Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

Bless my wife' s heart, she surprized me today with a Glock 21 for my birthday! And not just any Glock 21, but the American Heroes Commemorative Edition Glock 21, with the Crest ot the NYPD and FDNY and " American Heroes - 9/11/2001" laser etched in the slide, which I' ve had my eye on for 6 months. Mine is #664 out of only 1000 made.

Anyway, I' ve been wanting another .45 for a while, and since Iowa has made pistols legal for deer, I' ve bee thinking of taking the Glock out deer hunting this year as a backup to my muzzleloader. Actually, the intent would be to use the pistol only if the perfect close-up shot presented itself. My question is, how effective would a .45ACP be at no more than 25 yards shooting CorBon +P hollow points on deer if shot in the vitals?

Anyway, I got to get to the range. The Glock is just begging me to put a couple boxes of ammo through her!

Thanks,

Mike

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

i don' t know anything about pistols really, but you have a great wife. Just wait till x-mas rolls around. i would have a wishlist started already

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

Your 45 will work fine at 25 yards with a good hollow point bullet!

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

Congrats Drift on a great pistol and even a greater wife. I have just bought a glock 21 also, I plan on carrying it deer hunting too, just for that special close-in shot on a slick head.

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

Shot a couple boxes through it today and I was surprised at how accurate it was. I will say that I need a lot more practice before I' ll feel confident enough to attempt a shot on an animal. The deer deserves at least that much. I haven' t done any serious pistol shooting since the Corps, so I' m definately a bit rusty. But I' ve got until January to re-hone my skills. Does anyone know if there is an NRA pistol coach in the eastern Iowa area, or know where I might find out?

I definately love the Glock 21. Of all the pistols I' ve had the pleasure of shooting, it is definately the one that fits me the best. I would say that it' s not a pistol for those with small hands, but it fits my large hands perfectly. I think I' m going to have a 3.5# trigger installed. The stock trigger is great for a " double action" trigger, but the 3.5# trigger would be much better, and for only $25 it' s a cheap but valuable upgrade.

As for ammo for deer, I was thinking about using CorBon 185gr+P JHP (this is also what I keep it loaded with for home defense), but any other suggestions on ammo selection would be welcome.

Mike

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

Your wife bought you a fine pistol; however, be VERY careful in using hot rodded ammo in any Glock .45 Caliber. Glock' s have partially unsupported chambers in .45 ACP. If you want to see what I mean, field strip your pistol and place a shell casing in the barrel. Notice how much of the bottom of the case is NOT supported by the chamber? This facilitates good feeding in the Glock, but it has also contributed to a large number of Kabooms in .45 caliber Glocks when people are using high pressured loads.

This is of no worry whatsoever with standard pressure factory loads. However, in both of my .45 Glocks (21 and 30); cases bulge excessively, to the point of separating when shooting +P loads.

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

Does the bulging happen even with factory +P loads using new brass?

I' ve heard that caution should be used reloading for the Glock 20 and 21. Particularly that one should examine and discard any bulged cases and that reloads using previously fired brass should be loaded to standard pressures only.

Mike

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

Yes. These are factory loaded rounds where the bulging occurs.

When I reload for my Glock .45 pistols, I stick with standard pressure loadings. I use 6g of Unique with 230g FMJ bullets. Accuracy is exceptional and cases last forever.

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

Hmm, then that' s definately something to take into consideration. I wonder then if in a standard loading a 230gr JHP would be better for improved penetration?

Mike

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

You also want to make sure that a hollow point will give you enough penetration. Off hand I don' t know the specs but I do have a buddy who hunts with a .44 mag and he uses solid cast bullets for the penetration. He contends that the .44 makes a big enough hole and the cast bullet gives plenty of penetration. I' ve had some of my factory .357 hollow points bounce off of plywood before even out of my rifle. But .38' s in a cast bullet went right through even out of the revolver.

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

I' ve never had a problem shooting +P' s out of a Glock, or +P+' s for that matter. Where the " problems" come in is when you shoot lead bullets or get a double charge. Also bullet setback is a problem. If you want to shoot lead through a Glock you need to get an aftermarket barrel. KKM makes one. They even make a 6" barrel for your 21 called the " Hunting Barrel" . Check here for further details....

http://www.glockmeister.com

http://www.glocktalk.com

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

TScott,

The issue with lead bullets was also something I was aware of because of the H&K USP .45 I used to own. Something about how the polygonal rifling doesn' t grip the bullet hard enough to force it to spin right away, which causes lead buildup right ahead of a chambered bullet. This buildup then causes the overpressure in the cartridge when fired and the inevitable " Ka-boom" .

Speaking of aftermarket barrels, I was lookin at the CorBon website and discovered the 400 CorBon conversion. For the Glock 21 all that is required is a barrel change to fire the necked down .45ACP rounds. What I wonder about is the stipulation in the Iowa game regs that require pistols to use straight-walled ammo.

Thanks for the links to the Glock websites.

Mike

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

TScottW99,

There are plenty of articles and pictures of blown up Glocks on the Internet in .45 caliber due to the unsupported chamber s in these barrels. I have both a Glock 21 and 30 and looking at the fired +P cases - quite frankly, it scared the crap out of me. I called Glock and they told me not to shoot +P ammo in them. Georgia Arms even goes so far as to put a sticker on their +P .45 ammo that says " These cartridges are not warranted for use in firearms with unsupported chambers or firearms which will fire out of battery." That is a nice way of saying " Glock" .

If you don' t believe that Glock' s go Kaboom with factory ammo - you should check out this page:
http://communities.prodigy.net/sport...glock-dir.html

9mm is another story. I am not aware of ANY Kabooms with 9mm Glocks. They use fully supported chambers and will handle plenty of +P and +P+ ammo.

If you really want to shoot +P or lead ammo in a Glock .45 Caliber, there are many good aftermarket barrels with fully supported chambers that will work great.

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

I know Dean' s page well. Been there several times. If you don' t feel comfortable shooting it then don' t.

" KaBooms" can happen in ANY gun, not just Glocks. I' ve seen pictures also, of Ruger Redhawks, Beretta 92' s, Sig 229' s, 1911' s etc... all with " KB" ' s. Like I said before a " KB" can happen with factory loads due to a double charge or bullet setback. Recently a Police Department had three " KB" ' s in one day [:o] shooting factory Federal ammo. I can' t figure out why they didn' t stop shooting after the second one......

I' ve never heard Glock say not to shoot +P' s but hey I really don' t talk to Glock alot ;) I will look around though, I just don' t see how it' s safe in a 9mm and not in a .45acp when the guns are designed the same. Not to mention the 10mm. Also the .357sig which is pretty much a 9mm+P+ bottlenecked.

As for the .400Corbon, Glockmeister also sales those.

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

If you take your Glock apart you will be surprised to see how much of the chamber is unsupported in the .45 ACP vs 9mm. The 9mm Glock chamberings are fully supported. That would account for the difference.

I understand that KBs can happen in all pistols. I do think Glock seems to have more REPORTED. I am not a Glock basher in the least, as I have owned quite a few of them and still own 2. However, I am very cautious with what ammo I feed them.

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

Well I just got off the phone with Glock and spoke to Steve. He stated that for warranty purposes the ammo you shoot must meet Nato and or SAMMI specs and +P and +P+ do not met those specs. I was asking in regards to the #21 and he stated that this was with all models.


They don' t advise against it, but say it can void your warranty if you are shooting it.......

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

Check Iowa' s regs, im not sure if they' ll let you carry automatic handguns. I would check.

slayer

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

The only restriction on the type of handgun is the minimum 4" bbl length and minimum caliber. Sometimes Iowa regs are a little ambiguous. Notice how it says that " centerfire handgun .357 caliber or larger..." are legal, but later list the specific legal cartridges. Notice that they omit the .38 Special (not really a good choice anyway), even though the previous section say " .357 caliber or larger."

Mike

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

What is +P or +P+

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

As far as the exact definition of +P and +P+ I' m not sure. I do know that there are only certain specific cartridges that can have the " +P" designator. I know for sure that .45ACP, 9mm Parabellum, and .38 Special all can have the " +P" designator. I also know for sure that, according to the SAMMI guidelines, .40S&W can NOT be loaded to " +P" as it' s already a high pressure cartridge, so if you see a box of .40S&W labeled " +P" they are just doing it for marketing purposes.

Basically, the " +P" designates that the cartridge is loaded right up to the maximun allowable SAMMI pressure. The " +P+" isn' t actually a SAAMI term, but actually denotes that the cartridge is loaded hotter than the SAMMI pressure spec. From the reading I' ve done it seems the cartridge most commonly loaded to " +P+" is the 9mm Parabellum, and that most NATO spec and a lot of LEO 9mm is +P+. Somebody likely realized that the SAMMI pressure specs for 9mm Para. was too conservative in modern guns, or they are nuts enough to push the SAMMI envelope.

During my research I' ve also discovered that +P really isn' t all that necessary for the .45ACP, as the gains from the marginal increase in velocity are offset by the sizable increase in recoil and muzzleblast, and the higher velocity could cause the bullet to expand too rapidly and reduce penetration. According to many opinions, the heavy fat .45 bullets just don' t need the speed that the smaller, lighter .357 caliber bullets of the 9mm and .38sp. I think I' m going to just go with the premium standard pressure JHPs. There is also several months to the Late ML/handgun season, and I might just decide to save a little cash and buy a .357Mag revolver. I' ve been wanting to get a centerfire revolver for awhile anyway.

Mike

RE: Wife bought me a Glock 21! Backup deer gun?
 

If you' re interested in a 3.5# trigger, look no further than Lone Wolf Distributors. I just bought the 3.5# trigger connector for my Glock 19 and installed it myself in less than 5 min. Cost was $27 like you mentioned and it was an excellent mod to reduce trigger torque and resulted in increased accuracy.