Costs of Protection
 

This post is an attempt to summarize the three posts that are going right now on protection.

For those of you that would "smoke the fool" or more sensibly "defend the castle", have you considered the costs of your response in such a situation.

I've read/heard/read/heard these tid bits. I've heard that if you are on the right, it will cost you between $10-$15k to defend yourself with no ability to recover expenses. If you are the wrong, upwards of $25k with potential jail time.

Don't go putting words in my mouth. I'm not saying that because of the costs don't arm/protect yourself. I'm just saying that no matter what side of the law you end up on you are going to pay through the nose.

It is also likely that they will confiscate every weapon you own again regardless of the situation. Then if you're on the right you'll need a lawyer to get them back.

Not a good place to be from my perspective.

Tom

RE: Costs of Protection
 

It all depends on if the prosecutor decides to prosecute you.

RE: Costs of Protection
 

This is a very serious subject and people that are in this situation should defend themselves if they are truly in imminent danger. 15-25 k and probably a lot of legal hassles is well worth it to me if I stay alive.

RE: Costs of Protection
 

It also depends on what state you live in. Fortunately there are more states that will not, and better yet, can not legally prosecute you for defending yourself or even others if you are in immediate danger of being the victim of a forceable fellony (murder, assault, rape, kidnapping, etc...)

RE: Costs of Protection
 

Screw that. If someone breaks into the house and threatens me or my family, I'll shoot first and ask questions later. If someone tries to prosecute me, take my guns away, and make me pay up a big chuck of money, all for defending my life, all of you will be hearing about me in the news, because that will be a long, drawn-out legal mess.

RE: Costs of Protection
 

Same way here!

RE: Costs of Protection
 

And Here!!!! My Wife, My Kids, and My life !!!!

RE: Costs of Protection
 

How much would you say my two kids are worth? My wife? Me? $15k to save just one of their lives is a bargain. As far as being wrong...don't be. If you shoot someone at night inside your own home, the chances are good that you won't even spend a night in jail. As long as there is no evidence present that strongly refutes your assertion of self-defense, the police will probably not even arrest you in most jurisdictions. They'll take your statement and the statements of any witnesses (the perp is dead, right?), they'll take pictures of the scene and collect any relevant evidence, and write it up as an apparent justifiable homicide. This will go to the local prosecutor who will review the evidence and police reports, and if he too is satisfied that there was no foul play on your part, he'll send it to a judge as a justifiable homicide and once the judge rules as such, you're good to go. You'll probably have to make a single court appearance at said hearing.

Granted, all jurisdictions are different, and the actual process may vary somewhat, but the only way you're going to spend any real time or money defending yourself in court is if the police do find evidence that suggests that your self-defense story is not true. Or if you are one of the really unlucky few who has a real anti-gun crusader of a DA.

Do you remember Hale DeMar? He was the guy from Wilmette, IL (a burb of Chicago) that shot a guy that had broken into his house twice in 24 hours. Remembering that Illinois, and the Chicago area especially, are among the most anti-gun jurisdictions in the U.S., he was NOT charged at all with the shooting itself. The only thing the city of Wilmette tried to get him on was his violation the city's handgun ban, which they eventually dropped after national pressure. He was represented by lawyers paid for by various pro-gun organizations, and the charge was a misdemenor that carried a $750 fine. He fought it as a matter of principle, and eventually won.

The point is that self-defense cases involving firearms happen all the time (about 2.5million times a year according to some studies). Most don't involve shots actually being fired, but those that do are usually handled administratively unless there is a good reason for the police to believe that circumstances were highly questionable. Remember, deadly force laws are necessarily vague because there can be no hard-and-fast rules for when deadly force is lawful or not. It's left to what a "reasonable person" would believe was necessary under what they PERCIEVED the threat to be. Most LEO's will give a law-abiding homeowner the benefit of the doubt.

All black helicopter paranoia aside...if someone enters your home with obvious ill intent, the moment you spend contemplating what a lawyer MIGHT do to you LATER, may give the perp just the time he needs to do what he IS going to do to you NOW. I'll take my chances with the legal system if it means that I'll get to see my kids grow up.

Mike

RE: Costs of Protection
 

Tried by 12 or carried by 6. Your decision.

RE: Costs of Protection
 

Most states allow lethal force for defense, however, most states WILL arrest you for it, and confiscate at minimum, the weapon that was used.
If you use a weapon more powerful than the weapon the person breaking in is threatening you with, most state will convict you. If you do not get a direct frontal shot, stab, most states will convict you.

I have a friend in MI, came home after a graveyard shift, was hit in the head and left for dead. He woke up and heard his wife screaming, he took a knife from the kitchen and found the burgler holding a gun to his wife and raping her... He killed the rapist... He is serving a 25 year sentence for murder, his life was not directly threatened at the time and he stabbed the rapist in the back.

His wife left him after he was convicted.

WA has the most liberal self defense laws that I know of. I have heard OK is even more liberal, but have no personal experience with it.

RE: Costs of Protection
 

hey whats money if your dead also i think if you were in the spot to defend yourself from a shooting if you went on TV and so on got it on the news you would properly get a phone call from the NRA wonting to donate one of there high price lawyers.

but the last thing i would think about is what will it cost me

RE: Costs of Protection
 

Check your state laws on victim compensation. If you shoot a burglar, you are a victim, not the burglar. Some states will comp you for expenses like civil litigation resulting from being a crime victim. Even if you don't have that, a lawyer is only marginally more expensive than a mortician, and you get to sign the check!

RE: Costs of Protection
 

"Don't go putting words in my mouth. I'm not saying that because of the costs don't arm/protect yourself. I'm just saying that no matter what side of the law you end up on you are going to pay through the nose."

This is wise counsel. But, actually, this depends to a great degree on the specific jurisdiction in which the event takes place. If your local judicial system is filled with milk-sop liberal judges and dominated by citizens of the same political bent who elect district attorneys of like mind, it is sure true enough!!

If, however, the local gentry are of the "castle" persuasion, who most likely would not vote to convict a person who has used reasonable force for what is a lawful act in that jurisdiction, local prosecutors are less likely to contemplate prosecuting that person. No DA wants to send a case to court that he knows is a loser beforehand!In this regard, it will be interesting to see what happens in the case of the shooter in Texas.

From what little I was able to gather about what happened (from the undoubtedly biased media!!) in that case, the reporterscertainly MADE IT SOUND like the "citizen" was the aggressor, and had made up his mind to KILL the two perps even before he made what seems a half-hearted attempt to apprehend them uninjured before opening fire! In addition, he personally does not appear to have been in much jeopardy himself before he went outside with his shotgun!

MOST jurisdictions will not countenance the use of deadly force to protect property, or to apprehend escaping felons if they are in fact fleeing the scene and not posing a threat while doing so. It used to be that way in Texas as well. Am I to understand that Texas has recently legalized the use of deadly force to protect property? How about to protect some other person's property?

RE: Costs of Protection
 

that's a whole new degree of F'ed up right there

RE: Costs of Protection
 

Come through the window, leave in a bag. I don't much concern myself with the consiquences of defending my family. If you break in my house your a threat, cause the two 100+ pound rots didn't dicourage you and would have to be dead. I love my Children more than freedom or money, so I would not gamble their health mental or physical hoping the persons breaking into my house or trying to carjack us won't hurt them.Men, Woman,Teenager an ethnic backgrounddoesn't matter, they will leave in a bag.

RE: Costs of Protection
 

Call me cynical, but this story doesn't jibe with me. First, he stabs the guy in the back while his wife was being "raped" and his wife shows her gratitude by dumping him? Sounds more like he came home early one day and surprised the back door man. I can't say I blame the guy, or that I would have done anything different. It just sounds like there's more to that story than you think.

RE: Costs of Protection
 

cost of protection 300 to 500 dollars for choice gun cost of ccp 100 bucks 10.00 of ammo surviving a robbery or something worst priceless. there is no cost to protecting yourself or family

RE: Costs of Protection
 

It has always been legal in Texas to protect even property with lethal force if the crime was taking place 'under the cover of darkness.'

I have been away from Texas for the past 3 years so that may have changed but about 35 years ago a friend of mine was involved in just such an instance and the property owner was absolved of all guilt. Believe it or not, he was rattling a guy's trash cans at night, the guy shot him (didn't kill him) and was cleared.

Another friend was shot (didn't kill him either) while cutting a corner, crossing a guys yard at 1am. He didn't know that the guy had recently been the victim of a burglary and thought the burglar had returned.

Texas historically has protected homeowners and their property.

RE: Costs of Protection
 

"Defense of property at night" is still alive and well in Texas. It may also apply to anyone you ask to watch your place for you, so it doesn't even have to be your property. Open carry has taken a beating there, but you can still get by with the "peaceable journey" exemption if you cross a county line.

RE: Costs of Protection
 

well if the bad guy is dead who is to say he was not armed he is dead he ant talkin

RE: Costs of Protection
 

Again. God bless Texas.

Tom

RE: Costs of Protection
 

I had 2 17yo kids try and break into my house. Once they saw the bsiness end of my 12 gauge, they didn't want to move any farther. I have a 1yo and a 7yo, and I wanted nothing more than to shoot the pricks in the chest...but I didn't. I instead crambed the barreel of my shotgun down ones throat, while I barked orders at the other. I am proud I kept myself from pulling the trigger, but don't think those guys left my house without somebruises to remember me by and some steel around their wrists.

RE: Costs of Protection
 

good job dam i think it wold take more from me not to pll the trigger then to pull it