Where did the Deer go?
 

I have been camping in the Quaker Run area of Allegany State Park for over 25 years. Each and every year that we have camped there I have seen 20 - 30 deer each day, not specifically looking for them, just while taking casual walks/hikes. We have always gone there over the 4th of July Holiday (so its during the same time of the year), but this year didn't see one deer or any sign of them. The park has posted signs all over the are about bears because of too many bear-human encounters and are trying to educate the campers to avoid confrontations with them. Does anyone think that the over population in the area of the bears and caused a decline of the deer herd?

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

We reduced the population of deer in PA. You will see less deer.

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

I would tend to agree with T on this one. We have drastically reduced deer numbers in some areas of the state. It wouldn't surprise me if the deer density in that area is way down.

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

I too am familiar with the Quaker area and yes there are few sightings. If you get off the beaten path you will see all types of sign though. As far as this year goes your best sighting of wildlife will be the sow with 3 cubs, but wath out last years sow with 2 cubs was very testy.

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

The doe hunters have reduced the herd, especially in any state park lands. My neighborand his 2 sons took 15 deer last year, with bonus tags. Unfortunately, many were button bucks. I hope they truly consume that which they have taken. Seems like more than one household could make use of in a year.

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

I had neighbors that did the same as yours for a couple of years but last year they came back empty handed and complaining that they didn't see any deer, wonder why?

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

The past few winters before this one were pretty bad, and many areas had poor acorn crops fora few years in a row, all while doe seasons and bag limits were liberalized. Seems the whole WV, western Maryland and PA areas have suffered big losses in the herd the past few years.

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

I don't understand this. MD has greatly increased it's doe harvest over the past 5 years. We're allowed--and encouraged - to take does and can take up to 10 does with each weapon. That's 30 does and 6 bucks allowed. In 5 counties, we're allowed unlimited does. We're not experiencing any problems here with lack of deer and our seasons last longer and allow us to take far more than you're allowed in PA. Why is it that the sightings have gone done so much in PA? Can it be that the deer have adapted to this and are more secretive, have moved deeper into restricted areas and/or are more nocturnal? I'd like to know since the increased harvest of does here hasn't hurt our deer numbers, yet I continue to hear about it in PA?

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

Dave, PA has many more hunters and public land than MD. These facts added to very liberal doe tag allotments, two relativley bad winters, and poor mast crop production during these past few years has taken a toll. It isn't all happening because of any one of these factors, but all combined make a big difference. FWIW, the deer populations in areas where hunting access is very limited(suburban areas, all or almost all private land closed to hunting) are booming out of control and there is really no way to stop it.

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

Add to that the burgeoning coywolf population that loves to snack on fresh dropped fawns each spring and that isn't shy about tackling a mature deer for fun now and again.

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

I just remebered that last spring I was down there fishing in the park- a remote part not near the camping areas and I found a big pile of fresh deer skins. In april after a long hard winter these hides looked pretty good, so I could only assume the worst! IMO everyone hunts in centralized areas like where they spotted the big-un with the light the night before. That does not really matter either way because I can then go to other areas and expect to see no one.

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

Jason--I no doubt concur that there are far more hunters in PA than MD, but PA is also MUCH LARGER in total land mass which probably makes the "hunter density" work out to something similar. I've heard and seen both sides of the ARR argument and I understand both sides. However, I think that in the long run, the result will be more big bucks out there to harvest. I'd like to see MD impose some sort of ARR regs so the little ones get the chance to get some size to them before they get blasted.

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

Wny Hunter,

I am a regular at Alleghany State Park and I own land just a few miles away from the park. I to have noticed a decline in the deer population in the park. I been talking to quite a few people on the subject from park rangers to fellow hunters and it appears the 2003-2004 winter which was extremely cold had the most impact. Compound that with deep snows which lasted late into the spring that year and they had a high winter kill mortality. The high doe take in the park the during 2003 season also had a significant factor. The park is a separate DMU by itself and as it appears now that DMU will not be issuing any doe permits this year. My land is about 4 miles from the park in DMU9R and it was hit just as hard but didn't have quite the loss as the park. In 9R there is a less than 1 in 3 chance of getting a doe permit for 2005.

http://www.dec.state.ny.us/website/dfwmr/license/dmpchances.html

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

Ditto.... My wife's cousin, hunts with his son and a buddy. For at least three years all three of them have taken theapproach "brown and down". They killyearlings, button bucks, does, spikes(his son is a youth sohe can tag any small buck). Then last year they were all complaining that they didn't see any deer and wonderingwhy....They dont want to hear the fact that they are allowed to pass on a deer and dont have to shoot everything they see. It's hunter's (and i use that term loosely in this case) like this that combined with the two week doe season just putting a major impact on the deer population in PA.

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

I beg to differ, I eat venison 3-4 times a week and my family would easily eat 15 or more deer, and probably in alot less than a year. Whether you agree or disagree with the amount of doe permits given, I don't think any blame lays with fellow hunters who happen to be more successful in filling their freezers...

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

Yes killing and eating 15 deer per household is not to blame.

Yes that makes a lot of sense.

14 deer * 50 lbs / 52 weeks = 13.5lbs per week.

They probably threw away 10 deer.

I have seen the slaughter and I also have seen the deer laying at the landfills the day after the season. I am personally buying every tag I can for my WMU and no doe will be tagged.

Last year I had 3 doe tags None filled except for a great 9-pointer.

RE: Where did the Deer go?
 

Chip, way to get your attitude across with your first post.... And just because you don't kill many deer why knock those who do by saying they waste the meat? And have you reported the deer carcasses at the landfill to the DNR, or did you decide not to take any action.....

I guess it doesn't matter, right? I mean, you "got you buck" last year, and thats the only important thing.....