Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

Well I thought I was filling out my cabinet nicely with the edition of the 30-30, I already have a Remington 788 .308 for longer range deer but now I am starting to wonder if that gun is enough for the real big game like elk and bear. What do you guys think? Am I just looking for an excuse to buy another rifle?

Metro

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

The 308 Win is enough for elk all day long, but on the big bears no 30 caliber is optimum. We are talking BIG bears here, not black bear.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

On another thread of mine one of the guys said that 1000 ft pounds at least is the knock down power you want for deer, is there a guidline regarding ft pounds and large game?

Metro

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

NO .30 Cal i optimum? .300 Weatherby Mag Will take any bear you can point at.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

And you can kill a deer with a 223 Rem as well but it is far from optimum. You might want to look up optimum in the dictionary. If you are shooting something that will eat you then why take chances? 338 Win Mag and above for big bear.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

1500 lb ME is considered minimum for Elk Black Bear would be included in this. The big Bears however might require a bit more. A 45-70 will do the job as would the 444 and 450 Marlins. The 7 Mags and 30-06's and even 270's have taken all Game in North America. For the big Bears for me, a minimum of 30-06 or 7 Mag would be my choice along with the 45-70. I have never been a fan of the 338 and would jump to the 375 H&H if my smaller guns would not suffice.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

dont try and get smart frizzellr by telling me to look something up in a dictionary. A message board is for discusing things..and thats what were doing..Im not trying to tell you your WRONG , im just giving my opinion.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

elk should be fien im not sure about bear, a 300 win mag is a perfect all around caliber. it will take a bear easy, its all about shot placment. even there a 300 will give you some breathing room.

so what do suggest a 50 Bmg. haha

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

you can take down damn near anyhting with a .30 cal. .300win mag can easily take down a bear. That's why packers used to carry .45colts and .30-30s with them to defend against bears.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

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That's why packers used to carry .45colts and .30-30s with them to defend against bears.

I have no doubt that I could drop a bear at 20 or 30 yards with my 30-30 or .308 even further, I am talking about big big game out to 200-300 yards.

Metro

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

One year hunting for mule deer in Wyoming, I came within 40 yards of a grizzly that was feeding on an elk's ribcage. While the bear made no threat toward me, I really wished I had been carrying something bigger than my 308.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

Not knocking the 308 or 303 British... they have both killed lots of big game. If I think I stand a chance of getting stomped or eaten, I carry a 45 70. However, 300 yards are different. A bear shot at 300.... I would want to be real sure I am going to hit at that range. I wouldn't be thrilled to go into thick brush against a wounded one. My inclination would be to go to a 338, 35 whelen or 375 holland & holland; the biggest wound channel I could hit with at 300.

Once the american buffalo and grizzly decreased in range & numbers, US calibers got small. Going after the big critters, I would think big-ger.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

I'm with BJ here. The .308Win. is okay for elk, and most black bear. Use a good 180gr.
bullet like the Core-Lokt Ultra, Nosler Partitions, etc. I'd limit the range to maybe 200yds., 250yd. max.

BUT, when it comes to the BIG bears, including grizzly or even up to brown bears, I want
more - much more. I like the .35 Whelen (250gr. bullets), and most would also go with
the .338Win.Mag., again with the heavier bullets (250gr.). Personally, if I'm going to go with a magnum I'm moving up, and would go with the trusty old .375H&H. I want some-thing that can break down a bear. Gettin' chewed on is not my idea of a fun hunt.
Another possible option is the .350 Rem. Mag., but the only factory loads from Remington still use the 200gr. bullet. I'd have to handload it. Its' ballistics are very
similar to the .35Whelen.

I'm not knocking the 7mm magnums or the .30 magnums. They're excellent cartridges,
and would be great for Elk, black bear, moose, and of course, any deer. But, when it
comes to something that can turn the hunter into the hunted, I want a bigger hole at the
muzzle. :D

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

I think that the 300mags would be minimum for what your talking. The 308 would probably do under 200yds but I personally want more than a 308 if I'm that close to a big bear. He might just take that 308 away from me and paddle my a$$ with it.:D

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

There isn't much difference between the .308, the 30-06, 300 WM, and 7mm. None of those bigger cartridges will do anything the .308 won't except fly a little flatter downrange. If you're not comfortable with a .308 then go with a bigbore like a .338, .375, 45-70, or a .458 WM.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

How many of you guys in this thread have "actually hunted and shot" a big bear????? I have, and here's my "experience".

First off, NO ONE and i mean NO one, should be shooting at ANY bear that isn't already wounded, at 2 and 300 yards!!!! I don't give a damn what your carrying!

As for useing a 308 Win.. on elk, no problem at all, use proper bullets for that job. As for big bears, i have my Min. for 30 cal. set at the 30-06, and that's with GOOD bullets and loads! The reason i pick the 06 over the 308, is it will drive 200 grain bullets faster, and that means more penetration. (with proper bullets) You need "good penetration" for big bears, and in this case, 200 grain NP would be my choise. You need to be "knocking these animials down", NOT shooting them in the ribs, and then have to go look for them!!!!

As for the 300 Win. mag and Wby. mag., no problem, but use GOOD expanding bullets!! It's very hard to beat 200 NP's in 30 cal. for good expansion, and very good penetration.

Drilling Man

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

Briman - I dont know what your thinking, did you eat some strange mushrooms when hunting today? the 06, 300wm, and 7rem mag ARE much more powerful than the 308, dont believe it? Look in a reloading manual at how they handle big bullets compared to the 308. The ONLY circumstance where what you say is true is if you are useing small bullets at short range, then the 308 would do just as well. The other calibers are not meant for small bullets, and neither are LARGE bears.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

the .308 is enough for elk's...

Niko

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

I have shot big bears with a 45-70 and it does the job as does the 30-06. I also load the 200 grain Partition or the 200 grain X bullet. Many years ago I loaded only the 220 grain round nose for the 30-06 for Game bigger than elk. I used to get them at a hardware store that got them from some dept of the Government surplus. My Uncle shot several Polar bears with a 303 British. Thats a feat I would not care to duplicate but it worked for him.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

Thanks drillingman, I had a friend move to Alaska for a short time and before he left he bought a .300 win mag. While he was there he was told by many locals that all he needed was the old and trusty .30-06. He had about the same experience we would have taking a .416R to deer camp.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

Read an article within the last 18 mos- I think it was in outdoor life, but I am not sure. They looked at the 300,338 and 375 hh for bear. A good number of bears were shot with each, I think over 50. The one thing that I recall was that there was no difference in the number of shots, except for possibly the larger cal taking more shots. THey attributed this to the kick and shootablility. The bear, all of these were browns, to go down the fastest was one shot with a 270. I am a firm believer of shoot the biggest gun that you can handle, but accuracy is the key. Id shoot my 300 win mag with 180 grain barnes xlc at 3,000 fps because I already own it and it shoots. I think a 308 would be fine for all but the coastal browns. A good 180 grain load with shots kept to 250 or less would be good for elk and bear. Just one guys opinion.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

i agree with briman,the 308 will do fine on elk and big bears always remember that shotplacment is what is most importent..

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

A good rule of thumb is to shoot as big of a gun as you can comfortably handle. We all know the bigger the better. But that is not always practical. I know a fellow, who I bought a .270 off of sometime ago, who killed everything up to grizzly with that very rifle. It will do it, but I would not feel comfortable doing it myself. On the otherhand, I felt like the king of the castle carrying my .300 and .338. Are they big enough to kill a bear, yes. Do you feel that their comfortable carrying that small of a gun when a bear walks past you at 30 yards? probabl;y not. Just do what I always say. Do the best you can with what you have. It's been said the greatest gun in the world just happens to be what ever you're carrying at the time. I agree with that. If you have a .308, and your a good shot shooting a good bullet. It will probably get the job done. For elk. no problem. Just practice until your comfortable enough with your rifle to get the job done. I don't care who is going to argue with that, but it's the truth. Shot placment is the biggest thing I can stress. If you shoot a bear in the rump with a .50 BMG, your going to have to trail a really ticked off bear into the trees. If you shoot him in the heart/lungs with your 30-30, he's dead on his feet. Good luck, and hopefuly you never need to shoot unless you want to.

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

I wouldn't have a problem carrying a 308 in bear country as a "have-handy" weapon....but I don't think I have the stones to go looking for a brown bear with anything less than an '06. I'd probably go for something even bigger....and I really doubt I'd take a shot as far off as 200 yards......the question is...how far is too far, and how close is too close.

David

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

The .270win will kill any animal in north america with proper shot placement and if your not confident with your shot placement you have no business risking your life shooting bear;)

RE: Is .308 enough for elk and large bear?
 

Everybody has said the most important thing, shot placement. i can remember alot a years ago when i lived in New Zealand, we would shoot deer with .22's when we were out after possums, back then they didn't care what you used, just as long as ya got rid of them. wouldn't do it now .