New member with a rifle grouping question
 

So I have an Elk hunt the second week of September, and like a total moron I choose to change the scope on the only rifle that I had...... I had just gotten a new rifle and figured that it wouldn't be an issue.

Here is my set-up and my question:
Browning X-bolt White Gold rifle in 7mm Rem mag.
Topped with a Swaro Z3 Ballistic turret scope, and the browning x bolt rings.

I may be jumping the gun with my concerns, but went shooting it for the first time last week and could not get better than a 8-10" group at 100yds (off a bench) I was using the Hornady Superformance SST in 154 & 162 Grains. I figured that something must be loose, but upon investigating I found nothing to be loose. I remounted the scope and now I have 5 new factory loads to try my next time out. Is it possible that the gun just doesn't like that round? My 5 new loads I have varied weight, and Velocity as much as I could find to see if there is a "sweet spot" with this rifle.

Is there anything else that I should be trying? I was shooting the other guns I took just fine, and never let the gun get hot...

This time when you go to the range start at 25 yards, then move to 50 yards.


By the time you get to 100 yards; if your still shooting 8"-10" groups, get somebody else to mount your scope for you ! LOL

Operator error? You checked scope bases too, right?

Bad scope/mounting??

Do you flinch when you shoot? does the kick seem harsh?

If so don't be afraid to check out some managed recoil loads, or shoot lighter bullet weights may help as well.


What state are you hunting with a sept rifle hunt?? sounds awesome!

By investigating and finding nothing loose, you meant to say that everything was torqued to manufacturer's specifications, right?

Unfortunately, backing up to 25 yards will probably give you the mathematical equivalent there of the groups you shot at 100 yards. From a diagnostic sense, one of two things is probably going on here: Either your torque specs are off and/or something else IS loose, or your sight picture is changing.

In nearly 35 years I've never found a lot of ammunition shoot that badly. I have seen some very well-worn Kalashnikovs with standard sights rival that group size, but I don't think that's what you're dealing with here, either?

Before I got too crazy trying to find a load that shoots better, I'd run back through your setup with a proper torque wrench. THEN - I'd make absolutely certain your sight-in platform is solid, whether it be a rest or sandbags. FINALLY - I'd make absolutely certain my point-of-aim was consistent from shot-to-shot.

guns do have tendacy to shoot different liads different, takes patience to find the right losd for the gun- twist rate of barrel can determine what bullet is best for your gun- browning 7 mag i had liked the remington 150 gr. real well,

It's hard for me to believe that if all screws are good and tight and there is nothing wrong with that scope then that gun shoots 8-10 inch groups...I've seen guns that would shoot 3-4 inch groups with one ammo and then get down under an inch and a half with another...Frankly if everything is tight then it sounds like you either got a bum scope or you are flinching...

True, you'll find variations. However, the fact we're talking 8-10" groups at 100 yards is well out of the norm in and of itself. Something's seriously wrong, and if it's not fixed, no amount of tinkering with different loads is going to change things.

If everything's tight and the sight picture isn't changing (i.e. flinching, etc.) this rifle needs to go back to the manufacturer. However, it being a Browning, I suspect it's NOT the rifle or the ammunition. It's far more likely to be the mount or the shooter until those two variables can be ruled out.

Thanks guys, I didn't have a torque wrench for verifing all the bolts, but used a small ratchet to make sure they were tight..... maybe I will check the specs and try again but the scope was mounted by a local gun shop, so i was looking for something obvious there.

I bought better targets with heavy bars to match the scope when aiming. I have gotten a few different loads to try, and was thinking about taking some stuff to help the bench be more steady. My setup is a caldwell Rock BR competition rest and sandbags for the rear. I am hoping it was me, and this weekend if I cannot get it started right i plan to remove the bench and go prone off the ground.

Salu,
My hunt is in Riondel BC, with Shadow Mtn. outfitters not the closest to home but some very cool looking area's and the hunt had some cool bonus opportunitys. Plus I really want a big Billy someday and may get to see some if the hunt goes well.

You say you were shooting the other guns just fine. What were they? Is the 7mm mag a heavier recoil than you're used to? Is the gun comfortable to shoot? Fits you well?


Take another shooter with you. Try each of the different 5 loads for a 2 round group each and compare the results .... if you both get large groups it's probably something about the gun, scope etc, and not the shooter(s).

Action bolts tight? Barrel clean? Not resting the barrel on anything?

Being summer time and all, how hot was it outside when you shot?

You try shooting when it's 90 outside you'll be lucky to hit a paper plate at 50 yards.

I've a rifle the best group its ever shot w/me or any one else is a 3 shot 2"w/ factory ammo, some of them missed an 18"sq at 50yd. Conversely I've a friend w/1 that's never shot over 4" or 8" from point of hold. W/that said, and you having by now rechecked all of the rings and mounts,I will suggest checking that the bbl and stock are either in full tight contact or having no contact. Also that the stock/action screws are tight. Some rifles just don't shoot well full floated.1 more thing, check the muzzle crown I know it is a new rifle but the right/wrong bump will do 1 in and cause just what you discribe

I had a brand new stainless/synthetic Ruger 77 that would shoot no better than 8-10 inch groups no matter what. I fought with Ruger about it and they told me it was acceptable. Thankfully, The gun shop gave me a full refund and sold me a different rifle. The owner said he would deal with Ruger himself. It may not happen often but once in a while factories let a lemon slip out the door.

Agreed. I've had rifles dislike a particular load and shoot 3 to 4 inch groups at 100 yards because of it. But 8 to 10 inch groups? Man that's got to either be a shooter or equipment problem there. I'll join the chorus. Recheck everything for tightness. Take someone else to the range with you that you know to be a good shooter.

Well I made it back out this morning...... What I found was that it is mostly operator error. I shot 5 different loads today, and while I did find one that the gun seemed to like the best (Federal 160Gr Nosler Accubond); I also learned that I am not doing my sequence quite right.

I got a 1.25" group at 200Yds that was about 5 inches Left and 4 inches high, then tried the rest of my options before tring to dial that load in (to make sure nothing was better). After I decided that this would be my best option, I began to adjust to get it right. I was getting fairly inconsistant groups (4-5inch's) at 200 until another shooter asked if I was trying any "cold Barrel" shots....... At this point I had one round of the perfered ammo left and had a group of about 15" at 300Yds with the 3 previous rounds. He told me to run a dry patch through and wait a few minutes then fire that round..... That one hit on the low corner of the bullseye at 300.

Guess my next question should be what do you guys do when sighting in a rifle as far as cleaning, or dry patching, or barrel rest between either shots or groups? I will have more of the same ammo next time out; and will be working on my mechanics with a pellet gun to help the shooter a little.... Any other tips?

Shoot 3-5 shots about 1 minute apart then let it cool.

What jeepkid said +1

Take your time settling in behind the gun.

One you have slowly squeezed the trigger, maintain your body position & make sure to follow through by keeping your crosshairs on the bullseye.

shooter,

If the scope and those rings were working OK in past, Maybe its the new rifle???

GONNA TELL YA MY X BOLT HATES HORNADEYS all said and done , i ended up with win power max , clipin clovers , couldnt be happier , nothin wrong with the hornadeys , but it just dont like em good luc on finding the right load :rock:ps dose sound like there is a little pilot error there oops :busted: