Go Back  HuntingNet.com Forums > Firearms Forum > Guns
Remington Shoe Dropped >

Remington Shoe Dropped

Guns Like firearms themselves, there's a wide variety of opinions on what's the best gun.

Remington Shoe Dropped

Old 07-30-2020, 09:44 AM
  #1  
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
 
Nomercy448's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,898
Default Remington Shoe Dropped

The writing has been on the wall for a month or two now as Remington prepared for bankruptcy protection, for which has now been filed. It’s uncertain where the company’s debts will be transferred, as it appears interest from the Navajo nation has waned in recent weeks. It’s yet another unfortunate misstep in a series of such after the collapse and condemnation which happened so many years ago now with the first debt transfer to Cerberus/Freedom Group. With the closures this year of DPMS, Bushmaster, and other Remington brands, and the this additional step of perpetuating transfer of debt and equity among various creditors, the potential for a resurrection to their former legacy seems farther away then ever before.

Remington Files Bankruptcy for second time in as many years

Last edited by Nomercy448; 07-30-2020 at 09:48 AM.
Nomercy448 is offline  
Old 07-30-2020, 05:45 PM
  #2  
Super Moderator
 
CalHunter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Northern California
Posts: 18,376
Default

Not looking good at all.
CalHunter is offline  
Old 07-30-2020, 07:21 PM
  #3  
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
 
Nomercy448's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,898
Default

I would generally expect the operating company will continue producing firearms. But they are running from the liability SCOTUS confirmed they carry, and have shifted debt carry and asset value far too much, I can’t imagine there is much left buoying the business. We’ll see who ends up picking up the debt in the bankruptcy. I read comparative reports which showed the Navajo Nation’s potential offer last month was about half of the valuation they offered in the 2018 bankruptcy filing, and even that has been withdrawn. So there can’t be very much perceived value left dangling in the business.

But I do expect we’ll see something like Winchester happening long before we stop seeing Remington’s offered for sale. They won’t any longer be Remington’s, as the Win’s aren’t win’s any longer, but they’ll still be on the market, made overseas and with a completely different marketing model than they currently carry.

Alternatively, of course, another company with a long history of divestment and acquisition has been Savage. A company which was unfavorably held as the only firearms manufacturing finger in a large outdoor sports conglomeration - and the company carried so much value that the employees themselves raised stakes and bought the company from their umbrella, and are doing swimmingly. And of course, Ruger’s trading price is at an all time high, with no end in sight until we get through election time.
Nomercy448 is offline  
Old 07-31-2020, 01:01 AM
  #4  
Spike
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 2
Default

But it's not the first time, I think Remington will be fine
gunsurfer is offline  
Old 07-31-2020, 07:40 AM
  #5  
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
 
Nomercy448's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,898
Default

Originally Posted by gunsurfer
But it's not the first time, I think Remington will be fine
That’s much akin to saying to someone with a reemergence, “but it’s not the first time you’ve had cancer, I think you’ll be fine.”
Nomercy448 is offline  
Old 07-31-2020, 09:19 AM
  #6  
Nontypical Buck
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 2,743
Default

I am gathering a LOT of company's will be claiming the likes, and blaming it on this virus and asking for bail out moneys to stay afloat and I bet many get it
this is just the beginning of places filing or government bailouts/and the likes!,
yet I gather all the top of these company folks will still be getting paid, bonus's and such, just like the last time the GOV stepped in to bail out the vehicle company's that cried needing help

this again IMO< will be the wave of the future for company's all the more so when there is a big problem happening in the country like this corona virus !

but NO worries I am sure
us tax payers will have the burden of saving them , with increased taxes down the road!
mrbb is offline  
Old 07-31-2020, 11:12 AM
  #7  
Nontypical Buck
 
Big Uncle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,780
Default

This is a popular topic lately. The anti-gun crowd is cheering and the internet rumor mill is in full swing. As most of us do not know very much about the process perhaps some discussion using small words might be helpful.

A very important thing to know is that this is a Chapter 11 filing, not a Chapter 7. A Chapter 11 allows for reorganization and negotiations with creditors. A Chapter 7 is a liquidation. There is a lot of gamesmanship in a filing of this type. Will creditors be willing to play ball? People who deal with these issues are well aware that pushing too hard could result in a liquidation that would almost guarantee that the creditors will walk away with only "pennies on the dollar" or completely emptyhanded.

Selling assets (including intellectual property such as patents and trade names) could be a result leaving an empty bucket for the Sandy Hook plaintiffs. The SCOTUS is allowing those civil suits to go ahead in the Connecticut courts and the outcome is very unclear but currently there is no liability. If the Sandy Hook suits are successful it will almost certainly open the floodgates for other suits to be filed against other gunmakers. Defending the suits will be very expensive for Remington whether they win or lose. This might be a good time to sell the operating assets and let a new management company continue production. The current shareholders, the creditors, the Sandy Hook plaintiffs, the firearms industry, and we sportsmen all have a lot at stake.

There is much going on that only the insiders would know, and there are many moving parts. I am rooting for Remington to survive for another 200 years and for the firearms industry to survive the legal and political attacks. Obviously not everybody shares those sentiments.

Big Uncle is offline  
Old 07-31-2020, 12:23 PM
  #8  
Typical Buck
 
TN Lone Wolf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Martin, TN
Posts: 854
Default

"If you run an American gun company into bankruptcy during a pandemic where gun sales are through the roof, you shouldn’t be able to be C Suite at any company ever again." -Some guy on some website
TN Lone Wolf is offline  
Old 08-04-2020, 06:57 AM
  #9  
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
 
Nomercy448's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,898
Default

Of interest, Remington has notified the New York State Department of Labor Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification system that they may be laying off workers due to a plant closure in September. The notice claims all 717 of 717 total employees will be affected, and the workforce adjustment class is “possible plant closing/possible plant layoff.”

NY DoL WARN: Remington Notification if potential plant closure and layoffs

Searching the notification database for 2017 and 2018, there were no Remington notices on record for the previous bankruptcy filing - which largely makes sense, since the potential buyers were known.

Largely, this notification is assumed to be satisfying a requirement such they’re entering bankruptcy protection without an identified buyer, with expectation the company would fold in the next 60 days if a buoy isn’t found, either buyer or bailout.
Attached Thumbnails Remington Shoe Dropped-d689480d-d9e1-4d13-b622-4c71bab8eb13.jpeg  
Nomercy448 is offline  
Old 09-03-2020, 03:54 PM
  #10  
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
 
Nomercy448's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,898
Default

I neglected to share this last month, but I’ve not seen any update the last few weeks. Looks like the last workers present in the Remington Headquarters and manufacturing site in NY will be closing it’s doors, permanently under this ownership, as of Sept 29. I’ve not been able to find details, but some industry folks are pointing to an auction of Remington business components at the end of this month. What an amazing time - the entire world is on fire, and a 200 year old fire extinguisher company is closing.

Nomercy448 is offline  

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.