Alaskian Hunters
 

I see some carrying slug guns for backup for bear. Does anyone carry anything special for slugs. Or just the typical benneke? I find some sluggers and benneke's and such to not have that great of penetration and expand too much. Just wondering from people that have been there and done it, what the deal is. I get great penetration with coppersolids.

I figured instead of slugs, I would want a 450 or even a hot 45-70.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Most locals and guides when hunting in bear country, use shotguns as the guns of choice to protect themselves in the case of bear attack. As for what type of slugs, all types will work, and i would use the ones i liked the most. vangunsmith

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Man, what kinda comment is that??? Does people just post to be posting

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Can't say much about slugs as I haven't kept up with the advances in that ammo for some time. For sure though, with bears you want good penetration!
I'm with you on the choice of a 450 Marlin or 45/70. I haven't been to Alaska, but couple folks I know have, and both of these cartridges are well liked, I hear.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Well, I know there are companies that make hard lead slugs the would penetrate anything. But they are rare. Most are made for deer, I see. Thats it, I am going to buy a 45-70 Marlin. I always wanted one.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

I think that a heavy 45/70 load is far superior to a 12ga slug but there is a few slugs that come higly recomended. One of those is the breneke magnum designed for big game. There is another company from down south somewhere that has a slug, "terminator" or something like that, is supposed to be an excellent big game slug. I'll stick with my guide gun with 405gr kodiak bonded loads.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Have you ever priced those bad boys? Very expensive.

Very nice gun Josh.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

I've personally never priced them, but even if they were expensive a box would last you quite some time if used in a defensive situation.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Here is the link to those terminator slugs.
Dixie slugs

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

I like the thinking behind those terminator slugs..hard flat lead nothing kills like that especially when its 76 caliber.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Old, their pressures kinda scare me. They claim that they are very safe to use in any 870 express. Its hard for me to believe these numbers. But I agree its one heck of a wallop.


Dixie Terminator-.729"-740 gr-40 grs Alliant "Steel" powder-1350’/"-10,500 psi

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Actally it looks liek they have came down in price to 7.50/5, min 5 box order.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

I would love to pancake a deer with that load and it would do that I am sure. THose tri-ball loads look wicked

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

500 alaskan or 3 inch 1 oz rifled slugs. thats what a friend of my family who is a fly fishing guide in alaska uses.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

I lived in Alaska for 25 years, and hunted big bears a fair amount.

From what i saw, the average guide didn't live, breath, and eat guns, and didn't know a lot about reloading or the different types of ammo. Several of them came into my shop and asked me for recomendations as to what worked for me.

I'm NOT implying that i'm so smart, i'm just pointing out that they aren't either!!! Most of them would carry anything that had they figured would penetrate well, and i loaded NP's for some of them.

From what i saw, many just carried a 375H&H "just because" they figured it was "big enough" and ammo could be easily bought.

It seems everyone is more worried about how fast and how many shots they can get off, than what cal. they are carrying, hence shotguns and extended magazine are talked about all the time.

Look at this site right here, have you seen the answers when someone ask a question useing a single shot rifle for DEER!!! Seems today, everyone is worried about the 2, 3, and 4th shot, instead of the FIRST!

When i went in after a wounded bear, i used the same gun i was hunting with!! I didn't use a shotgun to hunt bears with, why should i use one to finish one off? I wouldn't use a gun i didn't have full confidence in, in the first place!!!

Sorry, i got off topic a bit :>)))

Drilling Man

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Well, I was wondering why it took ya so long to chime in. I was wanting to hear you opinion on the subject.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

IMO if I was carrying a just incase gun it would be a short barreled semi-auto that I was confident wouldnt jam 12ga. loaded with 3-inch mag slugs and buck shot with a sling so it is at my waiste not my back. It is true that a well placed shot will do the trick but if you have an eight foot grizzly charging at you I know I wouldnt be holding to aweful steady. All in all if you dont think you will stay steady enough for a good shot just fill the air with lead if it is a life or death sisuation. I am in no means saying that you shouldnt go for one shot one kill. I am saying if you are a 6 foot 250lbs person in you have no chance aginst a 8 foot 1000lbs grizzley.

Rember the bullets that miss travel for a distance and every inch could mean big problems for other hunters.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Andy,

I'm NOT picking on you, but the seems the mentality today!! Just fill the air with lead and hope for the best!!!

How about takeing your time, and let the animail get close enough so you "don't" miss??????

All too often a hunter fills the air with lead, and ends up with an wounded animial that would have broke off the charge before it ever even got to you! I've had it happen myself!!! I set the distance i'd fire my first round at 20 yards, and at about 30 yards the bear stopped and looked for me. I never moved, so it couldn't see me and after a time moved off. As it came toward me i kept the sights where i wanted the bullet to go and waited... Didn't take long either!!! LOL....

I find that most bears charge useing there nose, and loose the scent once chargeing. They then have to pick it up again. If you run, they can see that and just like a dog will chase you. When they stop to pick up the scent, they think it over again, and move off.

Anyway, filling the air with lead is stupid, and a wounded bear will do what it takes to find your @$$ and finish you!!

In my life i've been attacked by more dogs than bears, and i've been around bears a bunch!!! Save the shotgun and #4 buck for the dogs!!!


Lastly, i'm NOT saying shotguns won't kill a big bear, i'm saying in my book it's NOT my first choise!! Not even close to first!!

Drilling Man

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

I've never hunted in Alaska, but I did take a Black bear here in Arkansas this year. It was my first bear.

What I learned from the experience is that Bears can move FAST......VERY FAST!

The shot I took was a perfect broadside at about 25 Yds with a T/C 209 50Cal Muzzleloader w/150 grns of powder. At the shot, the bear turned and covered aprox 35 Yds before he crashed. Elapsed time between shot and crash was no more than a couple of seconds (i.e. 2 seconds) Now if you figure that out, it's better than 30 MPH.

My bear went into some real thick stuff and I had to go in there to make sure he was down. At first, I was really concerned about entering the thicket as I knew I only had one shot with the muzzleloader. Then I got to thinking, he had covered 30 Yds in 2 seconds!......if I was charged, I was only going to be able get one shot off anyway no matter what kind of gun I had.

Now I don't know how fast the Big Bears can move, but I agree with DM, I would much prefer to be carrying a gun that could get the job done with the FIRST shot, rather than be in a position to have to rely on a second or third shot that I may never get the chance to take.

firstshot

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Hey DM, I didn't mean to sound like rambo but when I said a just incase gun I ment in the likely hood you have one charging and don't have your primary rifle handy. Like if your down gutting out ur moose and notice one at close range and it decides its hungry and you startled it.


I would like to restat what I said. I must of been thinking faster than I was typing becuse what I ment to say is that if you have a grizz charging and your not steady enough to put one good placed shot. Fill fill the bear with lead, (not the air) if it is a life or death sisuation. In this I ment don't worry about the meat just you life. I have never been charged by a bear but I have seen them run and climb trees and it is very impresiave.

And i did miss spell my last statement

what i ment to say is "Rember the bullet that misses travels for a distance and every inch could mean big problems for other hunters"


I am sorry for the way i sounded and would like to appolgise. If you dissagree with what I ment to say than thats okay its your opion. I do understand why you or anyone else with a lick of sense would be upset and dissagree what I actually said.


Andrew

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Hey Andy,

I wasn't upset at all, i was just giveing my opinion just like all the other posters here. That's what makes the world go around... :>)))

When i was gutting or skinning in the field in bear country, i ALWAYS kept the same rifle i hunted with in the first place close. I stayed alert and continued to look around. If i had someone with me, then i asked them to stay alert one way, (behind me) while i did the other. If i was working in the open, i never was too worried.

I've always believed in useing decent bullets (mostly Nosler partitions) when hunting, so i could handle a bear or ?? even though i wasn't always hunting bears. If i wasn't loaded with NP's then i used a heavier bullet than normal to make up for some of the difference to get better penetration.

I never had a bear problem after putting an animial down and walking up to it. ALL the problems begin once you LEAVE that animial, and come back later to get another quarter to pack. I carried my rifle, or if there was more than one of us packing, we would at least have one rifle between us.

My buddy had a "wolverine" run him off when he came back for the rest of his sheep!!! They can be one mean SOB!!!

Drilling Man

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

I would take that small little wolverine by the tail and slap him against the rocks and teach him a lesson. :D

You know I am kidding. Anyway, whats the deal with those critters. Did the wolverine chase your buddy down?

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

bigcountry,
One of my brother-in-laws {6}, killed a large Black Bear in Alberta Canada with
a WIN 94 carbine .35REM. He had the bear full body mounted.I'm not saying the .35REM
is THE bear gun,all I'm saying is it did a clean kill.The black bear in Alberta are bigger
than Florida,but it is not uncommon to use .35REM here.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

I agree. A 35 would be fine. But I have been around black bears my whole life. I never worried about one ambushing me while gutting a deer. And never worried about one charging me.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

Ditto!

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

But then again I can't say I know much about griz or brown. I hear stories. I seen them in Yellowstone. but never worried about them where I hunt.

DM, is it a serious threat? I got a good friend in Utica that goes to Kodiak all the time with a longbow. He said he was stalked by a big bruin last year and finally dropped his blacktail and the bear walked past the deer and kept coming slowly behind him. He said he finally turned around and started tearing into the blacktail. Sounds like my bud kept his head pretty well.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

I personally would't use any cal. less than .338MAG, above black bear.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

What happened was my friend went back for a second load of sheep meat. He left his rifle at camp (7 Rem. mag.) so he could carry everything that was left there. When he got back to the sheep, there was a wolverine on the kill, and it wasn't giving it up!!! My buddy tried yelling but the wol.. would lunge at him if he got too close, so he gave up and went back to camp for his rifle...

When he got back to the sheep, the wolver... was gone, but it had eaten a lot of meat that he now didn't have to pack out... :>)))


Anything is possible, but nothing like that has happened to me, not that i know of anyway.... I've had guys tell me all kinds of stories though, even when i'm hunting with them they were seeing and hearing things. I think most hunters have a bit of an imagination when around bears, and locals and guides like to play that up a bit! After all, they have to jusyify that big $$ hunt somehow...

It's not what i'd call "unusual actions" for a bear to follow someone, (some call it stalking) and now that it got a deer for it's efforts, what do you think it will do next time it encounters a human????????

I've been so close to brn. bears in thickets that i could smell them, and hear them move off (many times) and none of them bothered me. Maybe i smell worse to them, than they did to me???? :>)))

Bear problems are so overrated it isn't even funny!!!! Over the years moose have killed more people than bears have!!!!

Drilling Man

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

BC, I agree with you, but here it is thick. You might stumble into a MaMa with Cubs,it could get
Nasty! Plus we have FL. Panther and they pick up on a gutted deer real quick.
Most of the hunters take it to the ranger station.
Plus one time I was on stand in a Washington Palm thinking there were no bears in the area,WRONG!
Black bear eat the berries on top of the palm, and that day he wanted some.Luckly I did'nt have to
shoot it.He got tired of trying and climbed back down. I never saw it again,but it ruined that hunting
spot.

RE: Alaskian Hunters
 

A former college roomate of mine that liives in Johnston PA told me two bear stories one bear was shot with a 7mm but it took a 338 mag to finish it off. The other one was berserk during a turkey hunt took 1 copper turkey load from a shotgun, 6 from a high handloaded 357mag to stop, by the way they guy with the 357mag needed a change of shorts after the charge. My former teacher had success with a 300win mag all of these were on black bears. I gues its all in momentum and were your person is located when you shoot at any bear.