RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I see what you are saying, but two more current issues come to the forefront:
[ol][*]The DNR had INCREASED the number of units on the Earn-a-Buck "watchlist" for 2009 supposedly because the deer population was HIGHER than last year in most units.[*]The above notwithstanding, the harvest this year was 20% lower than last year, despite weather being reasonable, and slightly more licenses being sold than in 2007.[/ol]
The bottom line is that the DNR grossly overestimated the deer population this year, and is now facing a backlash due to setting the expectation among hunters that there were a lot more deer out there.

...and frankly, they deserve the backlash by missing out on the population estimate by such a wide margin.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

we cant even compare numbers of deer shot years ago we couldent shoot does like we can now days compare buck harvest to buck harvest of this year and the old days back years ago buck were the main sex of the of deer killed not doe

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

People could have killed doe years ago, but they chose not to in many cases. This caused a huge increase in numbers, and EAB needed to be put in place.
I'm sure the DNR will look at this years harvest, along with the herd counts, and what this winter is like. My guess is there will be fewer EAB , and/or early seasons may be eliminated in some areas.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

How bout an early muzzleloader season!!!

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I hope so. Actually, I have less of an issue with EAB than I do with the October antlerless hunts. Even there, the DNR was pushed...kicking and screaming...to move them towards the middle of the month and away from the prime, early rut late October timeframe. At least now it does not take away some of the best bowhunting time available.

Time will tell...

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

come over to michigan, there are a ton of deer, good deer also. tags over the counter are no problem and affordable. You want to hunt lower michigan, Grand Rapids on down to the state line. Very good herd and getting better!

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

What good do you think an early muzzle loader will do when there are no deer????

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

New report came out on 12-9-08. Typical DNR....blame the hunters. According to them, there are plenty of deer...we as hunters are not trying hard enough!

Wardens: Interest In Deer Hunting Waned
Wardens Issue Report Tuesday


MADISON, Wis. -- There might be another reason hunters killed fewer deer during Wisconsin's traditional gun hunt -- the hunters themselves.
State wardens said in a report issued Tuesday that hunters spent only three or four hours at time in the woods and might have hunted only a few days out of the 9-day season.
They said hunting dropped off on the Sunday of opening weekend and didn't pick up for the rest of the season. They also reported fewer large groups of hunters, fewer people at deer camps, fewer youth hunters and fewer deer drives than in years past.
According to the report, the state sold 642,419 gun deer licenses, up 987 from 2007. But hunters killed 276,985 deer, down 19 percent from last year.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I think the only way the DNR can insult hunters more now is to walk up to each one individually and spit in there face. Illinois just got better with the arrest of Blago. I hope the WDNR gets a boost somehow as well!

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I am not surprised at all that the dnr is saying this. And they might be right about people not hunting after opening weekend. But from talking to all of the hunters I know: the reason is they didn't want to contribute to the problem of wiping out the deer herd. If the numbers are down why shoot more deer. I just hope we can stick together and get the idiots in madison to actually think what is best for the hunters (the dnrs source of funds) and the deer. As much as I wouldn't want to do it if we all skipped one season if they don't stop this whole "herd control" non-sense they would be crippled. But it would take everyone doing it!!! I guess we will have to show up to the spring meetings, let them know how we feel and go from there.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Sure they are...it has ALWAYS been that way. Many more people hunt opening weekend than during the week. DUH! For the DNR to try to make this an excuse it ridiculous. Same with the "people don't do drives as much" argument. True as well, but that also has been true for years.

The problems specific to this year are:
[ol][*]The DNR greatly overestimated the deer population.[*]By overestimating, they also set the expectation among hunters to expect seeing many, many deer and having ample harvest opportunities.[/ol]
Given how winter has started off here (around Milwaukee we have about 16 inches of snow on the ground) I find it difficult to believe (barring a big warm up) that this winter will be any more amenable to a big increase in the deer herd next season. So, if the DNR does not want to further alienate hunters, they better be very, VERY careful about placing units into EAB next season.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

You are absolutely right tjd. It will be interesting to hear what they come up with for the units next year. I think there is enough of discusted hunters that they will listen. I know in our area (eab) all of the hunting groups hunt the same way they always have. The dnr is just backpeddling and trying to set us up for one of their record deer numbers counts again in the spring. What a joke!!!!

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I've hunted deer in Wisconsin for more years then I care to count. I lived through the times when it was buck only in my area or remember the four man party tags? I am also a land owner. I do not allow does shot on my property. Yet there were no deer spotted on my land. I did not shoot the herd off at my place. So who did?

IMO the DNR made a concentrated effort to eradicate the deer herd. They have done this through scare tactics warning us of the need to end CWD, and this earn a buck was just crazy. When all I want is one deer for the freezer, why would I want to hunt a doe?They forced me to shoot a doe. Even though a buck is what I wanted to hunt.

And I do blame Wisconsin hunters a little. Some during the past years would brag.I would listen to them brag about the number of doe they shot, I used to tell them.. shoot all the cows in the barn and your calf crop is not worth a hoot next year. Now they are suffering.

And myself and others did go to meetings with the DNR. We did voice our concern that the doe herd was being shot off. And we were assured that our concerns would be taken into consideration. Only to see additional doe tags out in our area the next year. So much for our opinion. After all these geniuses are the ones that can't guess the approximate deer herd size. They are the ones that determine what is best for Wisconsin hunters. I wonder how they will handle a big reduction inthe number of licensed hunters next year?

The DNR tried to lay theblame because we did not hunt hard enough. I call BS on that. Why would you stay in an area and hunt,when there are no fresh track or sign in the snow? Does the DNR believe we have numerous places to hunt? Most hunters have one or two places at best,they can hunt. I hunt my property. I scout my property. From the sign I saw this fall, I knew the season would be bad. Go hunt a new area? The DNR must not have ever talked to farmers and land owners who tell you NO! And then, we did not make enough drives.. try making a drive when you come to a neighbors fence line that has not hunting trespassing signs posted. Are you going to break the law? So much for the drive. Or, you ever try to make drives in the national forest? Start walking past people on stand and listen to how they feel about you tramping through the woods on them. Or try and cover that stretch of woods in the forest sometimes. Its ruff. And then this ... we used the wrong formula to figure the herd. What a crock. They lied to us to sell license. Plain and simple. You can always tell when the DNR is not telling you the truth because their lips are moving. They had us shoot off the deer herd to make insurance companies happy. And now they realize the hunter, the ones that buy the license, the ones who's license fees basically help support DNR programs,and support the local economies with money during deer season are MAD. Oops! Now what? Well lets blame them. They were greedy. Well that won't work. We used the wrong formula? Again, dumb reason. So now its.. the herd reduction is now down to where WE want it. Who is WE? It sure as the devil is not ME.

Well I've shot plenty of deer in my life. But I will not hunt my land or allow anyone else to hunt or cross my property, until I am satisfied the deer herd is where I WANT IT. NOT THE DNR.. WHERE I WANT THE DEER HERD TO BE. Its my land, I buy the license. I also encourage all hunters in Wisconsin to teach the DNR a lesson. Don't buy a license for a couple years in a row. Lets see how they handle the lack of license fees. Lets watch our deer herd grow again. That will teach the DNR who controls the deer numbers and where we want our deer herd to be. Hit them in their pocket books.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

cayugad

I agree...

Sad to say I think it might take a bunch of hunters doing just what you said...stop buying licenses for awhile. Fact is I think that will happen, though more out of frustration than design. The hardcore hunters will still swallow hard and buy a license after a season like this. But the "good time Charlies"... the guys who go out in gun season to be with their buddies and shoot a deer or two...they might decide it is not worth it to go out, buy a license, spend two or three days in the timber or on a field, and see no deer. Lose them and you probably lose 25 percent of the gun hunters in the state.

You also raise a great point about the DNR not listening. This despite the fact that they always refer to hunters as their "primary deer management tool". Should this level of arrogance continue, herd management will have to rely on harsh winters or disease to keep the population in check.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I feel your pain, the head of your Dnr and Minnesotas must be related.... Frickin idiots.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Points about not buying licenses:
1. While a few hunters may not buy a license next year, we will still have over 800,000 sold. Egos and the love of hunting is too strong for a huge number of guys to not buy licenses. Hunters it seems can't agree on anything, from baiting, to what caliber of rifle to use, so how will they all agree to this?
2. Any lack of funds will result in the newest, youngest,field workers and warden being laid off, it won't affect the administration.
3. Theyear after nextlicense prices will go up to make up for lost funds.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

[hr]


Handles... that might be true, that many hunters will buy license. But I think there are a lot more then you might think, ticked off hunters this year. And I mean MAD. They are tired of the totalitarian attitude of the DNR and how they treat the hunters.

When I talked to locals, and 90% of them are not going to hunt next year, and more of them are going to restrict our land. If even 50% of them I talked to go through with their claims, guess what, it will be felt and felt hard. Even if 20% of total hunter numbers don't fall for the lie, that's a bundle of DNR dollars, programs, and jobs.

And when the next batch get skunkedthe next year because of the low deer numbers, they mightdecide they don't want to waste money and time. All of this will snowball again. Any effect from lack of sales will hurt the DNR's budget. While they might lay off all the young workers, that still reduces their numbers. Also as the older people retire they will not be replaced because of budgets. The ones working will not get raises, that will make the administrators happy. Also I personally feel some of the big shots need to be evaluated for their competency. WE USED THE WRONG FORMULA.. come on. What a crock of BS. Some of them need to be sent down the road for this.

Not only the DNR budget will be influenced, but watch the budget of all the restaurants, gas stations, motels, and taverns where these hunters spend money. With the pitiful herd kill in northern Wisconsin, I can tell you this ... a lot of locals will not fall for the tall stories of the monster deer herds, the DNR claims there is. And many who travel to this area will not be coming back. It will be interesting to see the license sales for next year.

And the last thing the DNR wants to do in hard economic times is to raise the price of the license. That will be that much more incentive to encourage hunters who are border line, may will may will not hunt to decide, its not worth sitting in the snow watching the squirrels.

Another thing you will see is increased incidents in violations. So they better keep their ears open. Of course if due to budget cuts there are less wardens on the job, that's a little harder to do. Remember when they outlawed baiting in the north. I had more tresspassers on my property that year then I could ever remember. And of course when I called the DNR, they were too busy to do anything. Typical I guess. Well it will get worse.

The worst effect of this herd slaughter is the impact it will have on future generations of deer hunters. Take a kid hunting. What a great idea. Have them sit or walk aroundfor days with expectations of seeing, and maybe shootinga buck, then their expectations drop to seeing even a doe, finally this young potential deer hunter is thrilled to see a squirrel. Well guess what, next year, he don't want to go. I'll stay at home and play hunting games on my computer.

Another thing we need to do is start to pressure Gov Doyle and our state representative. We need them to make it clear about how upset we are that the DNR has instigated this killing of the herd. And I say the DNR instigated it because while we might have pulled the triggers, they were the ones that demanded we earn a buck, or shoot does, or early does season, or extra doe tags. I really hope this blows up in their arrogant faces.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Absolutely right cayugad. The dnr can't make it with out us hunters. They can threaten to raise prices, but that will make less people buy tags. Also with the take a kid hunting. I can't believe they stated less numbers of youth hunters for a reason why the numbers were down. I get bored out of my mind setting in the stand not seeing anything. How do they expect to compete with video games. I started hunting in 91 and was spoiled in the 90's growing up in the "glory days" of wisconsin hunting. My boy is 16 mos old and I am going to do everything I can do to get the numbers up (at least on our 140 acres of hunting land) so my boy can have the same positive experiences of hunting I grew up with. As much as I don't want to do it but I think we all have to take a year or too off just like most of the guys here are saying. Except of course the Dnr "volunteer".

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I just dont understand why the DNR would want to kill off all the deer...I know pressure from the car insurance companies is a popular theory but I have yet to see any real proof of this...I am almost tempted to believe that they made an honest mistake figuring out the overall deer herd numbers...and I dont think they will ever listen to hunters, who have allways complained and are allways going to complain...i think they have tuned us out...

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Which is precisely why we need to prove a point. We manage the herd so we should be able to have an input. Hit them in the wallet thats all they understand. It's all about money to them. That's the bottom line.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I agree with you guys on the licensing part but I think you will need a LARGE amount of the hunting population to do that. I think the key is to get the guys that travel to quit hunting for a while. If you get some of the local hotels, restaurants and sporting goods store on your side it will help a lot. I know most of you guys don't like Illinois hunters, but I didn't head to WI this year and when I look at all the money I spend in WI (License, Hotel, food, gas, beer;)(only after the hunt)) That turns out to be a lot of money not given to the local economy. License amounts is nothing compared to what people spend on the other things while they are hunting. Get the non-local deer hunters to stay away and thats when the gov't will really start to listen.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I can not see the out of state hunters traveling and paying the outrageous out of state hunting fees to sit in the snow and watch squirrels. They are too smart for that. They will take their hunting dollars to other states where their chances are better. Then we can listen to the DNR complain about lack of interest.

I think this destruction of theherd is going to really hurt the State. When deer were in plenty, my area was packed with hunters. Restaurants, gas stations, bars, grocery stores, motels, etc.. thrived. They used to get all excited about hunting season. They will not be too happy in years to come.

The Wisconsin Department of Natural Resources is a joke. If you want the greatoutdoors screwed up, put them in charge. But they know how to charge us for every little thing. I really hope all the hunters that are upset, remember their experience in the woods this year and refuse to purchase a license. I know I will.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I think that the out of staters are going to be the most likely to skip out. I have a couple buddies from minnesota that aren't coming next year. (Actually I'm going there next year). Why would they: $160 like you say to set in the snow and watch squirrels. I think the doubters will be surprised next season when the majority of guys instate and out take the year off.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Again, none of this will affect the administration, just the hard working folks out in the field, which we already have too few of. We need more guys in the field to help convict poachers, trespassers, etc. Additionally it will hurtprograms that are positive in our state such as stocking fish, pheasants, allocation of public hunting grounds, clean water initiatives. So by beingselfish deer hunters, you are hurting many other outdoorsmen, women, and children.
If you don't want to shoot a deer, because in your hunting area, you feel there are too few deer, then by all means, don't shoot one. That doesn't meanyou shouldn't buy a license. For example, I haven't hunted waterfowl,pheasants, or fished for troutfor at least 10 years, but every year I buy a stamps for each of them, because I want all of those things to continue to improve. Maybe I'm being foolish with about $20 of my moneybut I would rather support programs, even ones I don't partake in, because I know that some kid might shoot his first ringneck over his dog and be hooked for life.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Good theory handles but the reason the deer herd is down is the dnr. So Something needs to change. It's not about my $20 its about everybodies. And how many pheasants did the dnr stock last year. I can't believe you are throwing pheasants, and trout into this. The dnr has cut way back on stocking everything in the recent past so I highly doubt anybody will miss the stocking of pheasants in a couple of public hunting grounds.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I also find it sad that you guys are so caught up in killing deer rather than enjoying the glory that is hunting.
Iworked extra hours and jobs and saved for 8 years to go on a once in alifetime caribou hunt this fall. Saw only 1 caribou, a young cow, the whole hunt (out of 14 guys in two camps). Only 2 guys were pissed about not shooting a bou. The rest of us enjoyed our hunt and will have fond memories of it. The other two will go through life with a sour taste in their mouths.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I do feel we need to organize and hold the administration responsible. Contact your State representatives and Doyle. I have been sending out emails and snail mail. Demand that those responsible for the failed policies of the DNR are punished. Demand action. And if a few wardens loose their jobs.. well that's life. In today's economy no one has total job security.

As for buying a license and then not hunting. Sorry, I do not donate to something I think wrong. The DNR through their mismanagement made this problem.And I encourage all hunters upset over the deer herd numbersto do the same, don't purchase a deer license. Hurt them in the wallet and they listen better.

If we keep supporting their faulty policies by purchasing a license and not hunting,then they will never change their ways.What's the use of these town hall meetings if its only to listen to us complain and then do as THEY want anyway. Which is what they do. So contact your State Representatives and send Doyle a message as well. Let all of them know that we hunter are ticked off, and will not stand for this anymore!!!

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

You don't listen to what people are saying handles. Nobody on here is complaining about killing deer its seeing deer that's the issue. People want to see deer when they hunt. Isn't that why you're out there. If it was all about killing deer to all of us we wouldn't be complaining about eab and all of these doe permits. We just want to see deer again!!!!

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Really Jesse, you are sure that no one will miss pheasant hunting? Hmm, maybe pheasant hunters think that you shouldn't worry about not getting a deer. You really sound like a spoiled brat. Me, Me, Me.

On second thought Jesse, don't buy a license next year, or the year after that, or after that... The sportsmen and sportswomen in this state don't really need your kind anywhere near the water or woods.

Sad.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Actually handles I pheasant hunt alot more than I deer hunt. The areas that I hunt haven't been stocked by the dnr at least in the last 10 yrs (probably ever) so to say the "pheasant hunters" you are talking about me. And with this being true let them not stock pheasants. Explain to me how I am only thinking about myself. I want everybodies kids to grow up with the opportunities to see deer like I did when I was a kid, and I've said that numerous times in here. Also tell me why I shouldn't think that the dnr is only worried about their wallet because the things they do sure would suggest that is the case.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Give me a break..Handles - yes, Jesse... buy a license and support the failed policies of a DNR game management strategy that caused this slaughter of the deer herd. After all, they promise they will change??? Support something that does not work.. Get real. You want to hurt the DNR or any company for that matter that you feel did you wrong, twist their pocket book.

And calling one group of people a spoiled brat and others "sportsmen and sportswomen" that's an old debate trick from college Handles. Nice try though. Belittle one side when your position is wrong to hide the faults.

And we as Wisconsin resident have as much right to complain about a failed management plan and protest that any way we see fit. If you want to buy a license and sit in the woods.. fine. That's your right. BUT don't belittle others for believing in what they feel is the right way to approach the mistakes of the DNR.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I've hunted the western UP since the late 80's, and experienced much of what is being described in WI. I now live in WI and bow hunt here, while returning to the UP for gun season. Throughout the late 80's and early-mid 90's the MI DNR promoted doe hunting in the UP, including the issuing of block permits to farmers for 'crop damage' (only crops in our area were hay!). Not surprisingly, through these practices along with less food (less farming and logging) and more wolves, our deer herd was eventually decimated. It got to the point where you were excited if you saw a handful of does during a weeklong hunt, let alone saw a decent buck. I nearly quit hunting, especially after moving out-of-state. The only reason I returned is because my family has land and it's as much an excuse for a family reunion as it was for the so-called hunting (saw few deer for a few years there). Around 2000 the DNR finally did away with the doe permits. You can no longer shoot any does in our area during gun season. Surprise, surprise, we're starting to see more and more deer now. I saw more deer this season than I've seen in 10 years.

Contrast this with my experience in WI...and that of others on this board. I saw more deer in one day while hunting in the UP than I've seen all fall bow hunting in WI. I'm getting the feeling that hunting in WI is going to be more like what we've had to deal with in the western UP for the past 10-15 years. I put the blame on meat hunters (those killing more than 2 deer per season) as well as the DNR (for allowing this to occur). Plenty of blame to go around.

On the plus side, trophies will be that much harder to come by, and hunters will have to earn them now, much as we've had to do in the UP. Simply showing up on opening morning will no longer guarantee one of getting a nice 8-pt or larger as I've seen many come to expect here in WI. The rewarding feeling you get is that much better when you have to really work to get your buck, but I do agree with the posters here that simply seeing deer and enjoying the hunt is also a reward on its own. I disagree with Handles that we should simply be happy to sit in the woods, whether or not we see deer. That's just plain discouraging if you can't see at least a few deer each day on the stand.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Thanks for the insight UPHunter08 on the UP. I never knew it would take that long to come back.

The worst part of all this.. I can see, and understandHandles point of view. If hunters stop buying deer license, the rest of the outdoor experience suffers. After all hunters basically support the outdoor activities in Wisconsin for everyone to enjoy.

But Handles made some other points that concern me as well. Besides the being happy sitting in the woods enjoying the experience. That's horse you know what. I want to see deer. I'm not out there gopher hunting for goodness sakes. Many years hunting, I watched deer, especially doe, and never shot them, but found pleasure sitting there watching them. And I like watching the smaller creatures. I let many a young buck go too. Because taking a deer home is nice, but its not the end of the world. But outright, I deer hunt to see deer, and maybe put a little meat in the freezer.

The one point Handles made is the management or the upper administration will not suffer should funds be cut. While they might not loose their jobs, they could get their duties changed, or perhaps take a job demotion. Or heaven forbid be forced to get off their desk chair and actually have to work the field, they will suffer. They will suffer when hunters, politicians, and most of all the people in general start putting pressure on the DNR as to why things are in our outdoors are getting so bad. And face it, anyone that ever worked in management.. what happens when your boss is not happy?? That's right, he makes your life miserable.

The only way to put that kind of pressure on the upper management of the DNR is lock their wallet. Cut their funds, and they will feel it. Unfortunately some of the junior people might suffer job cuts, but that's life. And to cut their fund, you need to cut their major source of revenue. And that is deer license sales.

So while I see Handle's concerns, we just have to agree to disagree I guess. I am a stubborn old devil that is set in his ways. I went to meetings, I voiced my opinion, and it did no good. So now I will get off my soap box and maybe this thread will die off. Just like our deer herd did.....

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I was just at my local sports shop and i noticed a petition with about 50 names on it who are promising not to buy deer licenses next year...it has been up for about 2 days and im sure the list will grow...

and to Handles...how many organizations do you donate money to that have failed and have continued to promote ideals that you disagree with??

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Just a short reply to Handles- I have been following your personal attacks on other hunters opinions andI just don't know where you stand. Are you a DNR employee or are you a wanna be? The impression I get is you are a wanna be and you are always right.

I have hunted whitetails in Wisconsin for over forty years and know that something is wrong with the deer herd. The DNR has hornshwaggled us into a mess as far as deer numbers go. I know that you think otherwise by your record. Why is it that the DNR never admits it messed up? You would fit right in with them. Hey If you went through what we as older hunters have (seeing 1 deer in 2 years) in the early 70's you wouldn't be so quick to attack the fellas that are trying to not let that happen again. If you are a DNR employee,you should be ashamed of your attacks on fellow hunters. But you know what- I think you are a (barney Fife). The deer herd is in danger of being wiped out and you as the DNR would rather defer the problem and say the hunters are (whiners). There just isn't a simple solution. I don't know the answer but killing every deer isn't in my plans. May be hunters should stand up to the DNR now and not latter.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Poachers and trespassers won't be a problem if the Deer are shot off. Why do we need more DNR people in the field to manage less deer? Only a DNR person would say that. Trespassers are handled thru the sheriffs office. Why not let sportsmen be more involved in the decision making of the DNR? Just a thought. I agree with Jesse-everyone should not buy a license next year!

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Management and administration will be hurt if enough public and political pressure is brought to bear. Does anyone else recall back in about 1995 or so when the DNR floated the idea of only allowing does to be taken in several DMU's during gun season? The rationale used by the DNR was similar to what we have been hearing...there are too many deer, hunters aren't shooting enough does, blah, blah, blah!!...The outcry from hunters was almost immediate and went all the way to Tommy Thompson. Thompson basically told the DNR to come up with another solution, or else!... Of course, we heard a lot of belly aching from the DNR about how politicians should not interfere with the good work of "professional wildlife management" (whatever that is supposed to mean), but the DNR was forced to relent and the first t-zones were created.

Many still complain that politicians should not interfere with the DNR when it comes to setting policy for deer season. My response is: "Why not?!" Last time I checked, the DNR is a state agency. State agencies are accountable to the state senate, the state assembly, the governor, and ultimately: The People of the State of Wisconsin. That's right...they work for US, they get paid by US, and are ultimately accountable to US. Though it is true that we have state agencies in place to offer a degree of expertise in a field that may not otherwise be available without their help, that expertise, like that available in any other field or discipline, does not mean that they are given license to act as they choose or that they are now accountable to no one. They are ultimately accountable to the people of the state of Wisconsin. If the people who help fund their agency are dissatisfied with their work, then the people, through their elected representatives, should have the right to determine how their mandate to manage wildlife is addressed. Besides, why shouldn't the DNR be more amenable to listening to the concern of hunters? Since the DNR has repeatedly referred to hunters as their "primary wildlife management tool", shouldn't hunters have some input into how the herd is managed? Some argue that this is what the "spring meetings" are about: providing feedback to the DNR. Sure... Have you been to the meetings? Sort of like trying to have your opinions taken seriously by the Soviet Politburo. Is it any wonder why during the "Deer 2000" surveys that only 1/3 of hunters who responded to the survey had a high degree of confidence in the work of the DNR?

If the DNR really wants hunters to take them seriously, they need to start listening. Stop approaching meetings with the conclusions already reached and simply have meetings to go thru the motions because the lesislature told them to. Honestly ask for input from the real stakeholders in the process...hunters and landowners...as to how they would like to see deer managment work. They might be surprised...it certainly would go a long way to build good will from hunters, at least more so than floating ideas like "No buck" gun seasons, or having sharpshooters shoot deer from helicopters at night in the CWD zone.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Right on TJD;

Untill everyone is on board -the DNR will listen to the Ins. Lobbyists and we will see a decimation of our deer herd. I hunted in the years when you saw maybe one deer a year. I'm afraid we are heading in that direction again. We have acted in good faith with what the DNR said were the deer numbers and I feel we were lied to or miss informed at best. First it was party tags then bonus tags (more revenue) and now they (DNR) are making us kill does before we can shoot a buck. The meetings you mention are truely a joke - (The fox in charge of the chicken coop) I can see why many hunters are not shooting does. Us hunters that have seen the rise and fall of deer hunting know where we were.
we must find a way to unite!!!!

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I agree that the DNR is totally off base in the management of the deer herd. I've hunted for 25 years and saw far more deer in the late 80's and early 90's than I see now. This year my area 73D went to an earn a buck that is not needed. Ihave not seen over 10 deer in a years time inthe last 15 years. I usually see4 to 8 in 5 or 6 days of hunting. That's hardly a deer herd out of control.Everyone that hunts in the same area I do have said the same thing no one is seeing any amounts of deer, including two guys that hunt the land next to me not seeing anything.

I figure the DNR takes their counts on refuge land that no one can hunt such as Eagle Valley near Cassville or on blocks of land owned by city folk that don't allow hunting to inflate the herd numbers. I do not think I'm wrong on this either.

I asked how the registration was at the local co-op this year and the said on opening weekend it was 66 deer behind last year 263 to 197 with people saying the same thing. They're not seeing anything.

Handles I know you think the DNR is doing a great job but you are about the only onethat thinks that that I've heard. I think you also may be a new employee with them as you seem awfully worried if people don't buy licenses next year new people will be laid off.

I think this was brought up earlier in this thread.As far as deer damage permits go this may be unpopular but if a landowner has that much damage on their land they should allow people in to hunt. Simple solution if you apply for damage reimbursement the DNR should send in plain clothes people to ask for permission to hunt on your land. If the answer is no we save that for family then no check or permits for you. Some landowners are trying to have their cake and eat it too. I've heardthere are pockets of higher deer areas with this happening. Everyone is quick to blame deer for damage done to a cornfield but have any of you seen a group of coon going into a cornfield and knocking down countless stalks night after night? Coon do a heck of a lot of damage that deer get blamed for.

RE: wisconsin DNR CRAZY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

I agree to a certain extent- however I have had some real bad situations with letting hunters on my land.
I think one way they the (DNR) could get farmers to let people on would be to give farmers a coupon like some states out west do. The coupon would be like $15.00 per hunter and land owners would be more receptive to letting people hunt. Also some guy's just don't get it-they are a guest and they must obey the rules each land owner has-such as closing gates, not cutting fences, and staying off neighboring farms. These are a few things that really make me leery of letting hunters on my land.
Also as far as damage goes I'll tell you a good one;

A farmer from Ridgeland WI ran into a monster black bear two weeks ago in his corn field. The bear was hibernating in the corn field. The corn field had a huge area that was destroyed by this bear through-out the summer. The bear had dug a hole two feet deep and pulled corn over him.
When the farmer hit the bear with his combine he killed it and the DNR was called to see if he could
keep the bear. The good old DNR warden said sure for I think it was $175.00. The farmer asked about all the damage the bear had done to his corn and the warden had no answer. The farmer ended up haggling with thewardenand got the bear for $75.00. Now after all this do you think this farmer would cooperate with the DNR by letting hunters on his land?

By the way this bear weighed 767lbs. I think it was and almost 7' long it was 6'2'' around his chest.

HOW MUCH CORN DO YOU THINK HE ATE?