getting your gun rights back after a class d felony dui
 

I know someone who got three DUIs in three years. There last one was 2001. They have been clean for just over a year and would like to get there right to hunt with a gun back. Is this even possible in Indiana. How hard is it and how can they get the right back.
I normaly would say a felon is a felon but i am not sure that if someone has had a few duis and now has stopped drink that there is still a just cause to keep there gun rights.
What do you think.

He'd need to contact an attorney in Indiana. Every states laws are different regarding the reinstatement of rights, but it's usually something that must be granted by the Governor. This can range from the Governor simply reinstating the rights to vote and keep arms, without dispensing with the felony record, all the way to requiring a full pardon. With your friend being so recently rehabilitated, I think that it's doubtful that the Governor of Indiana would grant such a request (because he could fall off the wagon and get popped again tomorrow, creating great embarrassment for the Governor). I knew a guy that got busted for arson as an 18 year old back in the mid-1970's. He and some buddies torched a farmers barn. No one was in the barn, and no one got hurt, but he got a felony beef for arson. The judge deferred the sentence and he never even stepped foot in a state prison, but he did loose his rights. Last I knew (in 2003), he was still trying to get the Governor to reinstate his rights after ten years of requesting consideration. He's never been in trouble with the law since, but he's not been granted his request.

Mike

Good advice
 

Contact an attorney in Indiana and his local law enforcement agency. If he lives inside the city limits then the local town/city police, if in the county residence, then the Sheriff's dept. They will have the answers he needs. I will tell you that it will TAKE TIME and any resistance to questions and or additude/anger whats-so ever will make it worse and or impossible to get his or her rights back. I'm all for reabilitaion for the right people that were wronged, but the system will weed out the ones that just do give a D***. Indiana laws are very tough for good reason.

The only real answer is to contact a lawyer and see what is possible and how it might be done.

Personally, I don't think it's a good idea for a felon to go to the police for advice on anything to do with guns. That could raise all kinds of red flags and that's the last thing he needs. I'd say pay for advice from a lawyer so the matter can remain private, even if the answer is that it's a no-go.

On the face of it, I'd say he's going to have a very uphill battle at this point. IMO, being sober for just over a year isn't going to impress many in law enforcement or the judiciary after 3 DWIs. One is bad, two is really, really bad, but three . . .

And that's assuming he supply convincing evidence that he is, in fact, sober and has remained so. If he hasn't been documenting every treatment session, AA meeting, or whatever, he should start as certainly that will come into question at some point.

Grouse

You asked the question "what do you think" so I'll tell you. As the offspring of a severe alcoholic I hope not. If it where once or maybe even twice I'd say have him contact an attorney. But 3 dui's in 3 years? Thats habitual. I know they say rehab works but in my opinion it just doesn't work. I know I'm gonna get razzed for this post but even though we have one heck a stupid governor here in Indiana, I'm hoping that even he'd say no. IMO, once an adict always an adict.

I would tell you're friend that if he really wants them back then he should go see an attorney and see if its possible.

Better learn how to shoot a bow IMO. First time F me, second time F you... Should have learned the first time.

IMO, and this may seem a little harsh, but I don't think he deserves his gun rights back. If he's that irresponsible that he's going to repeatedly get behind the wheel while drunk and endanger you, your family, and everyone else on the roads lives... then he isn't responsible enough to be trusted with a firearm. He's had his chances to grow up and act like an adult and he failed.

You hit the nail on the head. I was gonna say "What I think is that he's an alcoholic." It can be beat, but the odds aren't good. I don't want to be within gun range of him when I'm in the field.

3 dewis in 3 years..wow

if it cases were deferred is his only chance..my buddy had a felony ..got deferred, thought he was a felon forever, even told the army that when he in listed..he tried fer helicopter tech and got denied cause he told the army he was a felon..come to find out, we went in to the gun store and the fbi let him have a pistol!!! so now i told him to re-apply fer copter skool...we will see..btw, he served 2 tours in Afghanistan and is currently serving in Germany..

an addict is an addict..but some people just have fun for awhile before they realize how dumb it is/was/can be, and move on to lead better lives...OZZY OZBORNE fer example...he is as fried as it gets..but he doesnt/hasnt used drugs in a long time..and tries to be a good person..go ozzy

i have a friend?? i have said that before...
i think a sling shot would be fair for 10 years of no drinking. then we will talk.

Good luck having a felony and getting your gun rights back.

There are plenty of felons out there who should have gun rights, ie their crime has nothing to do with violence or a weapon.

I 2nd the learn to shoot a bow and in your friends lifetime perhaps something will happen to allow him his gun rights back, but it sounds very bleak.

Would probably be easier for him to get pardoned than get his gun rights back.

Also sure having your gun rights in your home state reinstated would be great, but what good is going through all that trouble and then not being able to travel across this country or to another state to hunt?

Tell him to get on the NRA's back about this issue.

I have a feeling people could care less about whether or not a felon should get his gun rights back, whether right or wrong.

Personally I think it's going to take a wealthy felon to get mauled while hunting, or a victim of violence to his home/family to sue the gov't and say they're liable since they prevented him the right to protect himself and his family and of course win the case!

I wonder about all these "sexting" cases etc...if maybe they'll shed some light on this issue.

Ok... I hope I'm missunderstanding you here. You want the NRA to start backing felons having guns???

I think if the NRA made this an issue, it might get accomplished, without them I'm not sure any felons will ever be able to once again own a firearm, aside from the instance I suggest of an individual sueing the federal gov't and winning.

Of course the idea of a large organization like the NRA trying to help certain felons get their gun rights back is far from PC, so I doubt they'd ever take on such an issue instead they'll just keep trying to drum up new members. I wonder how many felons would join the NRA if they heard the NRA was on their side? talk about an increase to membership....course I'm sure many NRA members would probably cancel their membership once they heard the NRA was trying to get felons gun rights back.

If you're a felon and can't own a firearm anyway, why would you even bother joining the NRA? ie you could never own a firearm again legally, so what would it matter to you if no one else could either?

I know a guy who got his rights back after 20 years. Of coarse he didnt loose his to dui felony, but rather fishing with explosives lol. It took a lawyer and a pardon for him to get his rights back though.

Ok, now that I understand what you are saying, could please explain why? I mean I don't think that anyone should ever loose their rights to arms for reasons that aren't just. I belong to the NRA and the Indiana State Rifle and Pistol Association because of this. But to me there is a certain line that no one should ever cross and in most cases those people who have committed felony crimes are exactly the type of people I wouldn't want having guns because they have crossed that line. Much as in same light I don't agree with someone who is extremely mentally disturbed should possess a firearm. I agree that people can rehabilitate but I'm still warry of this. My worry is also that once you start giving gun rights back to non-violent felony offenders the violent felony offenders will have a legal precidence to get them as well (not that they won't get guns with out them, we all know they will).

Please don't think that I'm trying to offend you or call you out in anyway. I am simply asking you to explain your logic because our logics seem to differ extremely and I like to understand all sides on an issue.

I agree, "most" felons probably are the exact types you don't want to own a firearm, my problem is, a felony can cover such a broad spectrum.

well maybe not most, but the violent, weapon related crime types should be felons who shouldn't own a firearm.

Seems nowadays everyone wants to try kids as adults, and personally just because you're 18 doesn't mean you're an adult I feel, sure some kids who are 16 have more life experience probably than some who are 30, that's essentially my point, these naive kids living in suburbia might be over 18, but hardly streetwise or an adult.

I guess it's a small percentage but none the less it exists and just makes me angry, ie a good kid, never been in trouble in his life, happens to be over 18 and the first mistake they make happens to make them a felon, and therefore can never own a gun again. So you have in my mind a good person who made one mistake in their life and now can no longer gun hunt or own a firearm for some totally unrelated crime essentially. I guess its the punishment doesn't fit the crime sorta thing.

There are quite a few states (and I believe IN is one of them if I recall) that a fellon may not own a bow or Muzzleloader in either.

The definition of a 'firearm' or 'weapon' per state law varies quite naturally from state to state. Frequently there are clauses which directly prohibit felons from owning any time of 'projectile' weapon at all. Doesn't mean he can't go buy one, because who would know but him.... but he best not be caught with it.

FWIW....

I sell and deal in firearms and archery for a living.

I had a guy who messed up when he was younger come in and want to buy a handgun. He'd been busted 15 years ago for assault and battery or something like that.... he was young... and he kinda got rail-roaded.

As he put it, and he checked with his PO and his lawyer, that you are eligible to petition the courts for your rights back after 7 years of a clean record after the end of your probation. Something like that.

He wanted to buy a firearm, and I told him straight up that I had no problem with him filling out the paperwork, but for his sake, he best make damn sure he was right. And he was.

hire a lawyer and be ready to be denied several times before being approved.

I totally agree with you. There are cases where the punishment doesn't fit the crime. I would consider those to be cases where it should be possible, but I still feel that if we do allow those (sadly exceeding more numerous) cases where the punishment does not fit the crime get their rights back for firearms then it just gives those people where the punishment doesn't fit the crime in the other directions (too light of punishment) and others a way to get theres. We've gotten off on a tangent here. In this case, I think the punishment does fit the crime and its therefore ok with me that a person who has 3 dui in 3 years cannot own or possess a firearm.

I hear ya with the multiple offenses and agree, least here in IL it use to be you would get 1 dui and after that your lawyer would've taught you how to avoid getting another, certainly after 2 getting a 3rd should be pretty darn tough. Anyone I ever talked to who "got" a dui typically beat it by not blowing, actually everyone I've talked to who did not blow, beat it, vs. everyone who blew was convicted.


I think a kid, ie young adult who has 1 mark on his record in his entire life when he's 19, and is now 30+ without another mark shows you what kind of person you were dealing with. Not everyone who gets caught/convicted of something is a career criminal who has been committing crimes for years and just hasn't been caught. People make dumb mistakes and get a serious shot of reality and learn from their mistakes.

But I suppose a laws a law and regardless of how/why you break it, too bad, and you can always bowhunt...least for now that is, and carry pepper spray perhaps for those big bears or intruders?

Its kind of strange that alot of you feel that a person with three DWI should be barred from owning a firearm forever when you consider that DWI are completely unrelated to firearm safety. What are the chances that this guy would go on a drunken rampage and injure someone with a gun? The fact is that this idiot will most likely kill someone or many people by driving a car while drunk and HE WILL get his driving license back. Everyone is willing to give these idiots a second chance to drive again, a potential weapon much deadlier than any gun and a mere privilege not a right, yet mention firearms even among gun owners and its no mercy whatsoever. Support for such double standards will only hurt all of us. Pretty soon a parking ticket will prohibit you from owning a gun if we continue along the current status quo. How many felons are driving tractor trailers? Who would propose prohibiting such behavior unless it had something to do with driving?Just think the same logic should be applied to firearms. Geez, a drunken nut case standing on the observation deck at the Empire state building with a handful of marbles is far more dangerous than this guy with a deer rifle but they haven't instituted a nics check at the entranceway yet. Just an opinion.

[quote=nyorange;3518986]Pretty soon a parking ticket will prohibit you from owning a gun if we continue along the current status quo. [quote]

Not likely.

3 DUIs in one year? What an extraordinary example of self-control and discipline, not to mention respect for the law. And you wish this person to retain firearms?

The headline reads, "The victim had been arrested three times last year for DUI. Law enforcement officials have yet to rule his gunshot death as a suicide or as accidental."

Years back, a friend's teenage son and a buddy decided to tie one on while the parents were away. Oh, and go hunting the next morning. Somewhere in the drunken stupor, the buddy shot my friend's son in the head with a hunting rifle. He, of course, died.

Nah, but alcohol is only dangerous if you drive.

Think again.

" DUIs in one year? What an extraordinary example of self-control and discipline, not to mention respect for the law. And you wish this person to retain firearms?"

No, but I do not wish them to be barred forever from owning one without proof that they will forever be a danger.

"Somewhere in the drunken stupor, the buddy shot my friend's son in the head with a hunting rifle. He, of course, died."

There will be always be a sob story, but you can't make law on an individual basis. You should also realize that the tragedy you mentioned would of still happened. Millions of gun owning and non gun owning idiots get drunk everyday and they are not prohibited from owning firearms. Barring some guy from owning a firearm "forever" because of a DWI will not make us safer and will certainly not stop tragedies like the one you mentioned. Your friend's son died because they got drunk and did something stupid, he could have just as easily been pushed off a roof by his drunk friend. The point is it had nothing to do with the gun but the behavior. Barring firearm ownership "forever" for a dwi wouldn't have prevented the tragedy.Lots of drunks in the world who never had a DWI or run in with the law.

"Nah, but alcohol is only dangerous if you drive".

Likewise, it is not only dangerous when you own a gun and I am 100% certain that your friend's son's buddy is still driving a car. Why do we allow him to drive a car, where there is a much greater statistical chance that he will hurt someone again,yet the world be damned if a DWI convict owns a gun?

"Think again."

Oh yeah, thats exactly what i thought. I was going to ask my doctor to take a few swigs before he operate on me this weekend since I thought it would be okay since he wouldn't be using a gun or driving a car but now I may reconsider that request. You can't eliminate danger and stupidity thru legislation.
And I obey laws because I have respect for other people and their safety which the laws only symbolize and guide us in doing, not because I respect the law in and of itself. My respect for the law ends when I no longer feel it is actually making anyone safer.

I believe its a matter of behavior. In VA you can't own a gun if you've been convicted of domestic abuse.
"Really your Honor, I wasn't going to kill her. Just wanted to smack her around a bit"
3 DUI's in 3 years means he was CAUGHT 3 TIMES. So how many times did he get away with it? Probably not enough to be sober to hunt, thats for sure.

nyorange... I agree with you that a car is just as deadly, if not deadlier than a gun. To be fair to those of us who apparently "support a major double standard" the person who started this thread didn't say anything about whether this person should or should not have his licence. If they had I would have answered them that he shouldn't be able to get his lincense back or any of privilage that would put him in a situation that is potentially dangerous to others. I personally don't drink just because my family caries "the gene" and I've seen what violent drunks are capable of. Because of this I agree with you though, its a complete double standard.

That's what it all boils down to - BEHAVIOR. This guys' behavior doesn't measure up. Not enough to drive again, not enough to possess firearms. And certainly not when there's an established PATTERN of behavior.

If your right to own firearms is THAT important to you, don't become a felon. Very simple.

Re read the post again and would like to apologize for the tone it started to take. All of you have good points and are entitled to your opinions. I would not want to see someone like that with a firearm, just think that maybe at sometime in the future he should have the option of at least attempting to regain his rights.
Anyway, off to the hunting grounds in about two hours. Expecting a light dusting of snow tommorow up[ near 3C in NY. Expect to fill the freezer with meat since I already got my buck. Best of luck to all.

I agree with those on the side of denying him reinstatement of rights. Folks really don't just get a felony rap by making a little "oops" mistake. Even if you do commit a low grade felony by "accident", 9 of 10 times you're going to be able to plead down to a misdemeanor if it's your first offense. This guy got popped for DUI THREE TIMES! That's no "whoops" mistake. This guy is obviously an alcoholic, which one reason in itself to question his fitness to possess a deadly weapon, but he also has established a history of EXTREMELY BAD JUDGEMENT! I can tell you that I've gone out and gotten pretty drunk in the past, but I've always had the presence of mind to pre-plan my ride home or to find a ride/call a cab. This guy obviously didn't care, and it's a miracle that he didn't kill somebody because I can assure you that he drove drunk far more times than he got caught for it. Give this guy back his rights to own a deadly weapon after only one year of supposed sobriety? I don't think so, and I very seriously doubt that any Judge or Governor will grant any such request at this point, and rightly so.

That said, I don't necessarily think that a person who commits a felony is always beyond redemption. If this guy had been stone cold sober for 10+ years, and had a number of sworn affidavits to that effect from those who know him, then I think that his request would be worthy of consideration and probably ought to be granted. But just one year sober? He could relapse tomorrow. Same goes for other non-violent felons. If you embezzled $50k from your employer, you're going to prison and will be a felon, and as a result of your demonstrated poor judgement/behavior you ought to lose your gun rights until you've had the time to prove that you're rehabilitated and that you're capable of sound judgement. Folks do change. Heck, I did a few things as a teenager that might have made me a felon, too. I was lucky not to get caught, but now I'm older and realize how stupid those choices were and don't do stuff like that anymore. The arsonist co-worker I mentioned before hasn't done anything since that one offense, which was 35 years ago. He's proven himself worthy of restored trust in my book, but one year isn't enough time after a felony beef to prove oneself trustworthy again IMO.

Mike

She does know how to use a bow.

Then she should be grateful.

After 8 yrs since his last dui I think he has shown signs that he can be rehabilitated. He has been sober for over a year and I think he can be mainstreamed. What are you going to do, take this guys drivers license and hunting license and fishing license and expect him to make something of his life without being a burden. Its been 8 years and he has paid his dues. I say give him another chance with certain limititations. I think we all have made some stupid decisions in life but we just didn't get caught, or at least I didn't. You grow up along the way so I say give him a chance. (Just my Judge Judy decision) :devil:

Bobby

[quote=homers brother;3519048][quote=nyorange;3518986]Pretty soon a parking ticket will prohibit you from owning a gun if we continue along the current status quo. If you reread the post it was 3 over a 3yr period, not 3 in 1 yr.

Bobby

I respect your opinion, and agree, to a degree. I'm not talking about drunken rampages. Alcoholics drink. Most drink every day, at all hours of the day. I'm not condemning them, I actually feel sorry for them. So here's the (likely) equation: alcoholic, drinking every day + loaded gun (I presume he's not buying it for a wall-hanger) + shooting the loaded gun = danger for anyone within range.

I would think at this point she should be more worried about her drivers license than a hunting license. Some places you cant have one without the other.

And maybe a job too, unless its at a bar.

I think the most glaring thing here is that the last DUI was in 2001... and it took 7 more years for her to go sober.

You can look at it a couple different ways....

1) Nothing has changed at all... and she just hasn't gotten caught.

2) She finally grew up or found religion or whatever.... but its still only been a year.

3) Maybe she changed after the first one and had some legitimate issues with addiction. I personally have trouble finding sympathy for such things, but everyone does make mistakes and to an extent I believe they deserve a second chance. Over time, with a proven record, trust can, in my opinion, be restored fully (or at least it should be).

Again though, the only glaring thing in my mind was that after 3 DUIs in 3 years she couldn't connect the dots and realize that she had a substance abuse problem. And knowing that, having only had a year pass.... I think we need to see at least another 6 years of sobriety before I'm buyin it.