planning a purchase
 

I' ve spent quite a bit of time at the range just target shooting and have been pretty happy with that. Recently, a friend who hunts gave me some venison to try (it was really good), so now I' m thinking of getting into hunting. I' ll be finishing college soon, and therefore settling down (in connecticut), so I' m planning most of my future firearm purchases. Here' s the plan so far:

.22 rifle: I' m not sure what brand, though I hear a lot of good things about the Ruger 10-22. It' ll be for target shooting and small game (rabbit).

Ruger Mini 14 Ranch Rifle: I wanted something good for plinking that used a .223 round (really cheap and common). The Mini 14 is more affordable than a G3, FN-FAL, AR-15, etc. (besides, a friend of mine has an AR-15 if I ever want to shoot one). It' s also very customizable which should make it a fun weapon. Someone suggested I use this (with hollow-point ammo) for deer hunting, but I' m not so sure it' s legal or that I want to pick tin out of my venison.

Deer Rifle: Not sure at all on this one. I' ve read a lot of posts on the forums and have done my own research. The most popular calibers I' ve seen have been the .243, .270, 30.06, and .308 Win. I' m looking for something that isn' t all that expensive to shoot and versatile (effective range, penetration, etc.). I' m not sure if I should go with a larger caliber because I' ll already have the .223, or what. Also, any other suggestions past caliber would be appreciated.

Thanks. :)

RE: planning a purchase
 

Welcome to the board Starboy.

You' ve got a lot of options on the deer rifle. Looking through these forums is a good first step. By now you' ve seen some of the endless debates on which caliber is best. Those threads border on religous arguements. The responses can mostly be translated to " I shoot XXX and I like it" . Nothing wrong with that, just doesn' t give the type of guidance you' re looking for.

My suggestion would be to ask yourself where you' re going to hunt. Will it be in the woods, open fields, power line clearings, etc. What distance are you likely to be shooting? I' ve read that most deer kills are taken under 200 years, while the average shot taken is around half again as much.

You really do have a lot of choices for deer hunting. Any of the calibers you mentioned would be sufficient. Some are a bit more flat-shooting, others can reach out and touch the deer a bit better than others. For instance, I' ve read that a .243 is sufficient out to around 200 yards, then other rounds are a better pick. I read that, its not from experience - not trying to offend .243 owners. The .270 has taken many deer, as has the 30-06, and the others you' ve mentioned. One that you didn' t mention is the 7mm-08. I don' t have one myself, but am tempted.

My advice would be that if you' ll be shooting at moderate ranges, don' t punish yourself with a big magnum. Entering the sport with something like a 7mm-08 or .243 lets you develop good habits without the fear of getting a recoil flinch. The standard .270 or the 30-06 have great ammo availability which leads to decent prices.

Stop by a few gun stores and shoulder a few rifles. Find a model that you' re comfortable with. If you have friends that hunt, maybe you can make a range trip with them. Give their rifle and caliber a try.

RE: planning a purchase
 

Welcome Starboy, All the calibers you mentioned are good deer cartridges.I prefer a little bigger then the 243 Win for deer.For all around use and a large selection in bullets the 30-06 might be a good choice for you.I hunt with a Remington M-700 in 270 or a Ruger M-77 in 7 mm Rem Mag.Both have laid several deer low.This year I' m switching to a Browning BAR ' Stalker" in 270.The Ruger Mini 14 is a well made and reliable rifle. It leaves allot to desired for accuracy. For general plinkling it' s fine. If you want a tack driver look else where.The Ruger 10-22 is one of the finest 22' s available. For the price you can' t beat it..
Ruger Redhawk

RE: planning a purchase
 

Does anyone have better recommendations for something that shoots a .223 other than the Mini 14? A friend of mine has an AR-15, and while it' s fun to shoot, it' s a little bulky. What got me with the Mini 14 range rifle was it' s smaller size (even smaller if you convert it to a pistol grip and collapsable stock), and I like the look (though looks aren' t a deal maker/breaker with me). However, if accuracy is that big of an issue, then I' m open to other ideas, as I' d like to use the .223 to it' s fullest potential.

I' m surprised to suddenly hear so much about the Mini 14' s accuracy problem. I' ve known about it (and know people who own them) for quite a while, and only the past couple days have I been hearing this.

RE: planning a purchase
 

Welcome to the forum Starboy . The one thing I wouldn' t do is reccomend a mini-14 , I have owned a couple and didn' t find them to be all that accurate .
Your choice on deer rifles were all fine in my opinion and there are a few more that you could consider like the 25-06 and 7mm-08 just to name a couple . I would look at all of them and if possible try as many of them as you can before making a decision .

RE: planning a purchase
 

The .243 Win is not a deer round. It was developed for varmints. Some people may be pissed off when they hear this, but it is true. For a deer round, I would choose the .257 Roberts, the .260 Rem or the 7mm-08 Rem.

They are all great deer rounds. This is the only area I have a lot of experience in, and I stand by my statement.

RE: planning a purchase
 

Seattlesetters,
Doesn' t matter what it was intended for but rather actually what is does. The 243 is an excellent deer round I don' t care if they originally thought it was going to be used to shoot flies.

Starboy,
If you know you are just going to hunt deer I' d go with the 243, but if you may ever get into hunting some other larger game get a 308 or 30-06.
Steer clear of the mini-14, rarely do you get one that is accurate. If accuracy is not a dire concern then go for it. You can take a deer up to 250 yds easy with any of the calibers you' ve mentioned(except the 223, I wouldn' t used that for deer as a beginner). One more thing, for the 22 you mentioned the ruger, excellent gun, but take a look at the Marlin 22' s as well, they have some nice guns.
Welcome and good luck.

RE: planning a purchase
 

I personally get the most satisfaction from shooting my hunting rifle. It usually pays off during the hunt.

The 30.06 probably has the greatest variety of factory loads available. It' s not too hard to shoot and will also take any North American game animal.

That being said - for just having fun you can' t beat a .22. Its cheap to shoot.

Take a Hunting Safety course that has both written and practical testing. It will make your shooting more safe and enjoyable.

RE: planning a purchase
 

I beg to differ with those who would say that a .243/6MM is not a deer caliber.
With good 100 grain bullets the .243/6MM will take ANY Whitetail from Mexico to Canada!
If I were out for a deer rifle I would opt for the 7MM/08! My deer guns are the 6MM Remington, .308 Win. and the 7MM Rem. magnum. (I have not seen either of these two calibers do anything to Whitetails that the .243/6MM could not have done!)
After shooting the 7MM/08 though, I' d say it is as close to a " perfect" deer caliber as you could get! It has more than enough power, flat, long range shooting and easy on the shoulder too!

RE: planning a purchase
 

Welcome Starboy! I' d have to say the Ruger 10-22 is a real buy. You can accurize it very affordably and do the work yourself, very user friendly. Vohlquartson, I,m sure I didn' t spell that right, makes a great trigger assembly for the 10-22. If you like bolt-actions you can get a .223 and the .308, both great calibers, in a Savage model 10fp. Very accurate out of the box plus this model now comes withe the new Accu-trigger. I' ve owned both calibers in this model and can honestly say they are fantastic! Click on the Savage site and check these out.;) You can adjust the trigger yourself down to 1.5lbs. and up to 6lbs. without the danger of accidental discharge. I think you' ll like the prices too. I love mine and both were bought before the trigger change. I' ve got both of them adusted down to a good hunting weight of 3.25lbs. and the safety is still usable.:)

RE: planning a purchase
 

Welcome Starboy,

All the calibers you mentioned will get the job done, but the one you didn' t mention the 7mm-08 has me real tempted too. From the articles about it and from the posts on here it' s ..." the perfect deer caliber" ( if that realy exists)

I can' t say enough good things about the Ruger 10-22 you wont be disapointed.

If the .223 dosen' t have to be a semi then there are lots of choices

RE: planning a purchase
 

All ive heard on the mini 14 has been negative. But i have no personal experience with one. The ruger 10/22 i love for a semi-auto .22. I have one and my brother HAD one, great accurate guns and a blast to plink and hunt with. For the calibers u mentioned (and some u didnt) they will all work well. If u ever plan on hunting anything larger than deer id opt for the 30-06 lots of loads available for it and ammo is cheap and the recoil isnt bad (not that it is in the above mentioned calibers). When u go for the deer gun or the .223 id look a http://www.savagearms.com www.remington.com or http://www.winchester-guns.com i think these links are correct.

RE: planning a purchase
 

starboy, as a fellow conneticut resident i must send out a word of adivce, don;t expect to use rifles for deer hunting unless you have private land, the entire state is shotgun/muzzleloader only. and as far as rifles go nothing larger than a 22LONG RIFLE is legal. i don;t know how this changes your options but i would personally get

one good shooting 22lr
one t/c encore with 12g slug barrel. and 50cal muzzleloader barrel. then you can buy any other barrel you want in case you plan on hunting other areas. get your 223 barrel for shootin, your midsize deer barrel,

as soon as my tax refund comes in thats what i;m gettin:D
and another good thing about using this setup, you only change barrels the rifle stays the same, so you;ll be oh so familar with it,




where in CT are you? drop me a line maybe we can do some huntin/fishin

RE: planning a purchase
 

First, I do prefer a semi for the .223, which I know limits my options.

Pauly, I was looking over the laws again recently and I saw that. What a bummer. Is there really any private land to hunt on in CT anyway? I grew up there and I thought that all the non-industrialized areas were pretty much state parks or some such. As I am sure you know more about CT hunting laws than myself, do you know the laws about rabbit? Most of my rabbit hunting I was planning to have take place in my grandmother' s garden. She gets some really nasty rabbits with attitude tearing it up so I figured I' d kill two birds with one stone and handle the problem with the .22. This way, she gets rid of her pests, and I get rabbit. :)

So I need to get a shotgun instead? That' s a bummer too. Most of my target shooting was with pistols. I don' t know much about, or have too much experience with, rifles (except the AR-15 and a .22), but I have no experience at all with shotguns. What is a t/c encore and who makes it? Some combo deal with different barrels sounds like a (financially) reasonable idea.

Also, I' m not back in Connecticut yet. I will be in May. I' ll be somewhere in Windham/Tolland county (not totally sure where yet) for at least the first couple months. I' ll be working to get my teaching certification, so eventually I' ll be living wherever the job is. Though I hope to god it' s not Bridgeport or New Haven. :D

RE: planning a purchase
 

on hunting rabbits all you need is your small game license, season is usually from third sat in oct, to sometime in mid jan. squirrel goes to last day in feb. ya need atleast 500feet from an occupied building that is not your own to shoot, if ya don;t well check out bows, or good pellet rifle(althouhgh this is under the same area as rifles but are silent)

the t/c encore is made by thompson center, it;s a really good gun. it;s a single shot but everyone i know that owns one loves it. their around the same price as a good hunting rifle

i think the area your gonna be in has few good state forests around,

email me if ya got any more questions, i got IM too if ya catch me online

RE: planning a purchase
 

http://www.tcarms.com heres a link to the thompson center page.

RE: planning a purchase
 

I heard that it was legal to get supressor (not a silencer, but from what I gather it has the same effect) for a 10-22. My grandmother' s house isn' t 500 feet from another occupied building, but the direction I' d be shooting is clear more than 500 feet in at least a 160 degree arc. I figure with the supressor, I could take care of the rabbits and nobody would know. Would an air rifle work on a rabbit? I would think it would either just injure it or cause a really slow death (on a good shot).

As for bows, I don' t think I have the upper body strength to accurately handle one. I don' t have any experience with a bow also, so it would take me quite a while to get accustomed to one enough to use for hunting. And would an arrow be overkill on a rabbit?

Thanks for the info on the encore both of you. I' ll have to check it out. Were I to go with just a shotgun, any good recomendations there?

RE: planning a purchase
 

If u dont mind a single shot get a NEF (new england firearm) in 20 or 12 gauge. They are 85$ or less at wal-mart. i dont know much about pumps and semi autos sense ive never messed with one. But for rabbit hunting i just always used a 20 or 12 gauge nef.

RE: planning a purchase
 

Be sure to check out the 280 Remington. A GREAT all around caliber for all Noth American game.

RE: planning a purchase
 

I should mention, I don' t want to damage the pelts/hides so I don' t think I' d use a shotgun for small game. As for the deer, assuming it' s legal, I' m figuring my best bet would be to learn how to use a bow well and/or use a shotgun with slugs. The friend I mention in the first post uses shotguns with slugs and occasionally a muzzleloader.

I know I' m new to hunting, but I have to say, there are an insane amount of laws surrounding this. Pauly, CT laws are just plain crazy, I' ll have to go to law school just to fully understand them. Would I be better off getting a permit for MA or even the VT/NH region? :D

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Of course the .243 Win will take any deer from Canada to Mexico. I concur. It will also wound any deer from Canada to Mexico and anywhere in between. I' ve seen it with my own eyes far too many times to admit, and I care for the game I hunt far too much to do them the injustice of using a varmint round to hopefully try and kill them.

My aunt shot the crap out of deer with a .243 and never, ever lost one. My uncle, however, shot many deer with a .243 and I remember all too well trying to track those poor, doomed, wounded animals well past dark. I guess anyone who chooses to shoot the .243 Win must have the mindset that the coyotes have to eat, too. That must be it.

RE: planning a purchase
 

starboy using a 20 gauge ive never seen the pelts damaged unless it was a CLOSE shot. only time u would notice it is after u skin it and turn it upside down but u wont see it through the side with fur. I never could hit a running rabbit with my .22s so i had to take a shotgun along ;)

RE: planning a purchase
 

I don' t think I want to buy a 20 gauge, as I' d just use it for rabbit anyway. It seems like kind of an unnecessary expense. I' m thinking that with the bow, I can use it for rabbit and use it before firearms season for deer. With a careful enough shooting, I won' t have to worry too much about hide/pelt damage.

Oh, and I wasn' t planning on shooting moving rabbits. It wouldn' t be necessary. They just stand where they are and chew on whatever is growing in my grandmother' s garden. I hope that doesn' t count as baiting though, as I think it' s illegal in CT.

RE: planning a purchase
 

LOL starboy the laws do get a bit over the top, but the only thing thats kinda crazy is how the deer tags get let out, suppressors aren;t legal for hunting in ct, and a good quality pellet rifle will take out a rabbit, i use a benjamin sheridan 22cal, with some pointed pellets, the rifle is dead accurate and i;ve been practicing all winter (wooden matchsticks at 30ft),

vt is a great place to hunt, i lived there for a year, i;m thinking about makin a few trips up so i can hunt with my handgun, never been hunting in Nh, but i have hunted the northern region of ny alot, if your into good backwoods stuff, check out the adirondack park, lots of land good hunting, and great fishing. i;m really thinking about gettin my bow permit so i can hunt my back 40, i;ve got enough land back their for shotgun/muzzleloader but i;m a saftey conscience guy and their are a few too many houses for me to be comfortable...

honestly your best bet is to find a local gunstore, they;ll help you out and if they can;t they' ll send you somewhere that can. i personally try to stay away from kmart or wallmart except when theirs ammo sales, but they do have some good buys on guns too. they just don;t know their buttocks from the elbow on hunting

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What do you mean? Is that that lottery thing I read about because that makes absolutely no sense to me. I saw all the " zones" for hunting too and it' s just odd. There' s almost no hunting land and some of the zones are in really weird spots. For example, Area 18 is just a bit north of where I' m from (north of Willimantic) and I never have seen a deer there, not to mention there' s a lot of residential area.

I also lived in VT for a year (first year of college). Actually the first time I ever shot a firearm was there. A friend of mine and his father were hunters so we went camping and his dad took a .22 rifle. It was a lot of fun.

I' m going to look into the bow idea. I should have thought of this sooner, but a friend' s family owns an archery range (and I think shop, too). It' ll be a good opportunity to try out some bows and maybe go that route. Besides, bowhunters get a longer season. :D Any tips on that?

And thanks again for all the advice.

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RE: planning a purchase
 

I just ordered a NEF handirifle superlight in .223.. pretty neat, the poor man' s TC Encore kind of... you can get .22 hornet, .223, .243, 7mm-08, .308, 30-.06, .410, 20, 12 gauge, rifled shotgun barrels or smooth bore, even a .50 cal muzzleloading barrel. Extra barrels are cheap too, $58-$80 plus $10 shipping. The superlight is only 5 1/4 pounds and 35 1/2 inches long with a 20 inch barrel. Most barrels are 22 inches though.. The trigger is not supposed to be very good but the trigger can be lightened...

RE: planning a purchase
 

Let us know how it shoots when u reicive it, my friends .223 handi rifle had a 20' ' barrel and was pretty accurate.

RE: planning a purchase
 

Will do. I was going to get a Marlin 83TS but for the same price as a low end bolt action rim fire, you can get a centerfire. I still can' t believe it is shorter than my 10/22 with 18 1/2inch barrel. Of course, there is no receiver. The 22 inch optional barrels would still make it barely longer than the 10/22... Might be a nice first deer rifle for my one of my sons when they get older with an extra .243 barrel or something..

RE: planning a purchase
 

ive got a 22' ' barrel on my 30-06 and it dont weight much and kick isnt bad for a little gun, the 243 should be easy to shoot and a great first gun, or the 7mm-08 if they offer it. i dont know where my paper is to check for available barrels.

RE: planning a purchase
 

Here is a link to their website. They list all the barrels. I don' t see a 7mm -08 listed yet but people say it is coming..

http://www.hr1871.com/firearms/index.php?cat=4&subcat=7

RE: planning a purchase
 

STARBOY, i;ve been hunting now since i was allowed, and i honestly never shot anything more than a few squirrels with my bow, but this is the year i get my deer tags for it. and bowhunters do have alot more options than firearm hunters when it comes to land. check out your friend;s shop. they;ll set you up. me.. i;m comfortbable with using a recurve. this year i jsut got a longbow. i just like rustic stuff.

as for the lottery, yeah thats what i meant. i;m boggled myself. i;m just gettin regular non lottery muzzleloader and shotgun tags. and hopefully bow tags so i can hunt my back yard and a few other;s.