Pa Game Comm. Overhaul
10-15-2008, 06:51 PM
#241
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW PA USA
Posts: 7,220
RE: Pa Game Comm. Overhaul
ORIGINAL: bluebird2
RSB only listed two other factors , severe winters and a poor mast crop. Severe winters and a poor mast crop will occur periodically whether there are 8 DPSM or 15 DPSM. Under the same conditions the PS deer density will be higher with 15 OWDPSM than with a herd with only 8 OWD PSM. The effects of predation and non-hunting mortality increase with low deer densities so once again RSB was just blowing smoke.
RSB listed plenty of other possible factors. You simply chose to ignore those possibilities
10-15-2008, 06:57 PM
#242
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,879
RE: Pa Game Comm. Overhaul
You conveniently left out the fact that the habiata is still recovering and you also ignore predation. Of course, we all know that if Bluebird deems a factor irrelevant, it must be so
Alt said that the increased breeding rates and shorter breeding window would offset the effects of predation, but he lied. With a lower OWDD the effects of predation increase rather than decreasing.
10-15-2008, 07:03 PM
#243
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 175
RE: Pa Game Comm. Overhaul
24 pages of posts and nothing solved ! after 41 years of hunting just a few facts that I have lived thru:
Bobwhite quail - GONE
Ringneck pheasant - Gone other than a handfull of stocked birds that act like chickens
Rabbits - might as well be gone,not enought worth hunting (by the way,ever notice the lack of hunters on the first day anymore)
Deer - hunted 6 wmu and 10 counties over the past 41 years and have seen normal day in the woods go from 50-75 deer to less than ten and as fewas 0.
Turkeys-everywhere including 1 mile from downtown Pgh where they routinely end up imbedded in cars on the Parkway West.Have become more of a pest than anything.
Coyotes - What was once considered an animal from the wild west now populates almost every county in the state and kills more wildlife than anyone will admit.
What was once a proud state boasting proud hunters has now become a playground for the PGC and all who choose to follow their propoganda.
Wake up and smell the coffee will you guys.Numbers,studies,reports,findings,estimates,an d supposed facts can all be manipulated when and where ever wanted when the BMOC choose to do so.Absolute power corupts and in the case of the PGC,it's done exactly that.With no one to answer to or make explanations for, it's been a runaway train for years with the end of the line coming way too soon.Doubt that it's a racket,take a look at sites like basecampleasing.com and look what people are willing to pay to seethe few deer left. See all the smart hunters in Ohio !
Bobwhite quail - GONE
Ringneck pheasant - Gone other than a handfull of stocked birds that act like chickens
Rabbits - might as well be gone,not enought worth hunting (by the way,ever notice the lack of hunters on the first day anymore)
Deer - hunted 6 wmu and 10 counties over the past 41 years and have seen normal day in the woods go from 50-75 deer to less than ten and as fewas 0.
Turkeys-everywhere including 1 mile from downtown Pgh where they routinely end up imbedded in cars on the Parkway West.Have become more of a pest than anything.
Coyotes - What was once considered an animal from the wild west now populates almost every county in the state and kills more wildlife than anyone will admit.
What was once a proud state boasting proud hunters has now become a playground for the PGC and all who choose to follow their propoganda.
Wake up and smell the coffee will you guys.Numbers,studies,reports,findings,estimates,an d supposed facts can all be manipulated when and where ever wanted when the BMOC choose to do so.Absolute power corupts and in the case of the PGC,it's done exactly that.With no one to answer to or make explanations for, it's been a runaway train for years with the end of the line coming way too soon.Doubt that it's a racket,take a look at sites like basecampleasing.com and look what people are willing to pay to seethe few deer left. See all the smart hunters in Ohio !
10-15-2008, 07:20 PM
#244
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,978
RE: Pa Game Comm. Overhaul
I have seen the social effect also. Ive seen fistfights over hunting areas, Ive seen families quit associating with each other over problems caused by this sham program, IVe seen on the news not long ago where peoples hunting dogs werepoisoned accidentallyby people trying to poison coyotes so they wouldnt get the few deer left in the area, Ive seen people quitting in droves, Ive seen our management agency beg for money for last few years.Ive seen deer numbers and satisfactiondrop like arock.Ive seen the huge increase in posting land to prevent the slaughter pgc has caused, Ive seen the increase in leases And Ive seen the totally fractured no longer existing relationship between sportsmen and pgc. Ive seen alot more of the maleffects of this rediculous eco-extremeist hunter non-friendly deer plan. And the Audubon Society and a few others sit back grinning like cheshire cats with each trigger pull.
10-16-2008, 10:13 AM
#246
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: PA.
Posts: 5,195
RE: Pa Game Comm. Overhaul
ORIGINAL: fellas2
24 pages of posts and nothing solved ! after 41 years of hunting just a few facts that I have lived thru:
Bobwhite quail - GONE
Ringneck pheasant - Gone other than a handfull of stocked birds that act like chickens
Rabbits - might as well be gone,not enought worth hunting (by the way,ever notice the lack of hunters on the first day anymore)
Deer - hunted 6 wmu and 10 counties over the past 41 years and have seen normal day in the woods go from 50-75 deer to less than ten and as fewas 0.
Turkeys-everywhere including 1 mile from downtown Pgh where they routinely end up imbedded in cars on the Parkway West.Have become more of a pest than anything.
Coyotes - What was once considered an animal from the wild west now populates almost every county in the state and kills more wildlife than anyone will admit.
What was once a proud state boasting proud hunters has now become a playground for the PGC and all who choose to follow their propoganda.
Wake up and smell the coffee will you guys.Numbers,studies,reports,findings,estimates,an d supposed facts can all be manipulated when and where ever wanted when the BMOC choose to do so.Absolute power corupts and in the case of the PGC,it's done exactly that.With no one to answer to or make explanations for, it's been a runaway train for years with the end of the line coming way too soon.Doubt that it's a racket,take a look at sites like basecampleasing.com and look what people are willing to pay to seethe few deer left. See all the smart hunters in Ohio !
24 pages of posts and nothing solved ! after 41 years of hunting just a few facts that I have lived thru:
Bobwhite quail - GONE
Ringneck pheasant - Gone other than a handfull of stocked birds that act like chickens
Rabbits - might as well be gone,not enought worth hunting (by the way,ever notice the lack of hunters on the first day anymore)
Deer - hunted 6 wmu and 10 counties over the past 41 years and have seen normal day in the woods go from 50-75 deer to less than ten and as fewas 0.
Turkeys-everywhere including 1 mile from downtown Pgh where they routinely end up imbedded in cars on the Parkway West.Have become more of a pest than anything.
Coyotes - What was once considered an animal from the wild west now populates almost every county in the state and kills more wildlife than anyone will admit.
What was once a proud state boasting proud hunters has now become a playground for the PGC and all who choose to follow their propoganda.
Wake up and smell the coffee will you guys.Numbers,studies,reports,findings,estimates,an d supposed facts can all be manipulated when and where ever wanted when the BMOC choose to do so.Absolute power corupts and in the case of the PGC,it's done exactly that.With no one to answer to or make explanations for, it's been a runaway train for years with the end of the line coming way too soon.Doubt that it's a racket,take a look at sites like basecampleasing.com and look what people are willing to pay to seethe few deer left. See all the smart hunters in Ohio !
i still would like answer why on SGL252 best habitat in state,i think 15 miles long ,that you are LUCKY if you see a deer.
i hunt stocked pheasants there.
i talk to locals who hunt with me, very few deer.
you should see this place, ponds with water all over.
browse, corn fields,grass,acorns, wheat, berries,cover on and on.
WHAT A HABITAT to have for us to hunt,yet VERY FEW DEER.
hopefully someone will answer on that one, i know reasonand it is 2 letters than we are very well known last here in WMU2G.
COULD GOOD HABITAT BE KILLING THE FAWNS
10-16-2008, 11:06 AM
#247
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW PA USA
Posts: 7,220
RE: Pa Game Comm. Overhaul
ORIGINAL: bluebird2
Wrong once again. The deer in 2G have twice as much food per deer as they had in 2000 yet their recruitment rate is the lowest in the state.
Alt said that the increased breeding rates and shorter breeding window would offset the effects of predation, but he lied. With a lower OWDD the effects of predation increase rather than decreasing.
You conveniently left out the fact that the habiata is still recovering and you also ignore predation. Of course, we all know that if Bluebird deems a factor irrelevant, it must be so
Alt said that the increased breeding rates and shorter breeding window would offset the effects of predation, but he lied. With a lower OWDD the effects of predation increase rather than decreasing.
10-16-2008, 11:35 AM
#248
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: PA.
Posts: 5,195
RE: Pa Game Comm. Overhaul
ORIGINAL: bluebird2
Wrong once again. The deer in 2G have twice as much food per deer as they had in 2000 yet their recruitment rate is the lowest in the state.
Alt said that the increased breeding rates and shorter breeding window would offset the effects of predation, but he lied. With a lower OWDD the effects of predation increase rather than decreasing.
You conveniently left out the fact that the habiata is still recovering and you also ignore predation. Of course, we all know that if Bluebird deems a factor irrelevant, it must be so
Alt said that the increased breeding rates and shorter breeding window would offset the effects of predation, but he lied. With a lower OWDD the effects of predation increase rather than decreasing.
i have picture after 9pm of 2 coyotes trying to get a fawn/mother.this was on 9/25 on stateforestand.
only reason it was not 4 coyotes is because2 were trapped out.
i cant seem to find a way to get my info off the picture to give to btb to post,if i do you will see what is happening to fawns.
i believe that most of fawns are killed first week of being born, around june15th area.i seen 2 killed at alvinbush dam while fishing a bass tournament.
this is what i am seeing.
for most part, coyotes are killng mice i believe 95% of time andmost hunt at night.
i very seldom see them in daylight.
where there is adeer,you will find coyotes,no deer, no coyotes.
also, coyotes are using roads/pipelines to hunt,they cover MILES this way.
we figured that a male/female covered over 5 mileseasy in 1 night hunting.
10-16-2008, 12:26 PM
#249
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Southwest Ohio
Posts: 10,277
RE: Pa Game Comm. Overhaul
I must again congratulate you PA boys on having some of the more entertaining threads on HNI. I am curious though; lots of people are talking about how bad deer hunting, and possibly other forms of hunting, are in PA. However, is that just the case in some public areas. Or, can any of you speak from the perspective of private landholders or those who primarily hunt on private ground.
10-16-2008, 01:04 PM
#250
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: PA.
Posts: 5,195
RE: Pa Game Comm. Overhaul
ORIGINAL: Lanse couche couche
I must again congratulate you PA boys on having some of the more entertaining threads on HNI. I am curious though; lots of people are talking about how bad deer hunting, and possibly other forms of hunting, are in PA. However, is that just the case in some public areas. Or, can any of you speak from the perspective of private landholders or those who primarily hunt on private ground.
I must again congratulate you PA boys on having some of the more entertaining threads on HNI. I am curious though; lots of people are talking about how bad deer hunting, and possibly other forms of hunting, are in PA. However, is that just the case in some public areas. Or, can any of you speak from the perspective of private landholders or those who primarily hunt on private ground.
i have privateland but i dont hunt on it.
i did have deer but POACHERS,TRESSPASSERS,local yoks have shot most off.
all PUBLIC areas are not good do to just to much doe hunting.
privateland in some of southern areas of pa. are loaded with deer.
this is why most of camp owners dont come to WMU2G in deer season now, they hunt off their back porchs at home.
we get 5 times the bear hunters now than we do deer hunters here in WMU2G.
as for other game, rabbits are bad, squirreals are bad,grouse is better,bear is great,turkey is good,deer is bad.
but we do have nice mountains and fresh air,if you enjoy that, its great place to be.
clinton/potter counties used to be best part of state to hunt deer,m thats why we have over 10,000 camps in clinton alone but now those camps are being sold and used the most during SUMMER,not in deer season.
