DougE

Please post a link where the PGC claims to know exactly how many deer are out there.They estimate the size of the herd based on harvest estimates.For years,the was no way to do that with elk because there was no season.The elk were also concentrated in a a few small areas of the state which made ariel counts possible.Regardless,those counts were still an estimate.

DougE

Here you go sproul.In 2008,hunters reported killing 2.44 doe per square mile and 1.79/spquare mile in district 10(Sproul state forest)with dmap tags.That doesn't include bucks and that doesn't include doe that were harvested using regular antlerless tags.It's also a reported harvest,not a calculated harvest.I think it's obvious that hunters are killing as many if not more than 3 dpsm in Clinton county.If that's the case,and the evidence points that way,there's no way you could have a dd of only 3 dpsm.Also,a large adult doe mortality is being done there.I forget exactly how many adult doe have been collared but I believe the last I saw,at least 175 have been trapped and collared.The last report I read,showed that less than 8% of the adult doe are being harvested by hunters in that region.Your doom and gloom stories about these large crews of guys combing the hillsides and killing every last deer just don't wash.

Gunplummer

I do not have to post a link to show the game commission stating that there was 38 deer per square wooded mile. When the bonus-bonus doe tag years were in mode, that statement was in the Pa. Game News and had been in the magazine long before that. Don't try to muddy the waters, if they actually used kill reports to estimate deer density, that shows they had to know how many deer were there before the hunting season. In the game news it was a stated many times what the deer density for the state was. That is the official publication for the game commission. Maybe you should subscribe to it.

RSB

At 38 deer per square mile it would mean there were more than 1.7 million deer in the state. Do you remember back in about 2002 how hunters went nuts when the Pennsylvania Game Commission estimated there were 1.6 million deer? Hunters simply went nuts and said no way were there that many deer and the Game Commission was just making up numbers. Now when it fits your agenda you want people to believe there were even more deer than the all time highest Game Commission estimate. What is up with that? Are you now saying there really were even more deer than the Game Commission estimated?

Dick Bodenhorn

DougE

Any number the PGC ever published was an esimate.They never claimed to know exactly how many deer were out there as you claimed.

Gunplummer

I never said what I thought the deer density was. I am telling you the Pa. game commission stated over and over that there were 38 deer per square wooded mile even after there were record kills a couple years in a row. You can't spread your B/S the statements are in print. Look in the back issues of the Pa. Game News, and you will see that number stated repeatedly. I am kind of curious, what state game lands do you two hunt on?

DougE

I'm not disputing that at one time there were 38 deer per forested square miles.In fact,I believe it was actually alot more in many places.What I'm disputing is your claim that they ever claimed to know EXACTLY how mnay deer were in Pa.They never provided anything other than an estimate.

By the way,I hunt SGL 93,77 and 87.However,the vast majority of my time during rifle season is spent either in Moshannon state forest or Elk state forest.

sproulman

first i would not be complaining with 20 dpsm in clinton,dont know where you think that.
next 3 dpsm may be HIGH.this is do to many miles without a single deer.areas i know and hunters i know and crews who give me ACCURATE report of what they saw for 2 weeks of hunting,that 3 dpsm would be very accurate.
big crews are not killing a lot. 1 know got 7 bucks and 2 doe for 2 weeks. other got 3 bucks and 1 doe.other got 2 doe.other got 3 doe ..
actually if not kids were along the actual count on bucks would be DOWN as they would have to look and count points....
1 crew actually saw more bear than deer,total of 6 bear.

notice i dont comment on areas or countys where i dont know what is going on.deer situation is worst right now than i ever saw in clinton county.
so now you have it.i am better than any fly over infra red deer counting machine and i dont charge.

Gunplummer

I agree, I really know the area I like to hunt. A decent acorn crop, not bumper, but decent and in late January there is nuts rotting all over the ground. Good ones, not junk chestnut oak acorns. You can get a bad year for rubbing, but not 6-7 bad years in a row. I am not some disgruntled hunter that comes home with nothing every year. Many a year I stop when I have what we need weather I have a doe tag left or not. If I get one in another state I don't use the doe tag. If I get a road kill I don't use the doe tag. I and others get irritated when the game commission and their flunkies treat real hunters like they are retarded. From their actions in the last 15 years it is no wonder well over half the hunters can't stand them. If that is their way of establishing a repore with the average hunter, I can't imagine what they would do if they wanted to snub them.

DougE

So you're saying that there should be so many deer out there that they clean up every last one.If the acorns were rotting in January,they were no good to begin with so it's no wonder the deer didn't touch them.