300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

I took a good friend to our 1,000 yard range yesterday. He is getting ready for a Wyoming deer hunt(2 weeks). He is a reloader and a fairly decent shot. He has a nice Browning rifle with a decent scope(Monarch UCC). He has his rifle shooting sub MOA at 100 yards. So he automatically extrapolated his accuracy to be under three inches at 300 yards?? Sounds right??

He was all over the place at 300. He was off the paper at 400. All he could do was blame the rifle. But when he got back to 100 he started clover leafing again.

I really do not have a question. I am just trying to point out that when you add distance to the equation, 100 yard accuracy is no big thing. I see a lot of guys post groups their rifle shoots at 100 yards. What I want to see is the group the rifle(and shooter) can print at 300 or 400 yards. Sub MOA is not very impressive at 100 yards. But it is at 400 yards(consistently). So come on guys, go out and shoot at 400 yards, and post those groups. Below is a 300 yard group from my Rock River. I shot the RR again yesterday at 200 yards(zero range), and this rifle was laying them in there. Tom.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

One thingI learned a long time agois that a load that shoots sub moa at 100 doesnt doesnt always equate to tight groups at longer ranges. In my case, I am not that big into tight groups but the rifle better shootto POA.

I just shot these last week at 500 yds with a.308 win, not the best that the rifle has shot, 96 degrees 5mph crosswind. Aiming point is the black dots. 5 shots on the left, 3 in the middle and 3 on the right. The 5 shot group was the last one shotand I totally blew a good group with the fifth shot. Oh well that's shootin, theyall wentunder moa.




Shot this 3 shot group with my 25-06 Cooper at 500yds recently. Point of aim is the middle of the cross. Measured slightly over 1 1/2 inches.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

Need to do more shooting. My Tikka shoots MOA out to 300 and further from my testing. These are from a couple years ago, if I get new ones I'll post them.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

My only question is how did you guys get the "powder burns" off you targets?:D

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

Ridge,
How did the scope fail the test? aren't there too many variables at 660 yards with 1 shot to determine if the click test was successful or not? Especially since the 2 shot group is under 2 inches at that range.
I'm not a long range shooter so I may be off here but i'm trying to understand

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

Here is a pic of a group from my 204 at 300 yards. This is 10 shots one after another. Thats the farthest ive ever shot.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

Here is what it dose with 5 shots at 100 yards. This was the same day as the other pic. I pulled on one of the shots because the guy next to me shot his 300 mag right as i was ready to fire.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

i dont have a range past 200yds right now...kinda stinks...


i do know that it takes some practice and a good shooter behind the rifle to make those longer range shots...ive taken groundhogs out to right about 350...ive missed alot more than ive hit...takes me a bit to get back into the groove of it...most guys think if they can shoot well at 100 and have a decent setup that they can do it....get them on the range looking at a target 100 or 200yds farther than theyve ever shot and they cant hit beans...

probably what happened with your buddy....a little time one the range would likely tune him up....

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

There is no doubt that range time is important. However I personally believe that equipment has a lot to do with it. Wth all the arguments lately I was hoping to see a lot of input from the Savage guys. However I realistically did not expect any. Tom.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

Back when I had a 500 yard range to practice on, my Browning 300 win mag would get 3 1/2" groups at 300 yards, and 5 3/4" groups at 400 yards with 180 grain accubonds. At 100 yards the win ballistic silvertip ammo had a better group than the accubond, but the groups with the silvertips opened up W I D E after that. With those i was getting about a 5" group at 250 yards and anything over 300 was all over the paper.

I also noticed that I couldn't get any consistant groups unless my barrel was nearly spotless and cold. That Browning is a particular creature, but it did well when I did my part.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

tom, no doubt, equipment has a ton to do with it....but a rifle shooting a 1" group at 100yds SHOULD print 2" at 200yds....? 3" at 300yds...?

i dont know...ive kinda always thought so though...im new to the "long range stuff" and im working slowly and learning what i can when i can and will work on equipment as i go. but to me if your hitting 1" left at 100yds you'll be hitting 2" left at 200yds?

once you got a rifle and scope setup and ammo that shoots decent, only thing left is the guy behind the rifle. not overly hard to setup a rifle to beable to shoot 1" groups or so at 100yds these days...

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

wish there was a place to shoot 200yds+ around here. hard enough to find 200yds.

100yd public semi nearby, ie 1hr,

200yd public, about 1hr30mins....

300yds plus.public ...doesnt exist .....

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

Hopefully one of these days in the next 2 weeks I'll get a day that the wind doesn't blow 30mph and I'll go do some 300 yard groups with a few of my firearms. One will be a Savage.....;)

Got a few new loads worked up for a few rifles before antelope/deer season rolls in.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

I wish what you are saying here was the truth. But it is far from the truth. There are a lot of variables with the equipment we use. The main reason of my post was to show that shooting is not so simple. Especially when you start to shoot at distances past 100 yards. Tom.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

No kidding!

I've helped a few guys get out of their comfort zones (100,200yds.) and one of the things I've noticed is guys who have good trigger form start jerking and pulling the trigger at 300 and beyond.

I've also noticed that a lot of guys shoot from rests every time out to the range and have confidence with it. What do they do in the field? You can't carry a Lead Sled into the mountains. I don't even consider that shooting. Your just looking through your sights and squeezing the trigger.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

In a vacuum i would say youmay be right (maybe). As you add distance though you add more varables. Forexample, from 0-200 yards you might have a crosswind of 6 MPH. out at 200 to400 the crosswind may be different (more or less) and then from 400-600 it may be different yet again. Additionally, the FPS is decreasing at a rate that is not exactly linear giving you another variable.
Those are just a few of the reasons why 100 = 1" then 600 = 6" is not reality

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

I don't profess to be a great shot. So...when I can shoot into a 6" (dessert) pie plate at 300 yds. off the hood of my truck using a rolled up blanket and a rear sand bag I am happy. I hunt. I don't compete. At 400 yds I need a 9" pie plate. But they are all in there. Off shooting sticks 300 yds seems to be my limit. I do this with both my guns. A 100 yd. sub-MOA Remington Mountain rifle in .280 and a MOA+ .257 Roberts Bullberry barrel on my Encore.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

If I see a deer at 500 yds, I'll drive within 300 yds, walk another 150, crawl another 75 and shoot hm in the neck with my .22 hornet. :D

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

here's my horrible savage 12bvss. it's only 100yds which is as far as my range allows.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

Hey Zrex,
So as youare passing the deer to get past it by 25 yardsdo you crawl under it or hop over it?:D

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

NM

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

He's part ground hog. He tunnels under it.

Tom

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

your math is wrong.
within 300 means theres 300 left, 150 walking leaves 150, 75 crawling leaves 75.
Was a joke anyway. or maybe not.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

Hey i took new math as a kid. It has screwed me up for life

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

I started wringing this Marlin XL7 in 270 Win out today. Not bad for a $289 rifle. I just pulled a couple of loads from a Hodgdon manual. I didnt load enough of the ones that shot well at 100yds so I didnt use them at 300 yds. But here is a factory load and a "run of the mill" handload.

I too figured more responses to this thread.........it's not hard fire 9 shots down range.;)

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

I can't wait to get out and shoot some more. When I do I'll make sure to post, no range but will be 'truck-hood' groups so don't expect amazing results.

RE: 300 yards, 400 yards?? group size.
 

How about a few of these shot with factory savage rifles?


First time at the range with new savage F/tr in 308 since have shot some very tight groups at 300 yds but still working on a perfect load for it.Took it to my first 600 yd match a couple week ago and shot a 4.57 in group with four 5-shot groups which wasn't good but not bad for the first time.


Next 300 yd with different rifle and loadN120 @ 69 grs and 250 sst



Tikka





I don't shoot these good groups all time,wish I could.These are justsome of my better groups. I do shoot a lot I am at the range at least one day a week with my shooting buddies.