Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Guys,

Looks like there a wealth of information in this group. This is my first post and I'm really looking forward to your input.

I have been a bowhunter most of my life and so I have one and only one rifle. It is a Ruger M77 in 30.06. I bought it new probably about 10 years ago. I have put a hundred rounds through it and it seems to be a pretty decent shooter.

I am interested in spending more time hunting with the rifle in the coming years and so I want to look at optimizing this setup. It is a factory rifle with no enhancements whatsoever. I have a 3-9 Burris signature scope on it.I am not the best shooter in the world buti seem to be able to get1.5 - 2.5" groups off a bench at 100 yds with factory ammo (Federal Prem. 165 BTSP) pretty consistently.

What things would you recommend that I do to improve the downrange accuracy and in what order would you prioritize them? Trigger? Bed? etc.?

I think as a shooter I would be capable of 200 - 250 yd shots on game. Is there any point in spending the $$ with a gunsmith given the current performance of the gun?

Thanks,
46r

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

You do not have a bad set up but I would not be happy with 1.5 - 2.5" groups. I would start by trying different ammo to see if you can get better and more consistent groups.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Sell the Ruger/Burris combo and source a Remmy/Leupold set up...

That'd be my first improvement to make, what can come from that is icing on the cake..........

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Just for the sake of discussion, I am going to keep the Ruger. I like the looks and the feel and it's probably a better shooter than me.

Thanks.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Does it have a tang safety or the 3-position safety???

The trigger on the tang safety can be safely adjusted down to 2 1/2 to 3 pounds, with no creep or over travel by a good gunsmith...Doing so will help with your groups as a heavy trigger that creeps before it fires hurts your grouping...

If it has the 3-position safety it is easier to remove and replace with an aftermarket safety, like a Timney...

New, these rifles are not free floated, I would leave it that way until you have tried at least 4 different factory loadings and see if there is one it likes (groups) best...

What stock does it have??? Wood or Synthetic???

Ruger produced some synthetic stocks with a narrow butt area and hollowed out butt stock...Those rascels kicked like a mule, not good for the shooter and you can develop a nice case of flinching....I had a buddy that had one in .270 and he finally got rid of it...If it does have this stock, I'd put an after market stock on it...

After shooting and finding out the potential of the gun, you might want to consider free floating the barrel, but I would wait until you have more time behind the gun before I did this...

It should group 3 shots into a inch and a half group at 100 yards, measuring the holes center to center...

I would also check the screws that hold the barrel and action to the stock, the front screw should be very tight, the rear two screws, snug...Tighten the front screw first...If you remove the barrel and action, this can affect groups and your sight in on the gun...

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

There is nothing wrong with that rifle. Rugers are fine guns. It should be capable of a little better groups than that, however. The first thing I would recommend is getting the trigger worked over. A pull in the neighborhood of 3 lbs. will help considerably. You may want to have the bedding checked by a good 'smith. Rugers are a little different with the recoil lug. I solid bed the actions on the Rugers and about 2' of the barrel. The rest of the barrel is free-floated. I'm sure others have done different things with them, but that's what has worked for me.
I don't know if you would be up for trying handloading, but that is probably the number one thing that will improve your gun, providing the bedding is satisfactory. A lot of off-the-shelf guns have benefitted greatly from the right combination handloads.
I'm pretty much a hard-core Leupold guy, but your Burris sounds like it's doing OK if the groups you are shooting aren't wild and all over the place.
Just a few things to think about.....Oh...And by the way.....Welcome to the forums!!!

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

As a Bow Hunter you know how important practice is. I would only do two things to start with. I would definitely have the trigger adjusted. I would buy lots of inexpensive ammo and practice. IF you have only shot 100 rounds in ten years-then IMO you need to practice with this rifle. Yourcartridge choice is great because you should be able to find some inexpensive import ammo for practice.

IMO your groups may be a bit large, but still more than acceptable for deer hunting out to 250 yards. It is not going to do you any good to spend a lot of money trying different ammo, until you feel more comfortable with the rifle. Get out and shoot it, just like your bow. Tom.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

I also wouldn't like 1.5-2.5" groups, though how you personally shoot can determine much of your groups.

I'd try 150gr, or 165, in a number of different factory loads....

IMO the '06 uses 150 or 180's, less it just happens to love 165grs

My .270 shots sub-moa at 100yds bench, Browning BAR. 130gr, not bad for factory ammo. It loves the 130grs, so that's what I give it.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Your bedding may or may not need work. First thing I would do is get a trigger job. If your M77 is anything like mine was it is horrible. And forget that earlier post. Mine was a 3 position safety and my gunsmith did an excellent job on my trigger. That alone improved accuracy. And while it is at the shop, ask him to check the bedding. He may be able to do it all in one visit if a bedding job is needed.
I had both done to my M77 and group size was cut in half.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Hawkeye,

It's got the 3 position safety anda walnut stock. It kicks but I don't find it uncomfortable. I will check those screws. And I seem to recall that when I first go t the gun I tried Remington ammo and Federal premium, and the feds shot better. I will get my hands on a few more loads and see what shoots best.

Thanks for the info. That's exactly what I was looking for.

46r

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

I too shoot a Ruger and the trigger is the #1 thing to change after you check your ammo. A lot of new ammo has come out int he last 10 years so take a look and see what you can find.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Man you guys are quick on the responses. I appreciate all of the info. Let me soak it up and do a little experimenting and I will let you know what I find.

46r

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Wellfirst i would clean out the gun real well.
Then i would definitly get a good stock on it.
And handloading can reallly help your accuracy and overall preformance but only get into that if your willing to spend alot of time and some money on it.
If you go with factory ammo i would recomend nosler ballistic tips or accubonds(i think federaluses them)
Even if you dont mind the recoil much a limbsaver recoil pad may increase your accuracy. You will notice to just be more confident with your shots.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Trigger job,glass bedding,Harris bi-pod and a set of FL reloading dies.Hook up with a buddy or some one who reloads and watch the groups shrink...................................Harold *My son has a MKII in 25-06 and it shoots no worse than 1/2" groups with just the horrendous trigger polished and set at 3lbs.Bear ,WT deer,Mulies and an elk have been at the recieving end[deep freeze!]

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Unbelievable just Unbelievable..Must not have bought a Remington in a while.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Another thing you might try is having someone else you know that is an accomplished rifleman shoot the gun and see what they get out of it for groups. Other than the trigger it may just be the loads and your shooting. If the gun can shoot theres no sense in spending money on a bed job. I would improve the trigger though if it's factory. A good cleaning would be advisable also. maybe some Jb bore paste for a good reaming, then try the different loads, cleaning it normally between different types of ammo.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Bobfm, What would constitute a good stock for this gun?

Thanks.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Great idea. Won't be hard to find someone who shoots better than me. ;-)Seriously, I will do that. I know a couple of good shooters who would probably help me out.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Another suggestion would be to only fire 3 rounds then let the barrel cool completely. BTW, the Ruger is a FINE rifle. I'm betting a good cleaning, trigger job and you'll be good to go. Good luck.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

This is good advice, as if you don't intend to handload for it the next best alternative is to find a load it really shoots well. The idea that you should replace the Ruger with a Remington (or any other brand) is nonsense. A Ruger is just as likely to produce acceptable accuracy as any other brand!

In actuality, a 1.5" group from a factory rifle right out of the box with factory ammo is pretty good!

IF you don't like the trigger pull, a good change would be an after-market trigger that you can adjust for a lighter, crisperslack and creep-free pull.

IF your rifle is shooting 1.5 MOA groups as is, with factory ammo, I don't believe I would fool with the bedding yet, until I see if I could find ammo it really likes. Better yet, a reasonable investment in reloading equipment would allow you to develop a custom load for your rifle that will shoot better than anything the factories produce.

(I have owned 10 Ruger rifles. All were No. 1's, except for one M77 in 7X57mm. EVERY ONE of these rifles shot MOA or better with NOTHING DONE to them except for having a scope put on! But I have never shot any factory ammo in any of them except the M77, and it would put Remington 175-grain loads into one ragged hole at 100 yards-no doubt this was a fluke! Factory ammo rarely shoots that well!!)

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

honestly im not to sure with ruger stocks but i do know that hogue makes stocks for ruger. On my M77 25-06 i have a custom stock so im not to sure. Listen to eldeguello's advice if your gonna take anyones advice you wanna take his.
good luck

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

the bestthing you can buy to improve the rifle is a box of bullets. then another box after you shoot the first one. then another box, and so on. it sounds like the set up isn't bad, so the best way to improve is to improve your shooting with lots of good practice.

as was said before, try some different types of ammo to see if the rifle likes any one kind over another. (all rifles will have a "favorite" ammo that they shoot more consistently well, and it is trial and error to find that kind for each rifle).

Another good idea to practice is to buy some snap caps. These are plastic fake cartridges that you load into the rifle and "shoot." What this does is get you used to squeezing the trigger smoothly and helps you avoid flinching as a reaction to pulling the trigger. Many people will flinch their upper body at the point of trigger pull because they are expecting to get hit with the recoil. This leads to pulling and missing shots. The snap caps allow you to dry fire (anywhere-basement, garage, etc.) with no blast to flinch for, so you get used to just squeezing the trigger and cycling the action, without bracing for the impact of the recoil. It may seem silly, but it absolutely works.

If you realy want to get deep into it, you can get the trigger adjusted to be about 3-3.5 pounds, or replace it with an aftermarket one, you can make sure the barrel is free floating so its not in contact with the stock, you can get a recoil pad to lessen the impact to your shoulder, thus decreasing the liklihood that you'll feel the need to flinch when shooting,you can get a barrel de-resonator todampen the barrel vibration,and more.

I'd spend my money on ammo and the snap caps.Mostly thereal shooting though.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

The very first thing I would do is bed it. A bedding kit from brownells cost $20 a good release agent and an evening you'll be set. Fill in all the holes with Modlers clay and spray everything you don't want bedding compound to stick to with the release agent. Brownells has that too but Pam cooking spray will work also. Definately have the trigger worked over. I wouldn't changethe stock as most Ruger Stocks look pretty nice unless it's one of those skinny black ugly things. Like the others said clean the barrel really good get all the copper and cabon out. that will likely help a lot in accuracy. I haven't bought factory ammo for 20 years. Reloading is the only way to go. If your not interested in purchasing reloading equipment make a friend that has a reloading outfit that knows what he is doing and start playing. After saying all this go to midways site and buy this book. There is a ton info in it.

"Accurizing the Factory Rifle" Book by M. L. McPherson[/align]Product #: 573735[/align]Status: Available[/align]Our price: $30.00 Sale![/align]

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

I agree to start with a good cleaning. Then get shooting with different loads. Personally I found the ruger MK77 to have triggers not to my liking out of the box so I would also look into either get some trigger work done by a component gunsmith or replace with an aftermarket. While bedding maybe in the future it certainly isn't something I would worry about at this stage and it may never be required.

I also agree that 1.5" groups out of the box performance with factory ammo is pretty good.A lot more common then some may have you think;).

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

WOW! MY...... HEAD......... HURTS!!!We have a winner with the "Buy a Remington comment":eek:
I haveseveral Rugers and they all shoot very well BUT I did do some stuff to them. First of all I freefloated the barrelson all of them. For some reason Ruger's barrels like to have room "to run" I general float the barrel to have .020 between the barrel and the foreend. This will help on yours foresure. You can save the money on a new stock by doing this yourself with a dowel and some 80 grit(to start)sandpaper.When you get the clearance you are looking for from the chamber to the end of the foreend. Finish sand andseal the barrel channel with a coat or two of clear polyeurothane or tru oil. This is important in anhunting rifle impaticular because of the elements which can cause your stock to shrink or swell.
Secondly I install aftermarket triggers on mine. I use Timney as they are easy to install yourself. My 22 250 has a 1.5 lb while my big rifles have 3 lbs. They are a bit pricey but worth every cent. I personally have never had a trigger done by a smith. Ihave shot a few and would take the Timney over them anyday.
Good luck!!

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

As has been said the first thing you should do is a thorough cleaning ensuring you get all the fouling powder and copper cleaned up. Then buy several boxes of cartridges in different weights and bullet types. Make sure that your rings and bases are tight. Then have someone else shoot your gun to see if they can do better. Then start looking at making changes to the gun. First change is a trigger job or a replacement, bringing your pull weight down from the factory lawyer trigger will do amazing things to your groups. As long as your happy with your stock I wouldn't touch it unless you absolutely have to. The most you may have to do is open up your barrel channel to free float the barrel, just make sure it is necessary first some guns like to have the pressure point others don't.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Actually, just did that the other day.......

New 20"Youth Model leftySPS twisted 1:9 1/4" .243 win....for the action.....

Sent the youth stock to a kid in Wyoming gratis........'cause I'm a generous guy.




Slammed it in a McMillan Sporter sourced in"as new condition"via the 'net, less any bedding, floating, lapped lugs, crown improvements,lappedrings or torqued stock bolts/scope screws...with a factory set 4 pound trigger.



To eval the barrel before an AI punch out, I grabbed some of my kids 85g TSX reloads and after a quicky bore sight @50 yards, punched a 3 shot1.197" at 150 yardswith the 4# trigger. Tweaked the trigger down to 1 3/4# and shot a .818".....

Probably busted a myth or two while at it................



Plan now is AI this tube, lap in the lugs, verify the crown,bed and float, M1 the Leupy 2X7, cerekote the metal to OD Green via Ultra Coatings Inc., DIY an OD green paint on the McMillan with Black webbing....and drive 85 X's hard via R15.

Am thinkin' it skookum as is, but after improvments,skoomum +P.....................

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

My wife uses Midol when it's her time of the month...

It do help some....................

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

I have done that but don't tell my hunting buddies.:D

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

I'm guessing this is good information, but I don't speak this language. Can anyone translate?

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Quick follow up... Thanks for all the advice. I did 2 things: trigger work, and shot several hundred rounds of Remington, Federal, Winchester and some handloads from a friend. My best groups have been less than 1". The worst groups are 1.25 - 1.5". I had a couple of fluke groups under 1/2" and I had an occassional flier that was out of my group by 2-3", but for the most part things stayed consistently between 1 and 1.5".

The one other thing that may have helped was that I went from sandbags to a bench rest. My plan is to have the barrel floated, have the recoil pad replaced and take a look at some basic handloading equipment.

By the way, remington ammo still shot poorly out of this rifle. Federal premium was the most consistent overall, and one handload that my friend put together gave me a couple of groups small enough that I had a couple of holes touching.

Thanks for your advice. I'm on my way.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

The best way to shrink your groups is to start reloading your own ammunition.Even a beginner at reloadingcould easily cut your groupswhen compared to factory ammunition. I recommend lookinginto an RCBS Rock Chucker reloading kit, get a Lymans reloading manual and have fun. Two of the keys to successful reloading are to use quality bullets and the right powder. With your 30-06 an excellent place to start would be Reloader 22 powder and Nosler bullets.

RE: Question on improving my factory rifle
 

Welcome to the forum Adirondack! I'm glad you could get this thing figured out. There's lots of good advice on this site - use it!