$5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

It seems that the $20 million plus dollars the PGC already makes a year on licsence sales isn't enough, now they want to impose a $5.00 spring gobbler stamp on top of that. The bad news is that the NWTF is supporting it. I wonder how much in kick backs the NWTF gets for supporting the stamp? The PGC wants to take, take, take, but doesn't want to give, like allowing Sunday hunting. It want be long till you'll have to buy a stamp for each species of game you hunt in PA. Slowly but surely, the PGC is destroying hunting in PA.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

I wouldn't be so hard on the NWTF.

What would it look like if they said they were against the increase?

They were probably presented with something along the lines of: "We are considering an increase so that we can better manage the birds in PA. Can we count on your support?"

If the NWTF said, "No" ...well, you can imagine how it would look for them.

In my opinion... the NWTF is a good organization that cares about the future of turkey hunting and the young turkey hunters of America.

-DT

As far as a separate stamps... I agree. Enough is enough. Why not increase non-resident stamps? Next thing will be a separate stamp for every fish in our waters.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

DT. I agree that the NWTF is a good organizion, but for them to support a stamp is unacceptable to me as it will only led to further stamps and permits. With all of the money the PGC generates from license sales a year, there has to be enough for turkey management, as well as other game animal management. Like you said, "enough is enough"!! Soon they'll want to impose a stamp to hunt on game lands.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

How about easing up on the non residents it costs me $101. and that doesn't include bear hunting anymore. That is now $25. extra. We alo pay property taxes on our camp. There were 5 of us this year at camp for deer. and the week prior another member went up with 3 buddies and went bear hunting. That figures about $1,000. vto the state of PA and we didnt drag aanything out of the woods.We bought propane, food,papers , hardware, gasoline each way. and whatever else the camp,rrequired..... so ease up on the non residents

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RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

Notice it's a SPRING turkey stamp? Next it'll be a fall turkey stamp. Then what, a pheasant stamp? Rabbit stamp? Squirrel stamp? Oh wait, the fish commission cant just get by with a trout stamp and an Erie stamp we'll be needin a bass stamp, musky stamp, walleye stamp even a panfish stamp.

<img src=icon_smile_angry.gif border=0 align=middle> ENOUGH IS ENOUGH <img src=icon_smile_angry.gif border=0 align=middle>

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

I agree and have said that it will be just like fishing in Pa a stamp for everything.
I am waiting for the smaller deer units to take place and see if you have to buy a stamp to hunt in a certain area plus your doe permit.I don't think some hunters get the whole picture on what is going on with the new PGC ideas it is revenue now because they know they have to lure out of state hunters for the big buck because the youth of today is not automatically taking up hunting because their father did.They know they are in trouble in years to come so they have to get revenue from some where and what better way then a stamp from every hunter now.Like the trout stamp once it is in law it won't change except in price.How about two turkeys for spring if we have to pay for a stamp.Also is the PGC going to help the turkey population on private or public land I hunt I don't think so.Then why should I have to pay more money to hunt turkey on the same land I have been hunting for years only to hear that the game lands is the one that is being benefited by it.The same with the big buck issue why should I or other hunters I have talked to out hunting be forced to only hunt big bucks when we are just as happy to harvest a buck and still take a big buck now and then.It is for the revenue and maybe sooner or later all hunters when hit in the pocket book will see this.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

It is RIDICOULOUS. Let see, I have to buy a Fishing Liscence, trout stamp, and Lake Erie stamp every year. I have to buy a Regular Hunting liscence, a archery stamp, a bear stamp, my doe tag, muzzleloader tag, and now a turkey tag. That is enough money to buy a brand new gun! It is another WRONG thing our Game Commission is trying to do. I have said it before and got some slack for it, but I don't care, I am going to say it again. &quot;Dr&quot; Gary Alt and our whole game commission are greedy greedy people. Look at the prices of tags, then archery, muzzleloader and doe tags have all been increasing in price. Now we are going to have to pay for turkey so our Game Commission can get even more money to mess around with bogus ideas that have a low chance of working. Another thing is buying the antlers of deer that are killed on the road. I think that if you hit a deer with a car you should be able to keep the ENTIRE deer. You shouldn't have to pay 10 dollars for each point on the antlers. RIDICULOUS! God, the Pennsylvania residents on this site should be the Game Commission, we would actually get something done RIGHT!

Good Luck This Season: Buck Magnet
P.S. Only Chuck Adams can sit at home and see deer so get into the woods. =;^)

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

No offense, RonM... it's just that we are seeing a &quot;taxation without representation&quot; type of deal here in PA. Every two years we seem to get a giant wedgy.

-DT

ps-It cost me over 120.00 to hunt Md this year... plus everything that goes with that out-of-state hunt.

Florida cost me several hundred when all was said and done.

When you're not a resident... you really don't have much to say about prices. Either we pay them... or we pick another state.

Edited by - PA DropTine on 01/13/2002 19:21:08

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

PA Droptine, you aren't seeing taxation without representation. ANY license increase or new license must be approved by the state legislature. The PGC does not have the power to raise license fees or create new licenses.

Phil

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

State legislature wouldn't have to vote on it if the PAGC didn't bring it to the table... would they?

Either way... it's a wedgy... and until there is some better form of accountability towards the funds received from PA sportsmen... I will never be happy with the increases we are seeing.

-DT

Edited by - PA DropTine on 01/13/2002 22:07:33

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

I guess I am going to be the one to go against the grain on this one. I would support a $5.00 fee for a Spring Turkey stamp provided the money is used to either a) directly enhance the existing public land as a turkey habitat or, b) to buy more land for public hunting.

I have no problem paying more for the right to hunt any animal.....provided the money generated from such a situation would go to increasing hunter opportunity...in either land or time.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

Frank, I think most of us would be less resistant to the idea if there was true accountability with a new tag. The PGC hasn't really done that. For example , does anyone know where the money went from the tripling of the archery stamp? How about the muzzleloader license, what additional opportunities were brought on by that? Did the furtakers license do anything but add a few $$ for the PGC while putting off even more folks from harvesting animals (furbearers) that are being grossly underharvested already? I say, if the PGC needs more money, then let em take the scrutiny that goes along with a general increase. Don't sneak in yet another tag because it's easier to get through the legislature.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

I have been in favor of this for years. I think the biggest thing it will do is get rid of the idiots that parade around the spring woods from Sun up until 7am calling and making all kinds of noise and then go home. Messing everything up for the rest of us.

According to an article in the Pittsburgh Post Gazette, they want to use this money for several things. 1 being education. If there is one thing that Turkey hunting needs, it is educations for the majority of the yahoo's that call themselves turkey hunters. If it was legal to shoot these idiots, I would tag out every year. I believe the other items were Research about the turkey and mailings to the turkey hunting population in pa to collect more data. Here is the link, http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/o...moyerfeat4.asp check it out.

Edited by - pops423 on 01/14/2002 12:57:50

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

Like I said, GREEDY. I personally havn't noticed a bunch of idiots running around the spring but I am SURE that it happens more than it should. I have a idea though, why don't they just push this more in hunters safety courses. It would save hunters money and it would be more effective. We had one short movie about turkey hunting at my hunters safety course. All it mentioned was not to stalk a turkey sound because it could be another hunter. Just push this harder to the youth, and you won't have nearly as bad of a problem. I know that their is a lot of ways to hunt that my grandfather has told me were &quot;secret little tricks&quot; that I don't follow. Such as shaking a vine that is holding a squirrel nest. Taking pots and pans in the woods to do drives. The stuff that reflects our older generation, when you had to hunt if you wanted food. I know that I can go to the store and buy meat if I need it, but I would MUCH RATHER harvest an deer because I enjoy the time spent in the woods and I enjoy the taste of it more than beef. I just don't see the point of making the hunters much so much. I know that it costs alot for the Game Commission to manage animals, but they havn't been getting the job done. It just doesn't seem like the logical thing to do.

Good Luck This Season: Buck Magnet
P.S. Only Chuck Adams can sit at home and see deer so get into the woods. =;^)

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

&quot;Our only problem is with some of the wording in the bill. Right now it says the money 'may be' used by the Game Commission to fund education and research. We only want to see that changed to say 'shall be.'&quot;

According to that article... the PAGC will send out &quot;safety flyers&quot; to those that apply for the turkey stamp. It might do some good... but you know [as well as I do] the slobs will say, &quot;Yeah, right... I already knew that...&quot; and discard the flyer.

Like you... I believe education is key to success and safety... but education via newsletters and the such aren't going to cut it.

Anyone who has ever seen or taught an NWTF &quot;Young Jakes&quot; program knows the value of a hands-on approach to education... especially when it comes to safety.

-DT

Edited by - PA DropTine on 01/14/2002 13:56:17

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

If the last substantial license increases didn't stop the idiots you see in the woods, you can't possible beleive that a five dollar turkey stamp is gone to stop them? If the PGC can justify where all the money goes from license sales, than maybe I&quot;ll consider a stamp, but untill then, NO STAMP!!! There should be more than enough money for turkey programs as well as other wildlife programs from the last major increase in license fees.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

DT Gotta tell you, the JAKES program is the greatest! My two sons wait all year for JAKES day. Does the PGC foot any of that bill? I was under the impression it was the NWTF and the NRA paying for it.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

I agree with you guys as well. Being from NYS, I would like to see a two bird spring limit and being able to hunt on sundays as well in your state, then I wouldn't mind paying extra for a turkey permit. Until that happens, I would be against it!!

Edited by - maytom on 01/15/2002 07:15:03

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

They tried this about 15yrs or so back in PA. Some PGC officers came to our local chapter NWTF meeting and proposed the idea for a $10 spring turkey stamp. When asked if the money was going to fund turkey research and further the sport they said no, the money would go into their general fund.

Errrrrrrrt! Wrong answer. We would not give them our support...

Check into the program proposal before you cut throats or blindly back...I suppose that if the NWTF national is backing it they checked into it and should be able to give good reason to do so.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

I too believe that education is the key. The problem is there is not enough time to teach all of that in one 2 day session. I think a seperate 1 or 2 day course would be ideal. I would even be willing to pay for the class.

As far as the increase, I believe it is like anything else, prices go up over time. Pa is still one of the cheapest states to hunt in.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

Cyclone is right...before we spout off without the education on the matter perhaps first you should research it. With talking with one of the PA chapter presidents' of the NWTF, they backed this stamp and I agree with it because the monies will go towards the birds. PA wouldn't be where it is with turkeys and turkey hunting without the NWTF and they (PGC) are not going to jeopardize their relationship with them for a chance at more money. In this case, the little extra money out of your pocket is going to the birds, if you don't hunt them, don't buy it. I think this will help the populations too by cutting out the weekend warrior who happens to shoot a bird by chance especially if they make it mandatory for a fall tag. I wouldn't care if our resident fee's went upward of $100, it's still cheap entertainment, a passion I'll never forgo and I've spent a heck of a lot more for less of a good thing.

DT, I teach at local Jakes programs and even tho I have no children, the reward was incredible with those youngsters. Well said.

Edited by - Rob/PA Bowyer on 01/16/2002 22:25:49

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

Im ok with the money going to the birds but the PGC says MAY be used for... Their history here is dismal. Where did furtaker tag money go? not to furbearers Did the tripling of the archery fees go to archery, I think not. How much of the bear $$ goes directly to bear programs? certainly not all of it. I would happily get off of more money if the PGC was a bit more accountable.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

BTB, I absolutely agree with you. Accoutability is a need, we all know that but unfortunately for trappers, bear hunters and archery hunters, the PGC doesn't work hand in hand with them like the NWTF. We need to support the NWTF and quality organizations such as them. They do more for the PA turkey than the PGC and I trust their backing of a stamp.

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

The NWTF is a great organization and they have helped the turkey population in Pa. I agree I don't the the PGC will mess that relationship up.

but here is a question, with the extra money from furtakers, archery and bear licenses, what did everyone expect them to do to help those special interest groups?? I am an archery hunter and I don't know what that extra money could have been spent on to benefit me as an archer. Just curious???

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

What about those of us that aren't diehard turkey hunters? Why should I pay $5 more to hunt a bird that I can only hunt a couple days a year? The cost of liscence is already too high. I pay $16 for an archery tag, but I don't have any benefit from it. I'm allowed to hunt with a bow in a season designated to me...and muzzy hunters and small game hunters...and old & young doe hunters. Why pay more for nothing?

I saw somewhere that a pheasant stamp was in the workings...should I buy that to shoot one by chance on a small game outing?

RE: $5.00 PA spring gobbler stamp
 

I agree that the NWTF is an organization who has earned our respect. It just bothers me that the PGC has taken the cowardly route to gain increased fees. they hit the smaller groups one at a time instead of facing the accountability hurdles that come with a general license increase.

BTW just read a 1-15-02 PGC press release. They want a pheasant stamp now too!

Edited by - BTBOWHUNTER on 01/17/2002 10:53:38