of red, pink or white. Deer keep away from mountain laurel due to its toxic leaves and flowers. The shrub prefers an acidic, moist and well-drained soil. Plant in a sheltered area to keep away from high winds. Mountain laurel can be grown as a hedge to keep deer out of the garden.
Read more : http://www.ehow.com/list_6513873_lis...nt-plants.html
Mountain laurel is a deer resistant plant that grows in Minnesota, Montana, Iowa, Illinois, Missouri, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, Oklahoma, Virginia, Florida and Texas, according to Oregon State University Extension. Mountain laurel is an evergreen shrub which reaches a mature height of about 12 feet and blooms with flowers in shades of red, pink or white. Deer keep away from mountain laurel due to its toxic leaves and flowers. The shrub prefers an acidic, moist and well-drained soil. Plant in a sheltered area to keep away from high winds. Mountain laurel can be grown as a hedge to keep deer out of the garden.
Read more : http://www.ehow.com/list_6513873_lis...nt-plants.html
08-14-2014, 07:04 AM
#65
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 103
lants that Deer Will Not Eat
(Most of the Time)
Shrubs Reported Rarely Damaged
Abelia (Abelia) Juniper (Juniperus spp.)
Alberta Spruce (Picea glauca albertiana) Laurel (Laurus spp.)
Barberry (Berberis spp.) Leucothoe (Leuchthoe spp.)
Beautyberry (Callicarpa spp.) Lilac (Syringa spp.)
Bird’s Nest Spruce (Picea abies ‘Nidformis’) Loropetalum (Loropetalum)
Bluebeard (Caryopteris x clandonensis) Magnolia (Magnolia spp.)
Boxwood (Buxus spp.) Mock Orange (Philadelphus spp.)
Butterfly Bush (Buddleia spp.) Mountain Laurel (Kalmia latifolia)
Chaste Bush (Vitex) Nandina/Heavenly bamboo (Nandina
domestica
Cotoneaster (Cotoneaster spp.) Oregon Grape Holly (Mahonia aquifolium)
Crape Myrtle (Lagerstroemia indica)
Again,if your deer love mountain laurel,they've already eaten everything else.Adding more deer to that habitat on't help a thing.
(Most of the Time)
Shrubs Reported Rarely Damaged
Abelia (Abelia) Juniper (Juniperus spp.)
Alberta Spruce (Picea glauca albertiana) Laurel (Laurus spp.)
Barberry (Berberis spp.) Leucothoe (Leuchthoe spp.)
Beautyberry (Callicarpa spp.) Lilac (Syringa spp.)
Bird’s Nest Spruce (Picea abies ‘Nidformis’) Loropetalum (Loropetalum)
Bluebeard (Caryopteris x clandonensis) Magnolia (Magnolia spp.)
Boxwood (Buxus spp.) Mock Orange (Philadelphus spp.)
Butterfly Bush (Buddleia spp.) Mountain Laurel (Kalmia latifolia)
Chaste Bush (Vitex) Nandina/Heavenly bamboo (Nandina
domestica
Cotoneaster (Cotoneaster spp.) Oregon Grape Holly (Mahonia aquifolium)
Crape Myrtle (Lagerstroemia indica)
Again,if your deer love mountain laurel,they've already eaten everything else.Adding more deer to that habitat on't help a thing.
08-14-2014, 07:21 AM
#66
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 103
We have the drillers here too. I cannot complain about damage, but it did nothing for the local economy.
LOLThere's no drilling permits east of center county or south of Luzerne county because the Marcellus shale isn't in the southeast part of the state.Take a trip to Towanda,Tunkhannock,Montrose,Troy etc and tell me the drilling didn't do anything for the local economy.You couldn't rent a hotel or find a rental property up there for 3 years and all kinds of businesses spawned because of the drilling.Quit while you're behind because you have no idea what you're talking about.
LOLThere's no drilling permits east of center county or south of Luzerne county because the Marcellus shale isn't in the southeast part of the state.Take a trip to Towanda,Tunkhannock,Montrose,Troy etc and tell me the drilling didn't do anything for the local economy.You couldn't rent a hotel or find a rental property up there for 3 years and all kinds of businesses spawned because of the drilling.Quit while you're behind because you have no idea what you're talking about.
08-15-2014, 09:32 PM
#67
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Southampton Pa BUCKS CO
Posts: 2,492
You still think the hunting is good,yet you do nothing but complain.Sadly,the habitat can't be allowed to be destroyed so the casual hunters can have more easy targets.
My son started hunting two years ago when he was seven.We rifle hunt strictly on public land or timber company land in the northcetral part of the state which has some of the lowest deer densities around.He's tagged out both years and was by my side when I've killed a bunch of deer.We don't see dozens of deer either.Most days we see a handful and he's never once complained about being bored or not seeing enough.If you take a kid hunting and they don't want to be out there,either you're doing something wrong or the kid just doesn't have it in him.When something is a challenge and a kid succeeds,it's much better and it drives them.Instant gratification isn't the way to teach a kid.
My son started hunting two years ago when he was seven.We rifle hunt strictly on public land or timber company land in the northcetral part of the state which has some of the lowest deer densities around.He's tagged out both years and was by my side when I've killed a bunch of deer.We don't see dozens of deer either.Most days we see a handful and he's never once complained about being bored or not seeing enough.If you take a kid hunting and they don't want to be out there,either you're doing something wrong or the kid just doesn't have it in him.When something is a challenge and a kid succeeds,it's much better and it drives them.Instant gratification isn't the way to teach a kid.
Hatchet Jack
08-17-2014, 04:42 AM
#68
Typical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Carbon County Pa.
Posts: 601
You still think the hunting is good,yet you do nothing but complain.Sadly,the habitat can't be allowed to be destroyed so the casual hunters can have more easy targets.
My son started hunting two years ago when he was seven.We rifle hunt strictly on public land or timber company land in the northcetral part of the state which has some of the lowest deer densities around.He's tagged out both years and was by my side when I've killed a bunch of deer.We don't see dozens of deer either.Most days we see a handful and he's never once complained about being bored or not seeing enough.If you take a kid hunting and they don't want to be out there,either you're doing something wrong or the kid just doesn't have it in him.When something is a challenge and a kid succeeds,it's much better and it drives them.Instant gratification isn't the way to teach a kid.
My son started hunting two years ago when he was seven.We rifle hunt strictly on public land or timber company land in the northcetral part of the state which has some of the lowest deer densities around.He's tagged out both years and was by my side when I've killed a bunch of deer.We don't see dozens of deer either.Most days we see a handful and he's never once complained about being bored or not seeing enough.If you take a kid hunting and they don't want to be out there,either you're doing something wrong or the kid just doesn't have it in him.When something is a challenge and a kid succeeds,it's much better and it drives them.Instant gratification isn't the way to teach a kid.
I for the life of me cannot see how instant gratification of seeing deer every day in the woods is good for hunting? I like your approach Doug, teach the kid to look at the Forrest and tell you if there are any deer in it. We as human beings won't keep going to a grocery store that doesn't have the food we like, unless we absolutely have to. Why do people think deer are any different?
BTW how are the horses?
08-17-2014, 10:53 AM
#69
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 103
You are the Best. I do nothing but complain? So you can say with a straight face that the low numbers of Deer in large parts of our state has nothing to do with the decline in our young Hunters? Just the facts Doug, just the facts. You are a GREAT Deer Slayer and your Kid has a GREAT teacher. I hope you and your Son have a Great Season!!!!! BE SAFE!!! Nuff Said.
Hatchet Jack
Hatchet Jack
08-17-2014, 10:56 AM
#70
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 103
I for the life of me cannot see how instant gratification of seeing deer every day in the woods is good for hunting? I like your approach Doug, teach the kid to look at the Forrest and tell you if there are any deer in it. We as human beings won't keep going to a grocery store that doesn't have the food we like, unless we absolutely have to. Why do people think deer are any different?
BTW how are the horses?
BTW how are the horses?