HuntingNet.com Forums

HuntingNet.com Forums (https://www.huntingnet.com/forum/)
-   Guns (https://www.huntingnet.com/forum/guns-10/)
-   -   How'd the debate die? CR vs. PF? Why dead? (https://www.huntingnet.com/forum/guns/390775-howd-debate-die-cr-vs-pf-why-dead.html)

Nomercy448 04-03-2014 08:52 AM

How'd the debate die? CR vs. PF? Why dead?
 
Why don't we see threads comparing controlled round feed and push feed anymore? Seems like about 10yrs ago there would be a thread on this every 3 days.

I'm bored today sitting on layover in Chicago for a few hours, not sure why it disappeared after being such a common thread. Not that I'm complaining about a recurring thread not coming around anymore, I guess I'm just surprised that this one was either "solved" or that nobody cares about it anymore.

Don't really see the 700 Sako extractor conversion topic much anymore either?

Not intending to restart the "debate", just curious as to why the debate went away?

(I'm a little curious whether it had to do with Winchester 70's nearly going away, so maybe the CR vs. PF debate - which was really always a Win 70 vs Rem 700 debate, since Ruger was CRPF and Savage wasn't as popular yet - went away because one of the players was off the table. Or maybe I'm just drawing at straws for that?)

salukipv1 04-03-2014 11:25 AM

CRF still seems like the goto for big bores...

Bullcamp82834 04-03-2014 12:35 PM

Let's crank it back up.
I like CRF rifles and own a few, but as to function and reliability they have nothing on my push feed rifles. That old saw about CRF being able to feed a cartridge while being held upside down , thereby making them superior as a DGR, holds no water. Every one of my PF rifles will also feed a cartridge upside down. For sure, I love the look of that claw extractor because I'm all into nostalgia but don't waste your breath telling me it's superior to say a Rem 700 action or a Weatherby Mark V when it comes to reliability, strength, or accuracy. It just isn't so.

Nomercy448 04-03-2014 12:58 PM

I'm in the camp that owns a mix of feed types. My only complaint with any of them EVER was the need to feed from magazine ONLY in CRF's, after breaking an old unmodified Mauser extractor by dropping rounds in the chamber and ramming it home. Winchester and Ruger remedied that issue in their actions to produce "CRPF's".

I'm mostly just curious as to why nobody seems to talk about it anymore other than in the context of DGR's? Or why was it ever such a hot-button issue in the first place?

Did guys really realize it didn't ever matter, or was it always just another chance to have a Mauser/Winchester 70 vs. Remington 700 debate?

Part of what reminded me of it was a recent question on here about sights mounted on Larry Potterfield's "Nearly Perfect Safari Rifle". Bored at the airport, I watched a bunch of the videos about building that particular rifle (guess I'm kinda a sucker for Larry's videos, even if he's kinda a dork :p). In the video, Larry pointed out that he chose the 700 because he likes the 700, even though PF's aren't favored for DGR's.

So that reminded me - man, I haven't heard anyone talk CRF vs. PF vs. CRPF for a LONG time, and we used to beat that particular dead horse so much that we had to buy replacements!

Bullcamp82834 04-03-2014 03:53 PM

All true.
And just for what it's worth the most accurate rifles I have owned have all been push feeds.
Rem 700s, Weatherby Mark Vs, and one amazing Browning A Bolt.
Coincidence?
Maybe.
But that's my experience.

Big Uncle 04-04-2014 07:51 AM

I have compromised. Rifles used for bigger game, or critters that might upset my retirement plans, are CRF models. Rifles that have to hit small targets are PF.

My rifles chambered in .338 WM and up are mostly CRF. Most of the rifles chambered for lighter cartridges are PF. A fair number of my PF rifles end up with aftermarket barrels, etc., but normally I don't do this with the CRF models.

For the most part I don't think it really matters as they function about the same. Just habit I guess.

I have heard African PH's laughing about Americans with their cheap PF rifles, but these same guys fall to their knees in praise (or for other purposes) for the Europeans that show up with straight-pull Blaser rifles. You get a lot of that "if it is not made in Europe it is crap" attitude. I think this attitude plus the original Winchester salesman (JOC) are what drives most this issue.

homers brother 04-05-2014 02:38 PM

I tend not to place myself in positions where I might have to shoot upsidedown.

But I have both. I've never had a problem with PF. On the other hand, I've been annoyed a couple of times when my CRF varmint rifle faced one more vicious prairie dog than the magazine had rounds to service.

Now, floorplates on the other hand ... nothing's more exasperating than working the bolt over an open magazine. Well, except for snagging the lever on a No. 1 and ejecting a round into two feet of fresh snow somewhere.

Tundra10 04-05-2014 11:07 PM


Originally Posted by Nomercy448 (Post 4132416)
Not intending to restart the "debate", just curious as to why the debate went away?

Really........:lmao:

Nomercy448 04-07-2014 08:19 AM


Originally Posted by Tundra10 (Post 4132759)
Really........:lmao:

As surprising as it may sound, and as little as I expect some of the jaded members here to believe it, no, my intention wasn't to kick start a dead horse beating.

I'm really just curious as to what happened (I quit using hunting/shooting message boards for a time) that made it go away. I was always suspicious that it was really just a chevy vs. ford debate between the M70 and M700, rather than the actual merits of the CRF vs. PF, and observationally, when the M70 essentially disappeared, so did the debate, which reinforced to ME at least, that it wasn't ever about the action designs, but rather the common brand on either side of the fence.

But maybe I'm missing something? Was there some other reason why guys stopped caring about feed style? We still beat AR vs. bolt, 223 vs 22-250, 308 vs .30-06, etc etc into the ground, did CRF vs. PF get resolved, or just disappear?

flags 04-07-2014 09:16 AM

I've carried a Rem Model 700 Classic in 375 H&H Mag to Africa 5 times. I've also shot a 458 Lott built on a Rem Action. These are push feeds. I have never felt they were an issue when after heavy game in Africa. It has to be pointed out that if the first round is on target, then the ability to cycle the action isn't too vital. Only on a bungled shot or an encounter with a herd would lead to potential problems. The first is the fault of the shooter and the second is a very rare thing.

I've tried to make my 375 fail when cycling the bolt. I've even held it upside down and have never seen it fail. My Rems are very accurate and I know I can put the round where I need to put it. I personally wouldn't hesitate to hunt with a single shot as long as it is accurate. The CF vs. PF is an argument designed to sell rifles and it has very little to do with taking game in a hunting situation in today's world.

Both work. Both are dependable. Use whichever one is best for you.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:50 AM.


Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.